To find this behaviour annoying and martyr like.

[stressedsister1]

My sister and I have been under a lot of strain recently.

She has mild learning difficulties and much of her behaviour I find very selfish, which I think is a combination of both the learning difficulties and her personality (I have an uncle who is very similar)

She always puts herself first, and will never go out of her way to do anything else for somebody unless it benefits her. Recently I have told her how upset I am by her selfish behaviour.

Her response to this has been acting so selfless, it actually comes across in my (probably unreasonable) opinion as acting like a martyr.

e.g. When she was sitting with the paper, I asked how long she would be. I would consider a typical answer "Don't worry, I'll only be 5 minutes" or something similar. Her response is "I haven't finished, but here, you can have it."

e.g. She was standing next to the bath in her towel (with the door open, don't ask me why!) It wasn't clear if she was about to get in, or had just gotten out, so I asked her. I would consider a typical answer "Sorry, I'm just about to get in, I'll be as quick as I can" or something similar. Her response is "I haven't had a bath yet, but you can go first."

I find this behaviour really annoying and martyr like.

When she says these things, it actually makes me feel bad and guilty, when I didn't intentionally do anything wrong. I am trying my best to get on with her, but she just makes me feel bad, as if I was taking advantage of her.

I don't think she is trying to upset me on purpose, actually I think she is trying to take on board what I said about her being selfish, and actually trying to make me happier. She is just going about it in a way that inadvertently upsets me.

I read your other thread. You sound very over involved with your sister & quite controlling. You're at home with your parents, she's not your responsibility. Let her make her own mistakes. If you don't want to be irritated by other people find a way to get the money you need to live independently.

Maybe she wasn't that bothered about reading the bloody paper. Sometimes I flick through while I'm putting off doing something else, if someone wanted it they could have it.

It sounds as is every little thing she does irritates. Fine, that happens but find some space.

If you asked me bout the paper I'd hand it over because I'd feel like you were waiting for it and I'd feel uncomfortable. Same with the bath.

But why would you do that? If you were reading a paper and 5 minutes from the end, why not just say so? Why hand it over whilst making a fuss and saying you actually wanted to read it but your needs are less important.

You know it will only make me feel bad and you feel good, like a martyr.

A wise friend tells me often when I'm in a rankle - you can't change other people, you can only change your reaction to them. That's why it's up to you to change - not because I'm being horrible, but because the only thing you have the power to change is that which is within you.

"My sister has been led to believe by my family that because she cannot help her behaviour, and therefore cannot change, it is me as the NT sibling who should be the only one seeking help, that I need to change."

But clearly she doesn't believe that, because according to your posts she did change her behaviour when you asked her to.

People are making practical suggestions.

I think you can't see the wood for the trees here. This is a very specific issue which quite clearly requires very clear and specific input from you. From her point of view, she's probably done what you asked and you're still not happy.

Even if her LDs are very mild, they will be hampering her social interactions to some extent, and you're asking something of her that's quite complex and nuanced.

You're asking her to correctly interpret the intent behind your questions (eg I want to read that paper at some point), figure out the appropriate balance between her own wants/needs and yours, and come up with a correctly presented response, all against a backdrop of you having told her that she was getting it very wrong before.

Why can't you say to her "Look, I'm delighted that you've made such an effort in response to what we talked about. It's great that we can air these things and make changes. But I feel that you're going a bit too far to try and make me happy. There's a balance here - let's see if we can both make some changes and find it." And then discuss some specific examples.

Because I'd feel like you were clock watching. What if I was 10 minutes? I just would feel uncomfortable. I'd let you have it. If I was wanting a ling soak in the bath I might be 29 mins I might be an hour - I'd offer to let you go first so I could take my time. As long as I wanted. Same with the paper. Can you see that?

But its not just me who needs to change. I accept that I do, but if I were to change, she would still be just as inappropriate in public.

She would still get upset when nobody shows up to her birthday party.

And because I want her to be happy, that makes me upset too.

No amount of changing I do will stop that happening.

I think if there is any choice in the matter you should not become her carer. It will make both of you miserable.

I agree with the others who say the problem is with you. You want to be "equal" sisters but you also want to tell her what to do and point out her character flaws. I would be horrified if someone told me I was selfish - who gave you the right to judge her. No wonder she is acting the way she is. It sounds like you need to grow up and start taking responsibility for your actions and feelings and stop getting so involved in your sisters.

stressedsister It sounds really frustrating for all of you. Are there any organisations in your area that you can approach ?

How old are you and do you work? Is there a way you could move out and get some distance for a while?

I'm guessing your DS is on the Autistic Spectrum somewhere perhaps?

It sounds like you are taking a lot of responsibility for her behaviour and trying to change her behaviour. Sadly, for anyone living with anyone who behaves in a way that is frustrating, inappropriate etc in order to stay sane ourselves we have to come to terms with the fact that we cant change that person.

There is Caring and there is Codependency and a big big blurry grey area in the middle.

Perhaps try and have a read about what Co-~Dependency is. There is a really good book called 'Codependent no More' by Melodie Beattie i think.

Lots of people in complicated family situations find themselves in enmeshed codependent relationships with family members, it's really common. It is possible to get healthy and be able to separate your emotions and feelings from those of your family member.

I hope you can get some clarity. Sorry if I was a bit harsh earlier. I know it's not easy having people say things we don't like hearing and being harsh. I have been flamed on here before but actually, it's helped me think through things and perhaps recognise where i have been wrong.

But none of those things are your problem.

I think you need to talk to someone... I think you've grown up being unable to have any outlet for the quite natural frustration of having a sibling who isn't NT and you've now got to the point where you're now experiencing that frustration with things that wouldn't be an issue if you felt listened to.

I think the counselling you mentioned earlier might be a good idea, or try looking into support for carers in your area.

YABU though - you asked her to do something, she's trying to do it and in the specific examples you gave, you were the one being unreasonable. Asking someone how long they'll be with the paper is when you strip it down a slightly less rude way of saying I want that paper, so she gave you it.

I also think you asked the wrong question about the bath, because again what you did was make it clear that you wanted a bath, so she tried to accommodate that - when really you wanted to know about the immersion heater, that's what you should have asked about.

If you've told her to be less selfish, of course she's going to do big over the top gestures, how else does she show you that she's trying?

Did you read my post where I said - the not thing you can change is what lies within you?

You can't change her. And sniping at her and moaning and being passive aggressive about baths and newspapers and engaging in character assassination about her behaviour won't make her change. It will make you bitter and resentful and make the situation worse

"My sister has been led to believe by my family that because she cannot help her behaviour, and therefore cannot change, it is me as the NT sibling who should be the only one seeking help, that I need to change."

But clearly she doesn't believe that, because according to your posts she did change her behaviour when you asked her to.

Yes, she is turning into an adult and realising that she does actually have more ability to change than she was led to believe.

She has always been, and still is, sheltered by my parents. They don't always give her the opportunity to be independent, and as a result she has become very dependent and needy, which is partly her LD, but more a result of my parents response to it.

They have a habit of doing things for her rather than let her try things out, make mistakes and learn.

As she is getting older she is beginning to assert her independence and realise she can make changes, but it will take time.

the whole family fynamic is unpleasant

THIS is your problem, OP, not your sister. Her behaviour is the most obvious and immediate issue, so of course it feels like that's the one to tackle. Butit's also easy to rage about her behaviour and how she should change, how she not make you feel certain ways, how she should conduct her romantic life, etc., etc., instead of tackling the real,big problem of the family dynamic.

And you might need to accept that it might never change. You need to accept your sister will probably never do, be, say, things the way you want or need or think she should. You are not rrsponsible for her, and she is not a child. Start thinking about yourself. Take responsibility for your own needs and feelings - and that might well mean distancing yourself. In fact, it does mean that. You will only make yourself more unhappy and keep failing if you insist on believing she can become who you want her to be - or that it is your responsibility to help her achieve that. She is who she is. You can't want her to be happy, you can secretly rail against her having SNs, being socially awkward, etc., but in the end, it's tough luck on you. Try accepting her.

Then that problem is between your sister and your parents. Really it is.

You sound put upon and martyr-ish yourself. And desperately unhappy. Is there no way you could move out?

Im guessing she has AS. She's 22 and attending university. She is not your responsibility and you will not be able to force her to behave appropriately in public. That's part of her condition. Stop obsessing over her. Let her (and your parents) get on with it. If you are treated unfairly at home, then work out a way to find the money and move out.

You can't stop her feeling upset, OP. everyone has to feel upset sometimes. By trying to manage her emotionally, you are trying to do everything for her in just the same way as your parents do everything for her practically. You have to allow her to feel her way to adulthood. Your family set up has clearly made you feel like she has to be managed and controlled and helped and told what to do, even her feelings. Time for you both to grow up and find a new dynamic.

I agree with the others who say the problem is with you. You want to be "equal" sisters but you also want to tell her what to do and point out her character flaws. I would be horrified if someone told me I was selfish - who gave you the right to judge her. No wonder she is acting the way she is. It sounds like you need to grow up and start taking responsibility for your actions and feelings and stop getting so involved in your sisters.

Not really, I'm just a very straight talking person. She was being selfish, so rather than hide it and pretend that she wasn't, I told her.

She is what she is. You can't change her. I don't know wht else to say to you than that. You can't accept the person she is and you want her to be different. She isn't. She is what she is.

I wouldn't like a friend if they didn't accept me as I was and wanted me to change to be what they thought I should be. Or a partner. Why should you get to decide that for your sister, if you see my drift. She is what she is and her way of being is just her way of being. If you don't like it, then step away. But to try to make her change is a foolish quest because it won't happen. And shouldn't happen

Well as someone who is rude "straight-talking" maybe you should be pointing out other people's personality failings.

And if you don't like the way your parents are dealing with her (but you're erm not doing that much better yourself) then MOVE OUT. Or at least butt out. Leave them to it.

You sound far too invested in her. Butt out. Leave her to it.

*shouldn't

You can't stop her feeling upset, OP. everyone has to feel upset sometimes. By trying to manage her emotionally, you are trying to do everything for her in just the same way as your parents do everything for her practically. You have to allow her to feel her way to adulthood. Your family set up has clearly made you feel like she has to be managed and controlled and helped and told what to do, even her feelings. Time for you both to grow up and find a new dynamic.

No but I just wish she would stopped doing the behaviours that made her and others upset. I know I can't stop them. But I wish I could as it would make up both happier.

stressedsister you sound like you are a real cheerleader for you Dsis and you love her very much. I do honestly think you need to get some perspective for yourself
first.

At this point there is not going to be any strategy or technique you can employ, there is not going to be a solution and no amount of examining what other people do/dont do etc is going to change the situation.

Step back, take some time for yourself and perhaps recognise your own part in the drama...then stop playing it. THEN go back to your sister, and support her in healthier clearer more productive way.

Don't feel bad, you are entitled to your own life too.