To not let this boy in my garden?

[strokey]

We live on a really nice estate with a green area just outside our house.

We have a large back garden with playground toys and other children often come into the garden to play with my children, there can be up to fifteen of them at one time

Last week there was an older boy that I didn't recognise who kept spitting (on the ground, not at the other children) I told him to stop, then I saw him doing it again and told him that he would have to go if he did it again, and that it was disgusting. So he does it again, and I told him to go. He called me a fat cunt (not too offensive Im a size 8)

The next day more children come around bit by bit. I kept the back gate locked so they had to knock on the door to come through the house. When this boy turned up again I said he couldn't come in because he was rude.

Most of them are around 5-6-7-8 (mine are 5 and 8) this boy is about 11, the other kids his age don't come in the garden, they stay out with their bikes and are allowed further away then just the green area outside.

Bit later a woman comes round, says she is his mum and he is really upset that hes being left out of the water fight. I explained why, and also said that it was only primary school kids in the garden, none of the older kids come in, and the boys of his age were still outside the communal area.
She said he has got ADHD or ASD (I dont know which) and prefers being with the little ones. I was going to say no sorry, he isn't coming in after that language, but as soon as she mentioned the special needs bit I got worried and caved and said he could come in. She said thanks and that it was horrible to see your child being left out and went off. I think its horrible to be called a cunt in your own garden by someone elses child, but I was too much of a wuss to say so.

By that point the kids were getting over excited with the water sprinkler and the garden was waterlogged, so I took the guns away and turned off the sprinkler. As I was putting it in the garage he followed me and grabbed one end of the hose and wouldn't let go cos he said he hadn't had a turn, I got it from him and rolled it up and put it away, by the time I got back to the garden he had the garden tap on and was flinging buckets of water around. I turned the tap off and he goes over to the sand and starts throwing it manically. He wasn't shouting but was totally out of control and carried on throwing the sand even though I kept saying stop.

I didn't want to chuck just him out so I said they all had to go home now. Yesterday we were out all day, but today they are back here. The boy hasn't turned up yet, but Im waiting for him to and Im just worried about what to say to his mother. She seemed very reasonable and I feel sorry for her, but am not prepared to have him over again. Just wonder if you think IABU. Gosh, sorry its so long

I used to do some work with children with SEN, and I did notice that one particular child with ADHD had problems around appropriate language. Lovely kid, but obviously repeated words, dirty jokes and so on he'd heard without having an idea of context. (No idea where he got them from because apparently his mum and GPs were lovely.)

If you wanted to, you could ask his mum to stay over and have a more formal arrangement for a playdate?

I wouldn't have him back. Mind you, I wouldn't have 15 kids in my garden in the first place. I guard my space jealously and only open it up occasionally.

Softly. No it doesn't mean you can't earn it's wrong but you may be overwhelmed by emotion and less able to control your responses. So the unfairness of the situation outweighs the need to be polite.
No justification - see any one of my numerous omg ds is such hardwork threads in special needs.

Softly, I can only answer that from a personal POV, and from long long ago as DS is now adult. ASDs are so varied that you can really only talk about individuals.
Depending on the level of understanding, you could spend a lot of time and energy teaching DS that x is wrong. So he gets it. He understands.
The problem is then if he hears Auntie H laughingly tell Uncle C to fuck off because he splashed her with water, he'd either get cross with Auntie for Being Bad, or start using 'Fuck off' to mean Go away. To anyone who was bothering him.
DS doesn't swear, but he'd react negatively to being disappointed, and he didn't distinguish according to age or sex of the person he was cross with.
He understood babies, and pre-speech toddlers as different life forms, but if a 6 year old hit him, or unexpectedly threw something at him, he'd respond in the same way, whether the attack came from a 6 or a 16 year old.
So some individuals can learn that fat cunt is unacceptable, it's the subtleties that are trickier.

I am a saint! :)

Id prefer just my two and a few more, but then others turn up and I don't want to say no. They have been no trouble, and there is loads of space, I do worry about someone snapping their neck on the trampoline and it being my fault.

Fifteen is the max though, not the norm

I'd definitely talk to her again and explain the situation properly. Explain that you aren't angry, but after two incidents you aren't comfortable supervising him so would she like to come with him next time - and have a coffee with you?

If you don't say anything to her now she won't be aware that he has behaved like this, she will just experience it as (yet another) rejection for her son.

You sound like a kind person OP, I hope you can work out a way to include this little lad. So many others won't bother.

X-posts sorry stupid wifi dropped out a couple of times!

Yanbu.
I realise this may not be a popular comment but my view on special needs is that they may explain behavior but they don't excuse it.
I don't think its up to you to entertain him, I can see its difficult for his mum but if I was his mum and knew what he had said and then how he had behaved I wouldn't expect him to be invited again.
If I were you I would, as calmly as possible, explain exactly what had happened.

Well you are of course perfectly within your rights to not have a child in your garden if you don't want.

I'd say if you don't want to cut him off then say that the mum has to be there too as you don't have the experience of how to deal with him.

Um redcaryellowcar you might want to read some of the this is my child campaign posts because of course SN excuses behaviours such as this. It doesn't mean you have to accept the behaviours in your own garden, but an explanation is an excuse - in that it isn't the fault of the child- surely?

In terms of swearing for conditions such as ADHD or ASD there is often a lack of impulse control and so a child will swear or lash out, even thought they may be very upset afterwards & know that it is wrong.

None of this means you have to have the child in your garden, or put up with swearing in front of your children, or deal with a child who had extra needs but it also doesn't mean that the child is 'bad' or being difficult. It does sound as if his mother is being rather optimistic in letting him play freely with other kids without closer adult supervision.

My son has Adhd and has a real thing for inappropriate language. It's particularly bad when his medication is wearing off. As a parent it is mortifying at times, he is 9 now but looks like a 6 or 7 year old. He has just learned the word cunt, I don't know where from but it has fast become his favourite word of the moment. I'm doing my best to minimise it but its difficult. I hear him often in his room shouting out swear words to himself almost like a vocal tick. It's my theory and I think there is some research to back this up that the shouting, swearing and contsant movement are a way of stimulating something that the brain is lacking. I have noticed when he gets like this his pupils become very fixed and dilated which suggests to me it is very much an abnormality in brain activity.
I think you have been very generous in allowing the boy to stay and play. Many parents worry that such children
will be a bad influence on theirs but in my experience most children are much more aware and accommodating than we realise. The children who are allowed to play with my ds seem to understand that he is different and don't swear because he does, they know it is inappropriate and often they will pull him up on it themselves which I am grateful for because I think ds learns more easily from his peers than he does from me, probably because he wants to fit in.

That said there are some people who would not want my ds around and whilst it makes me sad I respect their choice. It's one of the downsides of having a child with a SN and a particularly frowned upon one at that.

What Grumpla said

I think Ive really upset her now. He has been trying to come in for the last hour or so, and Ive been ignoring the front door, as I was mostly outside anyway. She has come around to the back garden and when I opened up she was almost crying but quite cross at the same time.

I couldn't bring myself to say "He called me a fat cut" so I just said I really hated the spitting and she said he couldn't help it. The whole time he was trying to force himself through the gate and past me, I tried to block him with my body but he was barging against me and he is bigger than Im used to, his mum didn't stop him and he got in eventually.

I realised when I was talking to her that I didn't want to sit and have coffee with her or have play dates with her son. He seemed totally unaware of the others, and didnt interact with them at all, just ran around like it was he was alone in a playground. I felt really uncomfortable about it.

She was talking to me the whole time and seemed really stressed out. She said Im excluding him and that I should stop letting the others in the garden if I wont let him in, as that makes him feel left out. I said I had to go in and shut the gate and would she call him back and she said "hes not a bloody dog" and went in to get him.

Hope that's the last Ill see of him

I really think you need to "bring yourself to say fat cunt" and tell her what he said. And either make it very clear that that is the end of the conversation and you want nothing to do with either of them, or make the rule that she needs to present on any occasion that he is on your premises.

On another note, be very careful about allowing so many children to play in your garden, especially if you have a trampoline. Are you supervising individual use of the trampoline? If not, and there is an accident, you could actually be held liable. Just a thought.

Actually now I think she is being a cheeky mare, she told you who you can and can't have in your garden and he barged past you onto your private property. Didnt she try to stop him? Just tell her what he called you!

I think his mother is very bloody cheeky. It is YOUR garden, and therefore YOUR over who goes in there! Whether the mother likes it or not!!

If I were you I would be all the more resolved in keeping him out now. She doesn't give a shit how you feel about it, so neither should you.

YOUR choice sorry...

I think this is unfortunate but you have tried hard to help and his mum has tried to get him involved with local kids.

Win some lose some. This woman needs to move on. It's sad but it is what it is.

Even ASD/ADHD children have to learn limits and boundaries. Unfortunately too many of their parents use their condition as an excuse for unacceptable behaviour.

This is unfortunate and it must be stressful and terrible for the mother, but I would really tell her about the fat cunt bit- she needs to know, because otherwise she'll feel that spitting maybe isn't that bad as it won't actually hurt you as such ifyswim?

She's a cheeky cow.

You've been a saint but next time just say "No. He's not coming in. He called me a fat cunt, he spits, he's out of control and he's not my responsibility nor welcome".

Frankly with an attitude like hers it makes me wonder how much of his behaviour is due to SN and how much is her making excuses for him.

I wonder if your local authority are running any activities for Disabled and SN kids? At the beginning of summer our LA sent a booklet with weekly supervised activities specifically for this demographic, arts and crafts, go karting etc..you had to book but it was all free of charge.
Something like this might be better for them both.

She sounds a bit odd and pushy. Best avoided I think. And learn to say no before you become the neighbourhood creche.