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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To not want my childminder to collect her child from a school...

249 replies

persimmon · 06/08/2013 22:18

.. about 5 miles away after she's collected my DS and her other mindees from their school? I can't figure out if I'm being mean. Basically, her child will start senior school in September. She applied to one outside the catchment and got in. CM doesn't want her child getting the bus, so is planning on driving to her child's school every day with all her mindees. The senior school is in a different place entirely and will involve a significant drive on busy main roads during school run time.

I just feel like we pay her to look after DS and don't want him stuck in a car for what could be almost an hour after school. Or is this normal for a CM to do?

OP posts:
Dayshiftdoris · 07/08/2013 08:25

The CM is a professional - yes?
This is her job - yes?

Then I would wonder how she will demonstrate the benefits of this journey to OFSTED and I assume she will be risk assessing it Wink

Whether its her child or not is irrelevant actually it impacts on all the children and its up to her, as a professional to be making decisions which consider the needs of all the children in her care.

Because 'home environment' or not they are a business offering professional childcare on registered premises. Parents pay for a service based on those principles.

Most CMs would switch schools when their own children did but then this is Secondary so there isn't much call for a CM.

For what it's worth I live 3 miles from school - it's 10mins midday & no traffic but after school it takes 30mins as we are near a secondary school & busy A road... If I go a different way it's much further and takes 25mins anyway!

I would change CM personally.

kinkyfuckery · 07/08/2013 08:27

What about parents who do a 5 mile school run with siblings in the car? Are they doing a substandard job too?

exoticfruits · 07/08/2013 08:34

A parent is completely different. A CM is doing a job and I would find one where my child wasn't in the car everyday.There are other childminders!
(On a completely different tack- nothing to do with OP - it would be much better for the DC to get a bus.)

fedupofnamechanging · 07/08/2013 08:35

Not certain, but I think the rules are slightly different for school age dc being offered after school care - are they still subject to ofsted?

exoticfruits · 07/08/2013 08:41

I would have thought that they were subject to Ofsted- I can't see long daily trips in the car, with no benefit to the DC, going down well.

SleepyFish · 07/08/2013 08:48

I'm a bit Hmm at the number of childminders who seem to go into the profession purely because it suits their personal circumstances.
The best childminders i know are older women with grown up children who do it because they enjoy it.
One of the childminders i know does it for the former reason and as well as numerous trips to and from nursery and school her mindees are then taken to the supermarket whilst she does her shopping and after that she'll have friends over for coffee whilst the kids amuse themselves. She freely admits she loves it as her mindees keep her own children amused so she doesn't have to.
I thought childminders were supposed to follow the early years education program, i have no idea how some of them manage it given how they spend their time.

Sirzy · 07/08/2013 08:53

Isn't that why people pick a childminder because they want a "home" environment rather than a more formal, structured one?

I didn't pick a childminder for DS because I didn't want that sort of environment, just like when he starts school I will use afterschool club instead. Parents have to decide which environment is better for their children but you can't complain about a childminder doing day to day tasks as for most that is the appeal of a childminder.

exoticfruits · 07/08/2013 08:58

I would expect my 11yr old to get a bus, therefore I don't see why her DCs can't.

Original poster
persimmon · 07/08/2013 09:01

Thanks for all your replies - lots of food for thought.

OP posts:
AcrylicPlexiglass · 07/08/2013 09:06

GOod point read ofsted being a potential problem.

Kinky- I have a young child about to start primary and 2 secondary aged children. Obviously we all make compromises for each other as part of family life and organise tjings as best we can to meet everyone's needs. There isn't always an ideal solution to everything. However, I would definitely feel that I was failing my youngest children if she was having to accompany me on an hpurs commute every day to pick up her big brothers. Travelling for an hour after school when you are 5 6 7 8 or whatever is not fun.

MaryPoppinsBag · 07/08/2013 09:19

SleepyFish

Being able to care for my own children (7 & 4) is a major benefit of being a CM. but it isn't the only reason I went into it. I like children, I'm good with children and wanted to a job that had slightly more depth to it than a minimum wage job.
However, once expenses are taken off and the lack of sick and holiday pay and a pension are taken into account it is not such a great job. Therefore, one of the perks is not having to worry about your own Childcare!

I have a degree but due to redundancy and a stagnant job market, I found myself without a career.

I rarely take my mindees shopping, but know minders who do as part of their daily routine but how does it harm the child? A full weekly shop no but a few bits yes.

The person you know might be taking the piss, but please do not tar the rest of us with the same brush. However, I do find that I set up lots of elaborate activities small world/ ice/ snow inside etc and the children play with them for a couple of minutes and go back to playing on the swing or their favourite toy.
Also please do not underestimate the value of open ended role play. We also as CM's look for characteristics of effective learning and many are covered by such play.

As for the EYFS it is mainly play based and is supposed to be 80/20 child led. It is not about rote learning and fits nicely in a home environment. Plus don't forget the CM will do the additional paperwork relating to EYFS in her own time after a 10/11/12 hour day with young children.

burstingbaboon · 07/08/2013 09:23

Childminder is not a nanny! It says it all!

SleepyFish · 07/08/2013 09:34

MaryPoppins, I don't think I did tar you all with the same brush. I mentioned the good child minders I know in both my posts. Obviously not all child minders with young children do it solely for the convenience factor but plenty do.
I'm also well aware of the benefits of free play but in the case I mentioned the children don't really get much chance to play stuck in buggies half the day.

Emsmaman · 07/08/2013 09:38

YANBU. I'm really surprised at what is coming through on this thread and makes me glad I went for a nursery not CM for DD. Although I would expect DD to do home based activities and accompany the CM on errands, for the £7+ per hour it costs in my area I would not be happy for an hour to be spent in the car. Just because it's home from home doesn't mean it's not a job to be treated respectfully!

MaryPoppinsBag · 07/08/2013 09:39

What 5 or 6 hours a day in buggy - wow!

frogwatcher42 · 07/08/2013 09:41

Haven't read the whole thread so may be just repeating what others said - if so I apologise.

I wouldn't use her if she was going to do this. I don't think it is reasonable - a walk 10 mins up the road to a local school to pick up her kids is fine as it is fresh air and exercise. Popping to the shops for a couple of items is the same - fresh air and exercise. Sitting in a car for anything up to an hour realistically, is not fine.

Also I wonder how her insurance covers her. I had to get work put on my car insurance and the cost went through the roof. She would have to insure specifically for carrying her mindees and I suspect that may be an issue if she evens bothers to do it. But it would be essential in the case of an accident as the insurance may not pay out if she is basically working whilst driving which she is as she is minding the mindees and being paid for it.

MaryPoppinsBag · 07/08/2013 09:43

Good god now she is potentially not insured properly!
FFS!

BrokenSunglasses · 07/08/2013 09:43

If you have trouble finding another childminder, could you look into extra curricular clubs run by the school. Lots of schools do football, craft, French, computing, gardening etc after school. If you could get your child into a couple of those, or maybe even the after school club, then you could get the CM to collect your child after her school run, which would hopefully coincide with the after school club finishing.

That way, your ds would only have to be in the car after school once or twice a week, and you could hopefully just pay the CM for the hours she actually has your ds.

mrsjay · 07/08/2013 09:43

she is a childminder she has her own life too and picking u her child from school is part of her life if you didnt want your child carer to have a life then you maybe should have gone for a nursery or something, I thought that was the point of CM to have children in familiy homes and a more relaxed setting that a nursery ?

yabu change minders if you are not happy with her

Maria33 · 07/08/2013 09:44

I would wait till Xmas as I bet her child will want to get on the bus with new mates by October and she'll have relaxed about the whole transition by then. It would be annoying to change and then discover that it was all a non issue. Oh and YANBU but neither is she.

Redlocks30 · 07/08/2013 09:47

I honestly can't imagine Ofsted would think this was good practice.

HandMini · 07/08/2013 09:49

she is a childminder she has her own life too well, yes, but what people are saying is that CMs can't just go about their own life exactly as they would without mindees, or parents won't want to use them.

It's a fine balance between providing a casual home from home environment that fits around the CMs own needs and providing an enriching, nurturing child focussed environment for mindees, whise parents PAY for exactly that.

This is a topic i think is very well suited to a MN chat board, to guage opinion as to whether an action crosses the line between one or the other.

AmandaPandtheTantrumofDoom · 07/08/2013 09:53

You know what, for all the people defending this as a 'family environment', actually I wouldn't have my infant age child doing an hour's school run in the car after picking up from their own school when the sibling was secondary age. I'd have found ways for the older child to travel alone, planned it for a short settling in period or chosen a different school.

So it's a bit of a non-argument for me. If I was the parent and they were both my children I wouldn't do this long term (assuming that there were other options, which it sounds like there are. Not talking about deeply rural settings with no school bus, or round trips to specialist schools or whatever). So the fact that it's paid childcare means I definitely wouldn't want them doing it.

I don't think she's unreasonable to make different choices, but I would so I would definitely look into other minders if it is going to carry on for long.

IBO · 07/08/2013 09:54

YANBU

frogwatcher42 · 07/08/2013 09:55

MaryPoppins - whats your problem?. Surely raising the insurance issue is a valid one.

I think there is a possibility that she wouldn't be insured, no. Surely if you were the CM you would want to be covered if you had an accident. Somebody I know wasn't insured when they had an accident travelling to work!!! It was ridiculous but went to court and the insurance company got off. Apparently, some insurance companies, insist that you state on the insurance that you travel to and from work and if you don't they have a get out clause for commuting to your place of work. I checked with mine and was horrified to find that I wasn't insured for this and worse, wasn't insured for the travelling that I do between jobs at work (for work). I had to pay an extra £200 ish to get it all put on. God forbid if I had seriously hurt somebody and not been insured - it would have been life changing and doesn't bear thinking about and was done in ignorance.

I think this may be the case for childminders. Certainly in our old school, the school had to stop asking parents to take children to events in their own cars after a similar case. Our new school still asks parents to do this and I have never raised it with them but I do only put my dc in my car on school trips, or in the school mini bus for this reason. I am not sure if they are insured - the school may have a cover all but I haven't been bothered to find out as I think they will be sensible enough to have sorted it themselves.