to think this child is too old to be exposing himself?

[JenniBoo]

Bit of a back story... was delighted when a young family bought the house next door. After the previous elderly couple (who would complain about noise and balls going over the wall etc.,) I thought another young family would be a breath of fresh air and that their boys (8, 5 and 3) would play with my daughters (3yrs and 3 mths).

The first hint that they were not our sort of people became apparent almost immediately. They are both heavy smokers - they must smoke at least a pack a day - but instead of doing it in their house, they (and their friends) congregate on the porch- the smell wafts across into our garden and through the kitchen window. One day it was so bad, you could smell it in my baby's bedroom on the floor above! I asked them politely if they would mind smoking indoors or at the end of their garden - but they were completely unapologetic and said they couldn't do that because in the house if might affect THEIR children - and that at the end of the garden, they would get wet!

She seems to let her kids run wild - she is never in the garden with them, and the noise is something else. The other day I had to complain because they were throwing stones at each other - one flew across into our garden narrowly missing my baby, who was sleeping in the pram. I went across to complain but the mother couldn't have cared less. She lined them up and made them apologize, but she was all "boys will be boys" and you could tell she wasn't really sorry.

Today has been the final straw though. I came out to find both the younger boys exposing themselves to my older daughter. They had climbed onto their trampoline and were waving them at her. The older boy was there too, but was just laughing. I went round to the mother and told her. . The other mother told me I was "being stupid" and that "they are just little boys" and that I should "get over myself".

I don't think a 5 year old should be getting his willy out in public. Surely if he did that in the class at school he would be in huge trouble? Am I being unreasonable?

OP, you said: They are both heavy smokers - they must smoke at least a pack a day - but instead of doing it in their house, they (and their friends) congregate on the porch- the smell wafts across into our garden and through the kitchen window.

And She seems to let her kids run wild - she is never in the garden with them, and the noise is something else.

So, have you exaggerated how much they smoke or the level of supervision? If they're smoking enough for it to be a nuisance then they can see what the boys are up to. If she is never in the garden with them then where is she smoking?

YABU

Have you tried interacting with the boys directly? If I'd been in that situation I would have kindly and calmly told them to put their willies away. I'd have only gone round if they gave a rude response.

Perhaps it's a shame one of your lovely NCT friends didn't buy the house next door to you. You sound like someone from "Watch with Mother" in the 50s.

I'm beginning to wonder if the OP has realised most people think she's BU and is trying to get the thread deleted.

I wouldn't worry too much OP, my DD was incredibly shy and sensitive and quiet when she was young. However, she loved play group and school and enjoyed lots of different children besides one or two that actually thumped her and pushed her around.

they werrnt bullying her! they are five and three. they were playing and calling out to her, probably in an attempt to interact with her. being naked/having their willies out is little boys being silly and messing around. there werent harrassing her.

shamelessly marking place

'waving them at her'

Sorry

Rofl at call the police for 5yo with Willy out in his own garden. Seriously ??

Your dd obviously won't get willies waved at her at a girls only school but you are most definitely deluded if you think that she won't be exposed to bad behaviour , rough and tumble and teasing. I'd suggest home ed before y4 if you really are so sensitive and precious tbh.

Tbh if you had posted about your DD being nervous about the very physical boys next door you would have received lots of advice and suggestions.

But you singled out the willy thing and tried to give it sinister overtones, you then made incredibly rude comments about everyone who disagreed with you.
Your 'people like us' and 'lovely nct frends' and 'lovely litle girls stuff makes you sound a bit insufferable tbh.
I would lighten up a bit. If you turn up at DDs girls school you will be in for quite the shock. Certainly tag rugby will be a challenge.
Little girls are not little princesses.

I understand it will be difficult if your DD is shy and sensitive. But tbh your having the vapours over a five years olds penis isn't going to help her with that.

OP, you'd love my eldest, he doesnt wave his willy, he pokes people with it!

stealthy place mark

5ft. Thank you for clarifying.
Just for the record, I NEVER, said it was "fine".

Well we smoke in our garden. Our 3 yr old ds waggles his willy and our five year old dd tries to waggle her bits too, unsuccessfully. We are probably not your sort of people. For that, I am glad. That pole up your arse must be painful.

BeyondTheLimitsOfAcceptability that made me laugh.

OP your last post sounded quite sensible. I think it would be worth perhaps getting advice from somewhere other than MN has it all seems to have got a bit intense here. Especially if the neighbour issues get worse, Shelter and CAB both give advice on these things or perhaps a parenting or family support helpline. Enjoy your supper and try not to let them get to you.

Our 10 year old loves going on he trampoline naked. OP would combust at that.

You are doing your daughter no favours by referring to everything with such emotive language.

She isn't being harrassed, bullied or anything of the sort. Your dripfeed of additional info doesn't sound amazing to be fair, but going into hystrionics and claiming all these things are not going to help her become more confident - especially around the opposite sex.

hilarious.

This is another case of mothers of girls choosing to demonise boys.

OP -they weren't trying to harass your daughter. they were just trying to be funny. that she took it badly is your issue.

pissing on her head (your language - lovely) is not at all the same thing.

your little girl has 2 choices - ignore them and they might eventually stop or play indoors when they're outside.

Admittedly the "not our sort of people" and "nice NCT friends" did come across as a bit snobby. However I still dispute that "all children" behave like this. We have countless kids over at our house to play and meet up to play at the park etc and very few of them thump people and break things. Again the willy thing is a red herring!

*histrionics

Oh, your friends are all "naice". That explains it

I can understand you are upset by your neighbours and the reaction you've had here but really OP you are coming across as an unspeakable snob.

What does your dh think?

OP - It sounds like you have almost no experience of little boys and so I can understand a bit more why it may have been a bit of a shock to you to see these two boys pulling down their shorts and waving their willies at your daughter, however this really is totally normal, silly behaviour from young boys and I don't think you need to worry about it, or the impact it had on your daughter, too much.

I think as some of the previous posters have said maybe you do just need to pick your battles more carefully with your neighbours - you can't go around to talk to them for every thing they, and their children, do to annoy you without them beginning to think you a bit ridiculous. You will just have to begin to let things go and only go around when something is serious and likely to cause harm (ie: the stone throwing). Unfortunately going around just because something has annoyed or irritated you does just make you seem petty, as you probably experienced with your elderly neighbours getting annoyed for your children being noisy/ throwing balls. It is a shame your neighbours was not more apologetic her sons upset your daughter but it really is not worth falling out with them. Maybe you will just have to accept that these will never be the sort of neighbours you have round for coffee/ wine and try and find a way for their antics to be less difficult for you.

I had some neighbours in a previous house who, whilst not causing any major problems, had children who were forever fighting or climbing over my fence to get things, a dog who was constantly barkin and a group of motorbikers who would rev the things for hours in the evenings. They were always smoking and shouting and swearing and fighting in the garden. My flatmate and I just had to find a way to find some humour and something to gossip about in their behaviour, and would laugh about it together, as otherwise we would have been infuriated and angry at their inconsiderate behaviour. Maybe just offloading to your DP in an evening would help?

I also wonder whether you might be able to find some friends with sons? Even if your daughter is going to an all-girls school it might be good for her to play with some boys of a similar age just so that she is not completely intimidated by them as clearly her experiences with the boys-next-door have not been completely positive. At some point she is going to have to be around boys and it will likely be good for her if she is given some opportunities to play with boys now so that her socialising has not all been with girls, especially if she is finding boys intimidating. Perhaps you could find a mixed-gender mother-and-child group or a pre-schoolers activity club or something to attend with your daughter where there will be boys? It just might help your DD to be less frightened of these boys because obviously it is awful if she feels like that, but equally as your neighbour said boys will be boys and with them living next door to some extent she is going to have to get used to them and learn that she doesn't need to be frightened of little boys and, dare I say it, even that little boys can be fun companions.

'Their garden is not a private space'

'My DD should be able to play in her OWN PRIVATE garden without being harassed.'

Eh?

Exactly WestieMamma I think I was trying to say you can't have it both ways. It was actually my daughter who was playing quietly, not interfering with anyone, when she was interrupted and distressed by these nasty boys. The fact that they were standing in their garden while they did it is really neither here nor there..... right - will go and read from the beginning again now...

I do think high opaque screening is going to be the best solution.