Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to think this is bad advice? (Re. Bullies)

185 replies

Angora831 · 28/07/2013 22:45

I've read a lot of threads here and on other Internet hangouts about bullies. Invariably, someone will advise teaching your children 'witty' comebacks to show up the bully. Speaking as a teacher with a few years at the coalface behind me, I'd just like to say THIS NEVER WORKS. This is because:

A) the comeback is clearly practiced at home with Mum. Children aren't stupid and they pick up on this.

B) Bullies are generally clever and charismatic children, and every time I've witnessed a child retorting with an obviously rehearsed comeback, the bully is able to verbally outwit them and make them look small and stupid. Horrid to watch, must be more horrid for the victim (and because I know what Mumsnet is like and where this thread will go, please rest assured that I do punish bullying behaviour when I witness it).

I'm not saying i have all the answers to bullying, but based on my own experience (and my highly scientific poll of the staff room before we broke up last week), the 'hilarious comeback' approach just doesn't work.

OP posts:
NotYoMomma · 28/07/2013 23:07

my family have a mantra

NEVER hit first
ALWAYS hit back

verbally or physically

LilacPeony · 28/07/2013 23:08

It seems unfair that a bully would have to hit back or change schools to stop it. Should be the bullies being thrown out of school.

thornrose · 28/07/2013 23:12

"Bullies are generally clever and charismatic children"

God I can't express how much I disagree with that statement.

Fifi2406 · 28/07/2013 23:13

I was terribly bullied at school by a clever person who was probably bored because she already knew what the teacher was talking about and I think the only thing that would have stopped her would have been if I had hit back and hurt her or if I had just been removed from the school, I did neither and it carried on until the day we finished for the summer after gcse's also there was not strong enough consequences for the bully's they would get excluded for a day over and over and over again so it was just another day off for them!

YouTheCat · 28/07/2013 23:15

When my dd was being bullied at secondary, we had a meeting with her head of year. She then gathered the bullies and reminded them that their behaviour wasn't what was expected (they were 14). Hmm There were no consequences whatsoever.

The bullying continued and dd was expected to just keep out of their way.

ShellyBoobs · 28/07/2013 23:16

I'm with those saying that violence is usually the answer.

It's unfortunate, but true, that often the only way to stop a bully in their tracks is to give them an unholy kicking.

I was bullied relentlessly as a child until I found that a couple of black eyes and bust nose usually had a positive effect on bullies and Thai boxing helped me out immensely when it came to them deciding on whether it was me they would pick on that day.

I'm also sure someone will be along to say that they'd much rather their child was bullied than turn out to be a bully themself - yes really, I've read that on here several times - because "it must be so awful to know your child is a bully". As opposed to having your child terrfied of school and in tears, with their self-confidence in tatters, possibly for the rest of their life.

Of course, the people who will say that will be people who weren't bullied as a child.

3birthdaybunnies · 28/07/2013 23:17

I think the problem is that good schools stamp heavily on bullying so it doesn't become prolonged, if you are unfortunate to find your dc in a school which doesn't address bullying effectively - e.g. zero tollerance and ultimately exclusion/ expulsion then maybe it is better to move them to a school which does manage bullying effectively -easier said than done though.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary · 28/07/2013 23:18

Interesting.

We teach them not to hit back
We teach them to tell the teacher (providing the teacher is interested and it won't make things worse)
We teach them to run away (providing they can outrun the bully)

If we can't teach them to outsmart the bully (it's usually not hard to be honest), what exactly are they to do?? Confused

Ds hits back but only to protect himself. Sometimes the wit doesn't work.

BridgetBidet · 28/07/2013 23:19

Depends on the Mum giving the comeback. TBH if this happens with my kids (and traditional approaches via the school or approaching the parents have not worked) I will make damn certain I know every detail about the sex life, house keeping and looks/weight of the mother concerned.

And any come back my child came out with would be fucking cutting. It would make 'Yo Momma' jokes look like 'Songs of Praise'.

EatingAllTheCrumpets · 28/07/2013 23:21

NotYoMomma that what my dad taught me, never instigate violence but never be scared to fight back.

When I was bullied at school I did the following;

  1. laugh it off - didn't work
  2. ignore - didn't work
  3. make smart and witty comments back - didn't work
  4. got teachers and head teachers involved - made it worse
  5. gave main bully a swift punch and a judo take down in the middle of the playground - worked.

After I fought back physically I was never bullied again. I will teach my children how to protect themselves and would encourage them to fight back if things were bad.

thebody · 28/07/2013 23:22

I never taught mine not to hit back. how wierd would that be? if I was attacked I would do what I needed to do to survive.

my kids have been bullied from time to time and always hitting back and hitting back harder works.

fact.

LadyMaryQuiteContrary · 28/07/2013 23:22

Oh, ds is great at 'Yo Mamma!' rolls eyes

SirBoobAlot · 28/07/2013 23:23

I disagree that they are always the bright kids. I was bullied because I was bright. It started as that, anyway.

By the time it got to the point of them setting fire to my hair and kicking me down the stairs in cardboard boxes, I think they had forgotten why. Especially as they all mostly asked me for help in the run up to GCSEs.

Only thing the stopped some of the bullying? Thumping the bitch who started one of the groups off. Straight around the jaw. In the middle of the school ground so everyone could see me. And screaming at her that if she so much as said another single word about me again, she wouldn't be getting back up off the fucking pavement.

I'm not a violent person. But I also do not regret for one second doing that.

AgentZigzag · 28/07/2013 23:25

'And incidentally the kids shouldn't have to deal with it - they are kids.'

But they do have to deal with it, all the time.

Even telling a teacher doesn't mean that much, it just goes on somewhere else, relentlessly, quietly.

It fucks me off when schools won't accept it goes on everywhere, all the time.

'Oh, we never have a problem with bullying here'

Rubbish, I don't believe you don't have bullying at your school, and if you think you don't, you're in denial.

hadababygirl · 28/07/2013 23:30

It doesn't in our school agent because we do not tolerate it.

The problem with witty comebacks is that the bully may not be brighter than the child but if they have a large following then they will support the bully.

So bully says 'you stink of shit' to their victim, and the kid comes back with a witty retort and the bully says 'yeah but you still stink of shit.' Bully's friends fall about laughing. Hmm It isn't funny at all, but that doesn't help the poor kid.

itsonlyapapermoon · 28/07/2013 23:31

Agreed on thumping back. I was bullied by a girl a lot bigger (and thicker) than me, which included her trying to set my hair on fire. I have a smart mouth and trust me, it only fanned the flames. The only thing that stopped her in her tracks was me giving her a hiding in front of the rest of the year level. It was worth the suspension. That is one thing in particular that pisses me off-at school if you retaliated physically to a bully you got suspended as well. The school expected you to grass the bully up, then be completely useless with their ineffectual policies which would only make the bullying worse. I'm not generally an advocate of violence, but we teach our kids if someone pushes/ hits them to bloody well do it back!!

PeriodMath · 28/07/2013 23:33

I think it's a total cop-out for a teacher to say hit back or change schools.

I had a rather nasty period at school when I was about 12/13, don't want to go into details but it was your typical bitchy girls stuff which evolved into pushing, shoving and public name-calling. I tried to avoid them, never dreamed of telling a teacher. But my hand was forced when a photo of me on a corridor wall display (after some school trip) had the face scratched out. One of the teachers who had been on the trip pulled me into his classroom and demanded I tell him who had done it. And I did. It was a blessed relief to have someone raise it and make me tell them. He simply told me it would stop, that I had his word.

Well God knows what he said to those girls but from that day on not one of them so much as glanced in my direction. They avoided me like the plague and kept their heads down if we passed in the corridors. In a blink, it was all over.

It was fantastic and I will never forget that man.

If only all teachers were so vigilant about bullying. Bullies don't respond to gentle coaxing. They need threats, anger, shame and sanctions. And if it doesn't stop - boot them out.

YouTheCat · 28/07/2013 23:33

If, as an adult, someone assaulted you, would you say 'Oooh I'm telling' or would your natural reaction be to thump them?

LadyMaryQuiteContrary · 28/07/2013 23:35

Bullying happens in every school. It's how the school deal with it that makes the difference. Some pretend it doesn't happen 'we have nice children from good families in this school!' Hmm, some accept it does and try their hardest to stamp on it. You can't grass, it just attracts more of them and they will never leave you alone.

wakeupandsmellthecoffee · 28/07/2013 23:35

I've always told mine
Never start it BUT always finish it.

VitoCorleone · 28/07/2013 23:36

Im not sure about primary school, but from what i remember about secondry school exclusion/being expelled was in no way a punushment, it was a fucking holiday. So im not sure how that works.

Ive told my kids, if anyone hits you then hit them back.

Standing up to bullies is the only way to get them off your back, a "witty comeback" will just make things worse.

AgentZigzag · 28/07/2013 23:36

I love that teacher PeriodMath.

jacks365 · 28/07/2013 23:38

Dd2 used her wit to cut her bully down to size and for her that worked but she has a very cutting turn of phrase herself and didn't need coaching from me. There will be no one way which will work for every child but schools do need to treat it more seriously and not brush it under the carpet.

SirBoobAlot · 28/07/2013 23:38

Bullying happens everywhere. It might not be the drastic physical beatings, but the snide comments when no one is looking will be going on. You can 'not tolerate it' all you like, I do no believe there is a single school anywhere where some form of bullying does not happen.

MrsMook · 28/07/2013 23:38

When I was in y11 some girls in Y10 made the mistake of thinking I looked a nice easy target. I had the confidence to do things on my own if I wanted and not have to be with a posse of friends, and they mistook that for being a loner.

I did the witty come-backs or blanked them, looking through them as though they weren't there. They didn't quite know what to make of that. One day at the bus stop, they stepped up a gear. I had a battered Head sports bag, and they came up close and one leant on it to pull me down to the ground without looking too aggressive. They were still talking and not looking at me, so I put one hand under the hand straps, but didn't take the weight of the bag, and unhooked the shoulder strap, and let the bag drop into my hand. As I hoped, the girl fell with the bag. What I hadn't predicted was the shoulder strap flicked up and the metal buckle cracked her in the face. She picked herself up and shouted "what did you do that for" I replied "you deserved it." Fortunately while the girls were wondering what to do next, the bus turned up and I got on. They never went near me agaln.

Bullying is all about a power dynamic, and I didn't give them that power.