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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think if a man doesn't want a baby he should make it his business to wear a condom

434 replies

JaffaMyCake · 15/07/2013 11:57

A friend of mine has got pregnant off a casual FWB situation. She's ok with this and intends to keep the baby even though she isn't in a relationship with the father.

However the father has gone absolutely ballistic, called her a bitch etc and demands she has an abortion. He's adamant he doesn't want the baby or to pay child support.

The situation regarding contraception is that it was just never discussed and they continually had unprotected sex for about 3 months. He never asked if she was on the pill and she never told him she was.

So AIBU to think if he so adamantly did not want a baby with this woman he should have bloody well used protection, regardless of whether she suggested it or not?

OP posts:
MyHumpsMyLovelyBabyBumps · 15/07/2013 22:14

she was in chat yesterday Buddha, I actually assumed that's what made the op think of it

MyHumpsMyLovelyBabyBumps · 15/07/2013 22:14

she was in chat yesterday Buddha, I actually assumed that's what made the op think of it

MyHumpsMyLovelyBabyBumps · 15/07/2013 22:16

Confused Hmm Grin

WTF happened there?

chicaguapa · 15/07/2013 22:19

No-one is forcing the poor menz to become fathers, they are making themselves fathers by expecting everyone else to take care of their fertility.

I agree with this if he didn't have that conversation with her because he felt it was her responsibility.

I think the grey area in this particular case is did he really think she was on the pill or did he not think about it at all, believing it to be her responsibility? The first was a schoolboy error never trust the contraception unless you have visible proof of it, the latter is an out-dared attitude which he is now going to regret.

I do think it's easier for men to be a bit laissez faire with contraception as they feel more removed from the consequences. And I completely agree that this man should have made sure himself that they were using contraception.

Unless they have agreed to not use contraception, it shouldn't be assumed by either party that pregnancy would be welcome. In the same way that he shouldn't have assumed she was on the pill, she shouldn't have assumed he wanted a baby because he hadn't expressly said he didn't. But it was both their responsibility to make sure they were protected.

There is a fine line between omission and lying. I still stand by the fact that she absolutely knew they were taking risks and he either assumed wrongly that they were safe or hadn't thought about it all. I completely take on board that he should have realised he was taking a risk when he didn't take care of it himself. But there's a difference between taking a deliberate risk and a thoughtless one.

But one thing's for sure, those of us with a DS is going to be drumming the message home when they're old enough to listen/ understand.

teetering13 · 15/07/2013 22:20

I've not read all the replies but my view is ... she wanted a baby, she found an irresponsible man (theres plenty of them) and had sex ... hey presto, she got what she wanted ...

To late for him to have a tantrum now .. but what else would you expect from someone who expects others to be responsible for him .. guys a nob ... good for her that he wants nothing to do with the child ... she chose well I guess! Smile

DioneTheDiabolist · 15/07/2013 22:41

So are we saying that there is no such thing as a lie by omission?

TheFallenMadonna · 15/07/2013 22:49

So many assumptions.

Firstly, that it should be assumed that pregnancy is not a desired outcome of a sexual encounter - when biologically...

And, built on that assumption, that the default responsibility for contraception lies with the woman in the absence of any effort, or indeed request for information, from the man.

Why?

The first is clearly not a valid assumption, as this thread and others referred to, make clear. Some women want to get pregnant when they have sex. Therefore the second is built on dodgy ground too.

So rather than harping on invalid assumptions, perphas the better option would be for people to take responsibility for their own fertility, men and women. Which works out better for the partner who doesn't want pregnancy in fact - as their choice is much more likely to prevail!

Mumoftwoyoungkids · 15/07/2013 22:50

He's a total and utter idiot.

She's.....

Actually I'm not sure.

If she was purposely ttcing then that makes her pretty deceitful.

If she wasn't then she is an idiot too.

I know a bloke who got caught in a similar way to this. Long term relationship (as in years). They agreed to use the pill as their contraception.she decided she wanted a baby. He wanted to wait a couple of years as he was still qualifying in a profession. She stopped taking the pill and didn't tell him. He found out in the first midwife appointment when he worriedly asked whether her being on the pill when they conceived could hurt the baby and she answered (presumably without thinking) that she wasn't.

Relationship fell apart as he could never trust her again. He has shared care of their daughter though.

Dh and I have discussed the situation loads over the years - is there a point in a relationship where you do trust the other party to use the contraception they say they are? Or should men always wear a condom and if not have no right to complain no matter what the circumstances?

teetering13 · 15/07/2013 23:04

I know a couple who were together for 14 years before she came off the pill and got pregnant without him knowing

When they met he told her he didn't want more children .. she accepted this until she heard her clock ticking loudly

So yeah .. they have a son who's near 10 now, and no, he doesn't know it wasn't an accident

revealall · 15/07/2013 23:08

I disagree that she was deceitful if she was TTC. If she told the father she didn't want children and was protected,then yes she lied. However she could still have got pregnant - none of it is 100%

Sounds to me like there was an assumption made on his part. Which is his fault.

teetering13 · 15/07/2013 23:08

Oh and yes, I think she had every right to do what she did ... she was looking out for herself, whereas he, who had said he didn't want anymore children, didn't do anything about it ...

DioneTheDiabolist · 15/07/2013 23:13

So if she didn't ask if he had an STD, but he had and infected her, would we saying that she has no right to go mad because all adults know that only condoms provide protection against STDs?

complexnumber · 15/07/2013 23:13

Deceit is more evil than stupidity.

Eyesunderarock · 15/07/2013 23:19

'So if she didn't ask if he had an STD, but he had and infected her, would we saying that she has no right to go mad because all adults know that only condoms provide protection against STDs'

Now that's sneaky!
Why not wait a few months and try it out as a thread?
My money is on 'Oh no, cocklodger, wanker, evil shithead, poor you' from the majority. Grin
With a few of us saying, your orifice, your responsibility.

Although if you have AIDS, isn't it possible that you can be charged for not disclosing if you shag multiple partners and they get ill?
Or am I channelling an American TV series?

TheFallenMadonna · 15/07/2013 23:19

To minimise the risk of STI, you ask a man to wear a condom. And you don't have sex with one who doesn't. Win win in this situation...

DioneTheDiabolist · 15/07/2013 23:23

Eyesunderarock, I think you're spot on.

teetering13 · 15/07/2013 23:24

If I had unprotected sex and got an STD it'd be my fault ..

WTF the guy can't see his part in getting the woman preggers? ... He has no right to 'go ballistic'

Eyesunderarock · 15/07/2013 23:27

Dion, I may pencil that in as a Bored in January thread activity.Grin

DioneTheDiabolist · 15/07/2013 23:34

Teetering, you are right it would be your responsibility and some posters would be telling you that. However I do think that you would have every right to go ballistic at the non disclosure. Particularly where it results in lifelong consequences such as herpes, hepatitis and HIV.

DioneTheDiabolist · 15/07/2013 23:34

Knock yourself out Eyes.Grin

Xales · 15/07/2013 23:37

After I ended my last relationship I had a health check. The guy I was planning on some care free shagging with also had one.

Shag fell through for some reason but we were both sensible adults who discussed contraception and STIs.

This man either assumed or didn't care until it came back to bite him. His stupidity and own fault. How many times has he made assumptions?

The woman was actually stupidly putting herself at risk if she knew he liked to not use condoms and it would be her fault if she caught something by not taking care. Just line he is at fault over the pregnancy.

YouMakeMeWannaLaLa · 15/07/2013 23:48

There is a pretty huge difference between a committed couple discussing and deciding upon contraception and two FWB just going at it with no discussion.

Pretty much every ONS I've ever had has just attempted to get on with things without a condom. I've always had to be the one to bring it up (so to speak Wink ).

And I've often had some outrageous hostility from men at insisting on the use of condoms. All the usual moaning about how uncomfortable they are /don't fit Hmm to taking offense at 'virtually being accused of being an 'AIDser'' Angry

I also had one man tell me I could always have an abortion if I 'caught on'.

God, I used to attract some true princes.

Eyesunderarock · 15/07/2013 23:49

Perhaps you ought to up your standards a bit? Aim for a better quality human?

differentnameforthis · 16/07/2013 04:18

Hiding the fact that she wanted to get pregnant is hugely deceitful & is close to trapping him, BUT I agree, if a pregnancy made him this angry, he should have used a condom.

They are both stupid, but she is worse, as she had a plan all along.

goodasitgets · 16/07/2013 04:54

I have a FWB, we don't use condoms. But neither of us sleep with anyone else. My contraception failed and I got pregnant. He never wants children (I didn't know this as we hasn't discussed it). Since then I've reviewed my contraception and had a copper coil fitted and track my cycle too. I made him aware of what new contraception I was using