to find it really irritating when people who earn a lot say...

[Doodledumdums]

...But I work really hard for the money I get.

Sorry, totally unimportant, but it really irritates me!

I have a few friends who earn quite a lot of money, and I don't begrudge them this at all, but I just find it really insulting when they say 'But I do work really hard for it.' I also work hard! I feel like it implies that I don't! Okay, I am on maternity leave at the moment, so am not actually at work, (although i'd say that to some extent, looking after a baby is harder than my actual job anyway!) but when I am working, I am usually in the office by 8am, and often don't leave until 7pm, and I earn literally a fraction of what some of my friends earn. That is fine, I knew that when I got in to my chosen industry, but it doesn't mean that I don't work as hard as they do or deserve more!

They don't need to be defensive about it at all! It is totally fine that they earn what they do, I just don't understand why they can't be a bit more gracious about it and say something like 'Yes, I am lucky that I have a job I love which pays well.'

Oh I don't know, maybe I am being unreasonable and ultra-sensitive. I am sure they don't mean to imply that I don't work hard, but it just feels like that sometimes. Totally a first world issue!

P.S- I have self esteem and anxiety issues...which is possibly why I find this upsetting!

Is it like:

DH says "Delicious custard Mum"
DW hears "Not like the nasty tinned stuff I get at home"

Haha, possibly WetGrass! That analogy made me laugh!

There is no protocol about what we can post here. I made no comment on whether you should have written your OP, merely on how strange it is to care so much about your friends comments. I don't believe I am misinterpreting the OP at all. People post what they want us to know, and obviously don't put the other side of the story. You still haven't said what prompted the comment which I find very telling and on that basis I can't think why you care what they think unless you don't think they deserve what they have and you deserve more.

I was called weird for daring to suggest that if you don't like what you do and think you should be better paid for your hard work then you should try and do something about it and complaining for the sake of it won't change anything.

I also find it weird that you think that you are in some competition with them about how hard you work. They aren't passing judgement on whether you work hard or not but you seem to determined to make it about you. On the other hand if you really believe they think you are lazy and they are so much more superior to you, ditch them. Life is too short for all this angst.

BBB - you find it strange that OP cares about her friend's comment and are critisizing her for it.

but you clearly care about the issue enough to have posted several time.

so is it ok for you to care about something that happened to someone else, but not ok for her to care about what bugs her?

nice hypocrisy and double standards there

I'm possibly sensitive too, but I'm bright and articulate, (plus attractive) but have worked in a caring profession since leaving uni and have friends who say the same, plus clients who say why don't you do something which pays more as you are intelligent and attractive, but then who would do the jobs which are import but not as well paid? Stupid unattractive resentful people!!

Sometimes well-paid people (or their partners) say that kind of thing when they seem to be feeling scrutinised or judged for being a high earner, to try to be self-depreciating. Doubt its meant to imply that people on lower incomes don't work hard.

I find it quite irritating too, and very insulting. And when I was employed I was very highly paid.

But I was always aware that it was just the luck of the draw, and nothing to do with the intrinsic value of my job or how hard I worked. Having a sister who was doing a very tough medical residency at the time as I started my job probably helped keep things in perspective.

From experience the 'But I do work really hard for it.' line usually follows a comment like, 'but it's alright for you as you earn loads'.

IMHO it's an awkward response to an awkward preceding statement or comment. No one wants to sound like they're bragging so try to fumble around for some kind of justification why they earn a lot of money.

Of course they could say that they earn a shed load of cash and don't have to work very hard for it at all but that would sound really crap.

Thurlow, hate to break it to you, but it is a fallacy that 'secure jobs' and 'recession-proof' professions exist! There is no such thing as a job for life, everyone who has a job has to work double as hard currently just to stand still in their career, and hold on to their job, with wage increases being just about on par with inflation, at about 2% in most industries.

I care because they are my friends, and in general I care far too much about what other people think of me. (Mostly a result of the anxiety issues which I said about in my OP- which I appreciate is not remotely my friends fault!)

I am not trying to hide anything by not describing the situation which provoked my OP, it's just that it didn't really seem very interesting for anyone to read! But this is what happened...

I saw some friends on Saturday, and one of my friends mentioned that she was getting a promotion, and she was saying that she was annoyed that her employer was refusing to recognise the extra responsibility by giving her a pay rise, and one of my friends asked her how much they were paying her, so she told us, and then asked us how much we were earning comparative to when we left uni (five years ago). So we went round the group and said what we earned when we started, and what we are earning now, and when it got to one of my friends, he said 'I started on £24k and am now on £130k+ commission, but I work bloody hard for it.' I just feel that given the situation, a justification wasn't really necessary. I guess there were probably a few raised eyebrows, because let's face it, from 24k to 130k in 5 years is a pretty impressive jump, but no one made any comments which I feel required a justification or made him feel awkward. So it sort of made me feel like he was saying that the reason I (and others in the group) earn not much more than when we started was because we don't work as hard as he does.

I probably am reading in to it too much, but that is just what it felt like he was implying.

doodle I really think in that case he was just being defensive, it probably wasn't the first time he felt he had to justify it.

I doubt it was about you.

amazing Yes you are probably right. It's just that it is a comment which can only be said if you earn a lot, because it would sound very strange if someone said 'I earn 20k, but I work bloody hard for it!' I am being over-sensitive, but I am proud of my job and what I have achieved, (especially given the fact that I could barely leave my house between the age of 19-21 because I was so petrified of everything!), so I hate any implication that I haven't and don't work hard!

doodle a bit off the subject - I have learnt to not get involved in the "what does your DH do?" game anymore, especially from stranger.

that is the first question I get asked as soon as people find out we have 6 children! so irritating!
Whether it is truly a code for "are you living on benefits?" or it just feels like it I hardly ever give straight answer.

my current favourite answers are either : "if I tell you I'll have to kill you" or "ask me no questions I tell you no lies". followed by a smile
that shuts them up.

FWIW if he is a really good friend I'd actually ask him what he meant by it. give him a chance to explain.
also if he doesn't realize he ticks people off, a little chat about this might even help him to think how he comes across.
hth

Haha, good answers amazing! It is very prying of strangers to ask what your DH does, I don't blame you for wanting to keep it to yourself!

Yes he is a very good friend (He was actually a bridesman at my wedding!), so it may be a good idea to talk to him.

Totally separate comment, but he was also complaining about his work colleague who is 34 weeks pregnant and has still got morning sickness, and he said she needs to stop complaining because 'Pregnancy is not an illness!'

Maybe a little discussion about tact wouldn't go amiss!!

doodles have a chat with him.tell him how his comment made you feel.
I'm pretty sure he will be surprised that you got hurt by it!

"If someone frowns at you do not turn your nose up, but ask what's bothering them.
Chances are they are unhappy about themselves and didn't even notice you were there!" (as in the frowning was not directed at you)

I found that "advice" invaluable and helped me avoid a lot of unnecessary grief!
I really hope you it will help you next time!
(quote is a rough translation from one of my favourite childhood books)

crap, I missed the end bit!

......were there, and you might be able to help them!"

so there.

Great advice, thank you

Daisy, I know nothing is recession proof, I just know a lot of people in industries that have been so slammed by the recession the industry/career hardly exists any more, and then I know people who are doing ok and redundancies have been minimal. I also know from personal experience than wage increases don't even have to cover inflation

Sorry, that's all by the by, really. I think all I am trying to add to the argument is that some sectors just pay more than others, and so some people in certain jobs just earn more than others and its not got much to do with hard work.

Side issue I know, but I think attitudes like "it is vulgar to discuss money" strongly contribute to the gender pay gap.

I myself feel distinctly uncomfortable discussing money but I believe it's only when we can do this as a society without stigma that the employment market will become more equitable.

I think it's short sighted of people to say this - that they earn a lot because they have worked hard.

It isn't necessarily an equation that holds, I mean, people who clean toilets are doing something not many of us want to do, yet their pay scale has to be among the lowest in the UK

I know people who earn an absolute ton and their work seems to involve doing some calculations and sending a lot of emails. And travelling a lot.

I don't think they find it very hard, as such. They are just good at it, good with people, good with communication. And very fortunate. I think they worked hard at uni to get the qualifications necessary, which yes I think is valid, as I dropped out in the sixth form (not through being lazy. I was completely depressed and in quite a bad way, but still)

Others work really really hard in very boring jobs, from early till late and earn minimum wage. That's kind of unfair.

There are other jobs that I think are very stressful, very difficult and carry HUGE responsibility and for that I think people need to be rewarded or no one would want to take it on.

Pay = compensation for how bloody hard it is, sometimes.

But then you come back to the cleaning argument. I don't know.

Rooney while you are right and not many of us would want to clean toilets for a living any of us could. if we had to! which why the people doing it do it, they have no better option (for whatever reason).
and because of that they will do a disgusting job for peanuts if they want to earn any money at all!

of course it's not a pretty job, but I would not call it hard work or strenous physical or intellectual work!

big diffe

garlicnutty FS - "Yes, I've been lucky to have the opportunity." Or even "Yeah, everyone here works hard; it doesn't seem fair sometimes!"

I don't agree with that. I know there are lots of people who work hard for little payment. but in my & DPs social groups, we have all had very similar opportunities and there is a correlation between how important work is to you and how far you rise up the structure in your chosen area.

1. i earn lots of money because i am worth it. i can solve problems much quicker (say 5-10 times quicker) than other people working in the same area. i am like an athlete who has been training since childhood. they develop their muscles. i develop part of my brain. very few people can do what i do. i did A level maths in 6 weeks. i could do that because i had previously studied 6 hours per day after school and sometimes from 5am.

2. many other people work hard and are paid badly.

these 2 facts are not mutually exclusive.

athletes are partly the best because of genetics, but they took advantage of the opportunities they had. the end results was a combination of luck and genetics.

but personally if i ever has the good fortune to meet a world class athlete, i would not be thinking how lucky they were. there were other people with as good, or even better, or maybe almost as good genes, who didn't take the opportunities. i would be trying to understand how they approached their chosen sport and what made them the best.

i would look at what i could learn from their success not waste the opportunity thinking about how lucky they were.

There is a correlation between whether anyone can do a job or whether only people who have specific skills can do it and how much people are paid.

Anyone could clean if they wanted to, same as being a nursery worker or a packer in a factory etc etc, the pay is low because of this, this is not to say anyone would be good at these things because that is most definitely not the case. I could easily pass a level 3 NVQ to be qualified as a nursery worker but I know I would be crap at the job. I would probably be good at the paperwork. I think people in non skilled jobs are very much respected but unfortunately the reality is that you cannot pay a cleaner £50k a year as what would then professionals such as doctors ans lawyers be paid after training for years and years in a job only a select few succeed at?

Please don't take any offence to any of my examples - that is not what I mean but I have used them to explain my point.