AIBU to give DP proposal ultimatum?

[justhayley]

Horrible title but.... iv been with DP for 8 1/2 years I'm almost 30 and we have a 15 month old DS. DS wasn't planned (but very much wanted & loved) however ideally I didn't want children until I was married.
I really think DP should be proposing. We've spoken about marriage but when it comes to this subject we both seem pretty crap at communicating.
DP has never said he doesn't want to marry me but after this long and a baby I'm starting to wonder what the hell he's waiting for.
He's in he military and 2 years ago said once he finishes his training we would get engaged. His training finished a year ago and still I don't feel like he's even planning to ask me. In a way I feel like he lead me on a bit.

I don't want him to feel pressured to propose - I want him to do it because he wants to. Evertyime i decide to talk to him about ut i feel like im pressuring him and it makes me feel crap.
However In a way I feel like I also don't want to waste anymore time with someone who just may never ask.
Marriage is important to me, I'm the only person out of all my friends thy isn't marries or engaged and iv been with DP the longest.
His most recent excuse is Money. I'm not buying it. Yes we are not rolling in it and do not have enough cash for a big dream wedding and a
tiffany engagement ring, but we are not so hard up we couldn't pull something lovely
together without going into masses of debt or breaking the bank. I want a marriage not a wedding.

I'm feeling a bit torn should I consider leaving DP and eventually finding someone to be with that wants marriage, start putting some pressure and ultimatums on him, or just stay in what is actually a happy relationship, but risk never getting married & ending up resenting him for it.
What do you think?
Opinions please x

There was a programme on R4 the other day with Clive Anderson, on the laws on cohabitation and the fact that many people are under the illusion that there is such thing as a common-law wife. You can listen to it here. Interesting his guest says the male brain assimilates commitment when it is formalised. It's a good programme anyway.

You have a child with somebody in the military you are not married to?

I assume therefore that you are the primary child carer? How is your career now after 15months? Where do you live? How do you pay the rent/mortgage? What happens if something happens to him????

This to me is the most important thing... life insurance, pensions, housing etc. if the worst happened... but you're not me. Would you be willing to have a no-guests registry do if he agreed to that in order to protect you and your child? Or are you sold on the whole big white marquee wedding? Why do YOU want to marry him?

justhayley I totally understand your desire to get married. My parents never got married and I have a different surname to my mum and my half sister and I always noticed this.

I was determined that when I grew up I would get married and then have kids. Luckily for me DH wanted that too so now DH, DS, DD and me are all part of the "Terrys" family and that makes me so happy and proud.

For anyone out there who thinks this is superficial, maybe it is but I feel pretty amazing for having this and therefore I understand anyone who wants it.

I don't think you need to give DP an ultimatum but sit down, tell him how you feel and work out what you both want. At the end of the day if you are meant to be together you will find a solution you are both happy with.

Good luck!

Either ask him and put an end to giving him all the power where your future is concerned or forget it. I don't believe in marriage as a concept but am happy for people who do to do it and I get a new dress and some champers! But when I hear about women in 2013 waiting for their partners to validate them I feel that you are doing yourselves a great disservice. If it is the only way you see your relationship do what laqueen did otherwise ask him.

An ultimatum was in my head when I was with dh.

If after 2 years there wasn't a mere wiff of marriage mentioned, he'd had been gone.
So I played devils advocate all the way. From him asking after two weeks, should we go to Rejkuvik fir honeymoon, to what wedding dress I was going to wearwhen at a friends wedding. All brushed off with 'who says you'll be there'.
Anyway, didn't wait 2 years, as he popped the question on our one year anniversary, and married the year later. I was 32 when I got married.

Although, I wouldn't take my advice, as the way dh is behaving, he'll be lucky to see the year through

Hi all, thanks so much for all your opinions - even the harsh ones :)

LaQueen I think you are me lol.

Military wise the official line is unmarried couples can not live together on the base in married quarters. However if you have children you can still apply and if there is any empty houses after all the married couples get assigned them then you can have one. He has recently been moved and where he is is really cut off from the world and not great for children. Where he is based Ian that popular with the married couples and his welfare team have said we wouldnt have a problem getting army accommodation.
However I/we decided that I'm not going to live on the base at the moment. I love where I am at he moment and DP comes home every weekend. This works for us at the moment. I'm not prepared to leave my support network job house everything to live in married quarters without being married. If we were to split up or he died god forbid I would essentially loose my home and be left with nothing.
I am in his Will but his mum is his NOK.

Marriage is a deal breaker for me. I may be old fashioned and feminists would hate me but it's just the way it is. I used to want the big rock and White wedding but now it's far less about all that. I want to be married in our village church where our son and hopefully future children were christened. I don't no why I don't feel like we can build a life without being married perhaps it is a security thing but making those vowels are everything to me.
With him in the Army I really do mean in sickness and health. If he were to loose limbs etc I would care for him. If he gets posted abroad I would drop everything and go I'm 100% committed to him and 'that piece of paper" would show me that he is also committed to me.
I don't see a child as a commitment - maybe because I'm from a broken home and after 17 years and two children I saw my dad walk away from my mum & us.

This thread has actually really helped me. I appreciate all the responses.

I havnt been waiting 8.5 years to be married. We got together whilst at university aged 20 there's no way at that age I wanted to get married.
We moved in together at 25, he joined the Army at 27 and I had my son at 28. it was really when he started the Army application process and we had been living together a year that marriage started to come up & it started to feel like the right time. Before I became pregnant he always said he would propose after he finished at Sandhurst (officer training). At this point we spoke about it loads but wanted to be practical. Lots of couples 80% in fact break up when the DP goes into training for a year. We distribution want to et married before he went for me not to be happy with him being away so much & for things not to work out, we both agrees to experienced the lifestyle for a year first. During that year I got pregnant. For me I feel that's even more o a reason to be married, but, and he hasn't said this, I feel like now he feels like there's less of a reason as as we are a family and connected to each other forever regardless of marriage.

What if he won't? I said no but dp and I are still together 22 years on but it's not a deal breaker for him it may be for you.

yes exactly niceguy - that was my point

i think most men (whether they admit it or not) know very very quickly if they want to marry someone. if they are not sure after even a few MONTHS, i would say they are not that arsed about the person they are with.

exactly lequeen

i have seen a lot of my male mates do the same

Can i just say, I'm a feminist and marriage is (well, was, I'm married now) a deal breaker for me. It's not just a piece of paper, and it sounds even more important for you with a partner in the military.

Honestly, i think you should sit down and explain your feelings without bringing timescales into in. But have one in your head - if he hasn't proposed in that time, you ask him. And if he says no, or tries to dodge, i think you have your answer.

So justhayley why don't you propose?

Why is it the blokes call though?

Niceguy just read your post and I must admit you make a very valid point. I guess my DF and I are both good examples. Prior to him I was in a 11 year relationship and said no to that proposal and no to kids with him. DF was 38 when we met, had never been married, no children and always said he would never marry or have kids. We met and were engaged (getting married this September) and pregnant with in 2/3 years.. I guess we both just hadn't met the right person as you very well point out Niceguy. It's not a big issue when you want to do it, it's only a big issue when you are not sure or don't want to do it with that person.

You need to find our whether it is marriage itself he objects to full stop or just you I know that sounds harsh but my dp knows I wouldn't Mary anyone so it's a non issue for us. If he has a problem with marriage in general you need to decide if you can live with that.i would just lay our cards on the table and tell him exactly howmyoumfeel

I can see why OP is reluctant to propose- she's given birth to his child, supported him through training, is preparing to spend the next 20+ years following him around the UK (the world, potentially) for the sake of his career. That's a lot of commitment. It's not surprising that she wants him to show the same in return, especially if to him "it's just a bit of paper".

But the fact is that she's waiting and waiting for something that frankly, may never come. Cut the crap and ask. At least then you'll know where you stand. Aren't you worried that he knows full well that you want to get married but hasn't asked because he doesn't want to? How long so you want to wait before finding out?

Just ask him if he envisages your relationship being long term / forever.

If he says no don't bother with ultimatum and time to leave.

If he says yes, then say that you'd like to get married at some point especially now you have DS, and perhaps he could have a think about when its a good time.

Do women still wait for a proposal?

How very 1950s.

Blimey.

OP, your situation is obviously made more complicated by the fact that he is in the Forces and so marriage offers you much more protection and stability. If I was in your situation I would be arguing for marriage purely for your own protection and for your DS's.

However, only on MN do I find people willing to say that a man who won't get married is a man who isn't commited to his partner or his family, rather than any other reason.

I bet a woman who doesn't want to get married is considered an independent feminist

I'm not married. I understand DP's reasons why he doesn't want to get married, I trust him, we have a child together, and our legal and financial affairs are tied up. If marriage is something that you personally feel very strongly about then you need to have a sensible conversation with your partner about it and explain why it is so important to you. But marriage isn't equally important to everyone, so FFS stop telling couples who have decided marriage isn't for them that they are less commited or the man is clearly going to bugger off at the drop of a hat.

My DH did not want to get married or have children at the beginning although wanted to be with me. We split up as for me it wasn't something you could compromise about. We got back together two days later, as he decided that being with me was more important than his fears of marriage etc... and now have 2 dcs and have been married 15 years.

I'm not suggesting leaving - particularly when you have a dc & the fact you love him. - just be clear about what you want and when you want it by. You are really clear it is about the marriage and not the wedding - and ask him to be clear with you about what he wants. It's the decent thing to do and then you will know where you stand.

I agree thurlow in the years we have been together at least half of my married mates have not gone the distance and mostly affairs. You can sort and indeed should sort your finances no one says this to men though we just assume they will which is insulting in itself. My closest friend has 4 kids only one still under 18 and so marriage hasn't really given her a huge amount of protection ESP as her ex has a new wife and children.