Are SAHMS discriminated against. Red magazine are doing an article about it.

[Darkesteyes]

Just seen this on twitter.

Are stay at home mums discriminated against? Are you one and unhappy with benefits, or feel judged? Tell us.
[email protected]

"The strange thing is that I have never, ever met a man who decided to go part time/give up his job because he was worried about the effect of full time childcare on his child's well being."

Really? How odd. I know plenty of fathers who have given up work to be at home for their DC.

No me neither. Must try and stop now. It's starting to feel wierd, particularly when he trys to lift my top up in public

Sorry, that was to golden

You see this is where the debate gets nonsensical, when people state their personal opinion as fact. You may want to be with your kids more than your husband does kazoo. That's fine. But you cannot extrapolate from that, that all mums feel the need to be with their children 24/7 or indeed that all men enjoy being with their children less. You just can't.
You may not relate to that, because it's not your personal experience, but so what? You don't need to. You just need to accept it as true for other people.

I'm quite glad in a way that people are now nailing thief colours to the mast. Morethanpotatoprint said earlier that some parents see childcare as an inferior choice. She didn't say 'inferior for their own child' or 'the childcare provider I looked at in my location were inferior' - just a generalisation that it is inferior to not using it. And this is the rub isn't it? There are a minority of SAHM who seem unable to just be content with the decision they've made. It seems they can't enjoy it unless they are putting someone else down. This is where we usually get the unsubstantiated comments about childcare leading to depression, out of control children, less good outcomes etc... Or someone will link to that idiot Oliver James, or steve biddulph, or google some study carried out on kindergarten kids in downtown new York, and use it as some sort of strange 'proof' that childcare is bad. They fail to understand that a) James and biddulph want to write marketable books and b) the rest of us could easily google and link research showing different outcomes such as better academic results for children of parents in work... But we don't because you know what , PARENTS bring up their OWN children, and know them best.

We've reached a stage now where there are many adults who as children went to childminders or nursery. We're not the trailblazers any more, our children are not the first to do this. I don't see around me a distinct category of adults whose parents worked when they were small who are now unemployed, unhappy, unable to have successful relationships, nor do I see a category of adults who had SAHM who bag all the good careers and have a monopoly on successful relationships. I don't see any pattern of adults being closer to the parent who was with then more as a child (indeed i said earlier, I am closer to my dad than my mum even though she was a traditional SAHM)

So be a SAHM if you want and you are content with it, and a sign that you're content will be that you don't need to put the boot in to WOHM. Embrace the differences! Maybe your dd will have a career one day and I'm sure you won't put the boot into her!

littlechickpea, why don't you answer my question? I said I had one offer of freelance not that I was inundated.

We are not rich and that's why we can't afford the nanny that you obviously have?

You keep saying you can't take me seriously, I don't understand why my last point wasn't serious enough for you. You manage to be a career mum and your DP works to?

Janey68 you are right. My mum was a single mother with three kids and she worked hard her entire life. Didn't do any of us any arm. We are all successful in our chosen field. I am very proud of her achievements.

littlechickpea,

'BTW, my DF and I (both MDs for different companies) work long hours in high pressure roles and we too support each other and manage to organise things round family and work.'

Please enlighten how do you manage to do this and ever see your children?

Goldenbear He has no choice but to work way beyond contractual hours and has to do some 'social' stuff out of the office to help in winning contracts. There is no way he can start doing 50/50 with childcare, which is what it would mean if I returned to work. Do you know how many people are willing to jump in his place, especially at the practice he works for. They recently had a memo about how it wasn't good for business for people to only work contractual hours

That's just standard in any profession. Its normal, par for the course, nothing unusual. I have to do it in my job. I actually get quite annoyed with DH's work at times because they assume I will be able to fill in when they send him away on business at short notice, but I actually earn only a little less than him (and I just scrape into the 3%).

Not putting the boot in Janey,you seem a bit sensitive tbh.

Re your "research" the only studies that show benefits of childcare are those where children come from problem families so tbf any setting is going to be better.However the vast maj of children come from homes where there are no problems and the negatives of childcare (particularly nursery)are often highlighted in many studies.

I go by my experience as I know a lot of mums who work in all sectors,I am the minority.Not one of these many mums are happy leaving their dc,not one. it is heartbreaking.

As to putting the boot into my dd I want her to be able to do what she thinks is best for her dc and hopefully by the time she is a mum mums taking some time off to be with their dc will be appreciated and facilitated.

And now I am going egg hunting.

To be fair to Goldenbear, I think her posts come across as somewhat obtuse because English isn't her first language.

I have to say there are few posters on here who claim to be SAHMs who come across as spoilt princesses, with totally unrealistic expectations of the workplace and what employers are looking for. I would think that attitude is the barrier to their employment, rather than their current or past status as SAHMs. Its the same with some recent graduates, employers want to avoid the sort spoilt princess/prince employee who think the world revolves around them.

Statistics now show that young women in their twenties earn more than young men of the same age. I know several employers who genuinely believe that they will get more work out of women than men, and who tend to favour female employees. At my DH's work, there are two men, who despite being highly qualified and paid engineers in their late thirties, have gone part-time to have easier lives - before having DCs! (although they do now).

Finally, plenty of Scandinavia countries have women returning to work and using childcare, it is the norm and considered good for children. And if you've ever spent much time in a Scandinavian country and compare the behaviour of the people there to the behaviour of your average Brit, you can see that its working...

littlemissAbbs, I know that a lot of people work beyond contractual hours but he CANNOT do that for half the week! It is not standard, it is late and not compatible with me working half of the week at all. When do you see your children then?

Why I don't take you seriously. You keep contradicting (coming across as lying) yourself.

I actually despair at some of this recruitment 'advice'. If I had the misfortune to come across some of these ignorant attitudes at an interview, I would make my excuses and leave. Luckily, I'm in the fortunate position of not having to accept whatever job that comes along. Enlightened, progressive employers can well see the competitive advantage of employing a diverse workforce and that includes people who have a SAH background. I have been offered freelance work with people who are very, very wealthy but they have money to invest in new ideas and as such they are open to employing that diversity.

But you are not rich and can't afford childcare. Give it a rest.

You're going egg hunting again kazoo?!

Talk of women enabling their husbands careers just depresses me.

I know occasionally men enable their wives careers, but this is far rarer.

Fair enough to sah because of beliefs about how children should be raised, but to do so just to facilitate more success for dh, especially where DW has own career pre.-dcs seems so old-fashioned and 1950s.

I know plenty of sahm who have facilitated theur husbands careers and they are now divorced, out of the job market too long, and living on a pittance.

Oh yea then we found out it was one offer of freelance work and not people ( meaning more than one) offering investment! Mmmmmm

What are you talking about LittleMissAbbs, I have been posting on here since 2007 and my first language is English. I read English Lit at Uni FFS.

Maybe the barrier is the uneducated, unenlightened interviewers that SAHP come across when they are trying to return to work!

Oh and there are those worried re the Swedish model as problems are starting to occur-school standards going down,behaviour issues,teenage problems etc,etc and parents wanting support to stay at home they don't feel is there.

Now I'm off,buckets at the ready!

Littlechickpea, so enlighten me- how do you run the family set up with your partner, how have you managed to make it a success with your children?

Boo I know occasionally men enable their wives careers, but this is far rarer. Fair enough to sah because of beliefs about how children should be raised, but to do so just to facilitate more success for dh, especially where DW has own career pre.-dcs seems so old-fashioned and 1950s

It is depressing, isn't it? It makes you wonder what is the point in raising girls, if all they are going to do is stay at home and facilitate a man for 75% of their life. The UK is a bit strange right now I think, very sexist and getting worse. I think we have to question why we are raising so many female children with no ambition or motivation.

I know I came from a similar educational and career background as my DH, we both work in the professions, as do many of my female friends at work. But DH is an engineer, and that is quite a sexist profession and very male dominated, and I was honestly so shocked to meet so many female partners of his work colleagues that had never gone out to get much education, or had a proper job ever in their lives, or didn't even have a hobby or sport that they did out of the home.

LittleMiss, how condescending?

Come and apply for a job in my company. You won't be asked if you have children, you won't need to volunteer that information at all. You'll be asked the same questions as any other candidate and if you have the requisite qualifications and skills, and present yourself the best then you'll get the job.

I have to say there are few posters on here who claim to be SAHMs who come across as spoilt princesses, with totally unrealistic expectations of the workplace and what employers are looking for. I would think that attitude is the barrier to their employment, rather than their current or past status as SAHMs. Its the same with some recent graduates, employers want to avoid the sort spoilt princess/prince employee who think the world revolves around them.

Very true.

Come and apply for a job in my company. You won't be asked if you have children, you won't need to volunteer that information at all. You'll be asked the same questions as any other candidate and if you have the requisite qualifications and skills, and present yourself the best then you'll get the job.

I second this!