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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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I'm probably being entitled/unreasonable, but should the teacher wait on my child?

999 replies

WhenIsBedtime · 06/03/2013 09:59

My child has high functioning autism. Attends a mainstream school. Her issues are very mild. No need for an assistant or anything.

The way it works in the school yard each morning is this:

Bell goes at 9am.
All children run to their class marks and line up.
Class teachers come out, and guide them into the building, starting with the youngest to the oldest class.

My child is in the youngest class.

Perhaps once or twice a week, we're a few minutes late. The bell has already gone and her class has lined up by the time we reach the yard. However, we're never so late that her class has already gone inside by the time we arrive. We can always see them.

The entrance gate is at the other end of the huge yard from where the children line up.

On our late days, as we arrive at the gate, the teacher has already came out. He can see my dd running towards the line, but he decides to take the class inside anyway, without waiting on her.

By the time my (very slow) daughter reaches the place her class lines up, they are already inside the building, and the other classes are going inside.

My daughter then gets really upset as she doesn't understand it's okay to go through the door without her own teacher or class. She doesn't understand she should just run ahead of the next class going in, or even join their line instead. Parents aren't normally allowed in the yard. But when this happens, i run in to her and try and convince her to go into the building. But she says "No, I'm waiting on Mr Teacher and my class."

The teacher from an older class then takes her inside for me instead.

I realise such upset/confusion for my child wouldn't happen if i was there with her before 9am every day, but lateness does happen. And other children usually run into the yard up to five minutes late, behind us, but they quite happily join on the back of another class's line. Whereas my daughter won't without a heck of a lot of protest and causing a scene.

Personally (and here's where i'm probably being unreasonable), I think dd's teacher should wait on her if he sees dd running towards him and her class in the yard. It takes no more than a minute for her to run across the yard from the gate.

Obviously, if we weren't at the gate by the time he came out to greet the class, or if we were very late, i wouldn't expect him to wait. But when he can see dd at the other end of the yard, why can't he just wait? Thus avoiding her getting upset and confused?

I've spoken to him about it before, and he says that because his class is the youngest, and goes inside first, if he was to wait, it would delay all the other classes, and it would mean he'd have to occupy his own class for an additional minute.

Just wanted to add, that the children never have to wait outside in adverse weather conditions. They're able to go straight into the building on these days, rather than line up outside and wait on a teacher.

I just don't get why he can't wait an extra minute on dd, yet it's okay for him to be several minutes late on occassion, leaving his class waiting outside, holding up the other classes.

Sorry for the ramble. I'm probably just being precious/unreasonable, but i'd appreciate some opinions.

OP posts:
phoenixrose314 · 06/03/2013 10:30

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Thingiebob · 06/03/2013 10:32

It sounds like you are doing your best. I have no idea about the complexities of dealing with a child with autism so don't feel able to advise.

Autism or not, I would say you probably need to make sure she is at school on time. Perhaps you need extra support?

foslady · 06/03/2013 10:32

OP, you might not like this, but have you thought about having your daughter re assessed. Her behaviours sound more acute than low level.

FlowerTruck · 06/03/2013 10:33

Who suggested you stay up all night ? Hmm
I suggest you walk away from this thread, as its making you upset. Why don't you post somewhere a bit more supportive. I feel for you, but the teacher honestly can't be expected to wait so often.

stormforce10 · 06/03/2013 10:33

sorry YABU. Why should the rest of the school wait for your DD?

Get there on time. DD is in year 2 and has been late ONCE since she started in reception and that was because there was a massive crash which gridlocked our side of the city and we found out later more than 70 children were late that day. We do the school run on the bus with a baby by the way

TaggieCampbellBlack · 06/03/2013 10:33

DD used to need to get up at 6 so she could fit in everything at her own pace (including an hour long meltown about not going to school).

Talk to school.

YouTheCat · 06/03/2013 10:33

With my severely autistic ds, I found getting up later worked better. The school morning routine was solid and meant: up, wash, dress, breakfast, shoes and coat on and then out the door. We only had to wait for the minibus as he was in a special school, but we were still always on time unless something went awry with the routine and he had a meltdown.

And his twin sister was always in school on time as well. Ready to go the minute we'd waved ds off.

The reason this worked for us was planning. All uniform and school items were got ready the night before. I made packed lunches whilst the kids ate breakfast. Bags by the door ready to be just picked up.

There was no time for any faffing about and it meant I got to languish in bed until 7.30 which was a godsend as ds was often still roaming at 1am.

WilsonFrickett · 06/03/2013 10:33

OK, so the school like to remind you your DD is the only one with autism in the school? WTAF??? And yet you get no support and she's 'doing fine'.

OP I say this with nothing but good intentions - she is not doing fine. If she can't walk to school because she can't help picking up rubbish, if she has a melt down because a motor bike goes past her, she is not doing fine at all.

TheChaoGoesMu · 06/03/2013 10:33

I think you need a meeting with the school to see how they can help you manage this. If you can get there for 8.30 is there anyway they can unlock the gate for you a bit earlier, if you take responsibility for dd until the rest of the kids come in? You could really do with some sort of advocate. Has dd got a social worker involved?

Halfling · 06/03/2013 10:33

As a fairly disorganised person myself, I sympathise with you OP. I have the same problem in taking my DS to school.

What works for me is - GETTING ORGANISED. Sounds simple but needs practise.

  • House key/car key in its place
  • Uniform set out the night before
  • School Bag/Lunch box/umbrella/PE Kit/Show and Tell in the correct place
  • 15 mins of margin for meltdowns and mess. Instead of 9 am, aim for 8:45 am
  • Get up 15 mins earlier than you usually do

Practise till your morning routine works like a well oiled machine. Other parents manage this and so can you. There really is no excuse for getting late twice in a week.

AitchTwoOhOneTwo · 06/03/2013 10:34

i think you definitely need to speak to the school, then, and ask for some sort of risk assessment re the gate opening time.

cory · 06/03/2013 10:34

cross-posted, Greensleeves Smile

When I started writing my post (very slowly) the majority of the posters were of the "just make her be on time" variety.

I do not actually have much experience of ASD- but I understand that not all children with ASD cause exactly the same problems, and I have experience of a child who would cause sudden and unexpected upsets of what seemed like an immaculate scenario for getting her to school on time.

I still don't think that the school should take responsibility - but I can understand why the OP may not be able to do much more than she is either.

FireOverBabylon · 06/03/2013 10:35

OP, what friends does your daughter have? could she be persuaded to get out in time to meet "Charlotte" as she walks past your house, and that be an incentive to get her out the door? Also, if she was walking with someone, would the passing motorbike be less of an upset?

I would stick her school shoes and jumper on a high shelf, then she can't hide the shoes and the jumper can cover up if she's drawn on herself. Does she consciously know that she's deliberately doing these things in the house to stop her having to go to school? If she does, then you have to try and work around them, even if she leaves without shoes or with you carrying her coat, because she is going to school whatever obstacles she puts in your way. This isn't about the litter or the motorbike but the "if I tip cereal in my hair, I don't have to leave for school".

MiaowTheCat · 06/03/2013 10:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TaggieCampbellBlack · 06/03/2013 10:35

WhenIsBedtime

Please repost in special needs for strategies and ideas sad what to ask school for.

WilsonFrickett · 06/03/2013 10:35

Pheonix this lots of children in mainstream schools have autism and at least in terms of scheduling, should be treated no differently than any other is utter nonsense.

Many, many children with autism have to have adjustments to scheduling because their sensory difficulties make things like the normal crush at going in time exceptionally difficult to handle. Your post may apply to some children with ASD, but certainly not all of them.

AbigailAdams · 06/03/2013 10:36

I think you have had a bit of an unnecessary kicking here OP. You already thought you were unreasonable so it was obvious to me that you were reaching out for a bit of help and were reaching the end of your tether. So I agree with other and I really would post in Special Needs to perhaps get some tips for coping in the morning. Getting up at 5.30 every morning must be a real strain.

Sending you and your DD a hug. You really sound like you need it.

Greensleeves · 06/03/2013 10:37

If you do repost in SN, I'd advise changing the thread title.

Things that have worked for ds1 to make mornings a bit more bearable:

Visual timetable where the morning routine is set out sequentially and he can remove a picture as each bit is done

Breakfast stuff and uniform laid out the night before so he knows exactly what he is doing. Uniform in a pile in the order in which he needs to put it on

Toothbrush with a timer on it (he has one that flashes for 1 minute so he knows when to stop)

When he was younger we might have used a sticker for getting out of the house by 8.30

As he's got older we have allowed him to spend the time he's saved on something he likes (looking at Youtube videos of the London Underground) - he gets up early and does his morning routine, and he knows that if his hair is tied back and his shoes are on, his time is his own.

Notquitegrownup · 06/03/2013 10:37

Whattime, you sound exhausted! I would echo what others have said and recommend that you post on the SN board. You have chosen the most contentious area of MN to ask for support and help. Not a good idea!

I think the fact that you haven't posted there is, however, significant. You also say that your lateness to school is not due to your daughter's SN, but that "lateness happens" - then you go on to describe how she is late because of her hiding her shoes, refusing to go, the motorbike going by etc. These are all related to her autism. Don't underplay it. You are probably working very hard at the moment coming to terms with life with a 5 yo dd - it's exhausting at the best of times - but this problem won't go away. Get advise and help from the school, from the SN board, from other mothers, but brace yourself - it will mean a bit more hard work.

You say that you are probably being entitled/enreasonable. You are not, but you are looking for someone to help you and sadly, this is another of those jobs which, sadly, you ain't going to get much help with. You are going to have to do it, though maybe with some advice.

3.5 hours is enough to get you both to the school gate by 9am. You don't need to get up earlier. You need your sleep. But you do need a bit more advice/support to work out how you are going to get there, and how you can help your dd if you don't manage to get there on time. You need to sit down with someone understanding, a large plate of chocolate biscuits, get a big hug and decide when you are ready to do this one too - on top of all of the other things that you are doing.

Best of luck.

lucysnowe · 06/03/2013 10:37

Poor OP you've gone in for a bashing here. I can imagine how irritating and upsetting it is to see the teacher noticing you, but still ignoring and sending everyone in regardless. But yes, if your daughter does walk slowly I can see how she could hold everyone up.

Is there any way you can change her routine, make it so she always goes in after the others have gone in, so it's more consistent?

TantrumsAndBalloons · 06/03/2013 10:38

No, that makes sense OP, being early being an even bigger issue.

Ok, so I can tell you what I would do, but obviously it may or may not work for you.

Can you aim to be ready by 8;30, ie shoes on, coat on, bag ready. If you get to 8:30 and all is well, can she do a little 10 minute activity? If theres a problem, you have time to try and sort it out without being late?

Or is there a possibility of the school making alternative arrangement for dd, that do not hold up anyone else?
Can you take her into the classroom yourself, after all the classes have gone in?

EdwiniasRevenge · 06/03/2013 10:38

What is the latest you jave ever arrived? Sounds like 2-5mins late?

In which case get up 5mins earlier. Leave 5 mins earlier. It doesn't matter what causes the 5min delay but you seem really confident that there will be something which is completely fair enough with any child irrespective of her additional needs.

5mins. Surely getting up 5mins will save you the 5mins while she is stood at the door waiting to go in. Surely getting up 5 mins will save you and ypur dd the stress and distress caused by your perssitent inability to get her there on time. They may still be times when something out of your control means you have a 7 minute delay. So she may still be late occassionally. But much much less frequently.

It won't be good for your dds learning to be driving her emotions like this regularly first thing in the morning.

It is not your teachers responsibility to get her there on time. It is your responsibility to do your best to get her there on time. If your best means getting up 5mins earlier then that's what you need to do.

Look at it from the perspective of the teacher. Your dd is 1 minute late. So he waits. By the time she has joined the line he can see little Johnny arriving who is 2 mins late....then Josephine who is 3 mins late. There has to be a cut off somewhere and the teacher makes that decision.

BabyMakesTheBellyGoRound · 06/03/2013 10:39

One of my mindees had a brain injury which leaves him very impulsive and with zero sense of danger. I used a back pack with a reins attached.

TeaMakesItAllPossible · 06/03/2013 10:40

When that's tough. And hard to manage.

Look at goingdownhill's posts. There are some practical tips that could really work.

I think aiming to leave 15 mins earlier is the key. And building in time at the school to play/read etc. I did this with my DS. It meant that neither he nor I were stressing and there was time to deal with the unanticipated crap. I am not a routine sort of gal but eight years of school runs means I run my house like a military boot camp between 7-8.30 every day. It pains me to do it. But it does work.

Perhaps rather than asking the teacher to wait you can ask to take her in before the line-up to get her settled in.

FlowerTruck · 06/03/2013 10:40

Hope your ok ? You've had a battering. Brew

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