To expect that a mum supervises the children on a play date?

[Livvilou]

Please bear with this long post. At my DDs school play dates are common. I am not so bothered about them as I didn't go to people's houses when I was a child. My DD went to a child's house the mother told me she would pick her up from school. I called later and it seemed to me the mother was not at her house as expected. I sent my DH to pick up our daughter and the mother of the child said she had run an errand and left my DD with her partner and her daughter. Her partner had also picked up my DD from school but I didn't even know his name, he has only ever said hello to me and she said she would pick up my DD. my DD didn't have a good time at the playdate because her daughter didn't want to play with my DD because another friend of hers was also at the house. The same mother asked if my DD could go on another play date and this time I spoke to her about what happened last time. She claimed to have no knowledge of the fact that her daughter didn't want to play with mine. Which is ludicrous as she told this to my husband when he came to pick up DD and my DD told me what happened too.
Today my DD went to another child house. This child was supposed to come to our house and this morning her father tell me she wants my DD to come to her house. I said this isn't what has been agreed. The father says he asked his daughter today and she wanted my DD to come to their house. He then asks my DD if she wants to go to their house. Of course she says yes. I was livid! The mother made the original appointment with me, and didn't tell me she would be working. I dropped my DD off at the house and her friend comes to the door in a vest and pants and I wonder what she is doing. Her father says she is dressing up. I pick my DD up an hour later and find that she has also been dressing up and has to put her trousers and socks on before she can go home with me. I do not feel happy having my DD being supervised my male partners. I am not saying that anything has happened but I can't imagine why this isn't seen as strange. My DH spoke with our DD and told her she is not to undress at anyone's house and she said the house was really hot, and she is right as I remember thinking that as I stood at the living room door. I understand that dads also look after their kids and i think that is great, but in the climate that we live today, I need to feel I am doing every thing I can to keep my DD safe without being paranoid. Any thoughts as I have been in a distressed state all day. Not only because a 5 year old managed to change the plans, but because I feel now I have to explain myself to keep my DD safe. I am sure I will upset someone if I say what I really want, ie. for the mother to be there at the play date. I have felt terrible all day from the worry.

So ODFOD isn't Oh, do fuck off dear then

Would someone like to pm me?

Sorry ? at end of wrong sentence there

Oh dear. When my youngest son and my DD were that age they didn't need an excuse to strip off - didn't matter where they were. DD waqs once brought home by the neighbour because she had climbed out of the sitting room window and set off for the park in her pyjama top and DS2 answered the door to my friend in nothing but a tiger's head from the dressing-up box..... They didn't have a problem with nudity at all - in fact it was mixing with other kids at school that taught them it simply wasn't done!

Other people have different rules and I don't really see what is wrong with the rules in the house in your OP.

I thought ODFOD = Oh do fuck off dear. What does it mean?

This is ludacrous! I've only read the op though so don't know if op has admitted to this being some sort of weird joke

But if not, then you are being very unreasonable and very judgemental op!!

I've only read the op though just a suggestion but try reading the thread otherwise it's a bit pointless posting don't you think?

OP - on (about!) page 4, you say that you were brought up to treat everyone with respect.
tbh, I don't think you are showing a lot of respect to the 2 gentlemen you refer to in your OP, nor, by default, half of all parents by your generalisations.
What you are implying about them - indeed - all fathers it seems, is extremely offensive and upsetting and sad. Yet to are offended at the replies!?!

She didn't imply BackforGood. Some vicious posters have pinned her against the wall and she has reacted defensively and in anger. Fully understandable I think.

She has been told that she needs counselling. That she is paranoid. That she needs serious help.

Her use of the phrases "in this day and age" and "playdate" have been analysed and ridiculed and then there are the comments which have been deleted.

What the OP did say was: "I understand all what has been said and I am certainly not suggesting that every man is a paedo as my DH I would trust with my l holders life. "

She was taking all comments and criticisms on board and yet she was still torn apart. So BackforGood I think you need to read her comments in context and see what she was replying to. I have been caught up in one of these threads before and it's very easy to dig yourself into a hole when the horde of vicious posters are nit picking over your every word, sentence and phrase to find any kind of ammunition to hurl at you.

This is the worst kind of Mumsnet and I really do think that MNHQ ought to warn posters who are guilty of doing this. Or simply do away with the AIBU threads altogether as they serve no purpose except to provide entertainment for the masses of wankers who delight in bullying others.

she is paranoid and needs help you sound charming.

I am sorry Rhubard, but I totally disagree with you.
I agree with BackForGood.
Op wrote 4 posts before I even posted and has not posted since.
I think you have been far too sympathetic to someone who has some very odd ideas.

Only saying, KellyElly, that how do you know the posters that suggested that are not right?
That's a pretty uptight OP, and pretty strange attitude to have towards all fathers of her dcs future friends.
I've 3dc, and over many years, as many pick ups / drop offs have been done by their friends fathers as they have by their mothers. I genuinely don't know anyone who would consider that to be a problem in any way. I do think if someone is that paranoid about every man they meet, must have some issus that they would probably benefit from talking through with someone.

To be honest, I see where you are coming from. You like people to stick to plans, because you base your decision whether something is right for your dd on what you know about the situation, and you dont like that this changes.

I think in future, have a few playdates at home so you get to know the children, and see how they interact with your dd. Dont let anybody talk you around. If you have invited and they have agreed and then try change it just say:
"Sorry, that does not work for me today, we have made our plans around having Olivia/Nelly/Sally home for tea and play and my dd is really looking forward to it. Next time, eh?"

And dont let your dd go home with people you feel uncertain of.

I will admit when i read the op i thought the op sounded hard work, but actually i find this sort of thing tricky albeit for different reasons so I've had a little think. i can empathise about being anxious about our children when they're not around and the difficulty in following the rules that nobody has told you about. This is particularly difficult if you don't have any frame of reference because you didn't go to play as a child yourself (my sister did a lot because my mum was friends with her friends' parents, me much less so because my mother didn't have as many friendships with my peers).

I think dressing up is fine and considered acceptable by most people.

Nipping out and leaving dad in charge fine. As is dad hosting the play date. i would probably mention dh would be hosting because i'd then abdicate all further arrangements to him because I can't be arsed. Some random boyfriend or casual aquaintance of the parent you've arranged the play date with, not so much.

Rearranging the play date without asking you and in front of your child is very bad manners. I would be annoyed with that.

Male parents parenting is also fine. It's not solely a woman's job to parent.

Not knowing about minor fallings out at a play date is understandable. You have to leave them to it a bit and supervising every interaction isn't good for the dc and their burgeoning social skills.

However I would also argue it's your right as a parent not to send your child to play dates and to always arrange them at your house if that is what you are comfortable with. I think that is a much better option than no play dates or passing on your own fears to your child - let them keep their innocence and enjoy themselves.

I think some posters have been quite hard on the OP. Bear in mind this is the OPs firstchild. In a similar situation (1st playmate, reception aged dc) I would makesure I was there. However plans do change. TBH dd and her mate's are always I a state of undress at pick up time, totally normal.

Some of you really do take the biscuit. You are now mental health specialists are you? Calling the OP paranoid and in need of help?

I suppose I must also need help as I can see where she is coming from, so why don't you analyse me whilst you are at it?

The OP didn't want her 5yo dd being picked up from school by a father she had never met - understandable. Presumably her dd had never met the father either - what does that say about never going off with strangers? It's unacceptable to arrange to pick a child up from school and then send your partner, a stranger to that child, to pick her up instead.

The OP didn't like the fact that this man had been left in charge of her dd and her dd's friend. Again it's understandable when you consider she has never met this man and her dd is also unfamiliar with him. It seems that the girls weren't really supervised and her dd had a bad time as a result.

The OP was put out by the fact that an arrangement made with a mother for the OP to have her dd's friend was altered at the very last minute and pressure was put on her to allow her dd to go off with this child's father instead to their house. Again the OP doesn't say that she knows the man and yes, I'd be put out and naffed off by that too. I hate it when someone changes plans at the very last minute and then puts pressure on me to agree to them.

The OP was upset to find her dd in just her underwear when she arrived to get her. Again this is understandable. The OP does not know this man, he is a stranger as far as she and her dd are concerned and so yes, call me paranoid but I wouldn't want my child parading around in a strangers house in their underwear either.

Nothing strikes me as paranoid. Nothing screams PAEDOPHILE at me. She just describes normal parental worries.

What I did read where posters ridiculing everything that she said and suggesting that she had mental health problems.

Since when the fuck as having mental health problems suddenly become an insult to hurl at people? What the actual fuck is that all about?

As for ridiculing what she says - how old are some of you? Fucking 7?

I suggest you have a go at me. Because I fully understand where the OP is coming from. I would NOT be happy with a stranger turning up to pick up my child - male or female. I would NOT be happy with someone changing plans at the last minute. I would NOT be happy for my child to be left alone with someone I did not know.

Now I understand that the OP has some responsibility in this. She should have taken the time to get to know the parents by insisting that she come along to initial playdates or having the children round her house.
She can also have the talk about keeping her dd safe and now would be a good time to do so.

So quit with the mental health insults because as someone who HAS suffered mental health problems, I find this bandying around of the label as very insulting, pathetic and ignorant.

op mental state or motives cannot be guessed,nor should she be subjected to ignorant guesses
Fortunately,it's obvious only the very vacuous attempt to guess someone else wellbeing
Frankly speaks more of their composure and manners that they're so quick to attack.nice

Oh good grief,citing Wikipedia as if definitive source of psychiatry and diagnostics
Really hardly a reputable source,not known for it's evidence base and clarity
But then if you go about citing wiki,I think you already lack intellectual rigour

Well said Rhubarb. While I don't hold all the same opinions when it comes to my children I can see how other parents like the op would. Equally I can also see why the other mother would not see some of these things being a problem and how a misunderstanding or upset would occur.

I think sometimes we forget there's a person behind the screen :(

Oh dear. My posts seem to be really grating.

And whose gettign picky now? Because I quote something. Is it not o.,k. to quote from wiki, now? It was the first link that came up when I looked for a dictionary defintion of paranoia. But that not acceptable, eh?

"As for ridiculing what she says - how old are some of you? Fucking 7? "
I never ridiculed what she said Rhubarb.
I totally diagree with you.

But my disagreement with Rhubarb and Scottishmummy, seems to be getting totally out of hand.

I too don't have a problem with understanding that Op was narked when, in the second case, the child was supposed to come to hers and then it was changed at the last minute. Most rude. Bad manners. I agree.
And I also agree that I do infact think it was very odd that the mum arranged it and then wasn't there. Very odd.
But can't you see that we have now gone way past that. Some of the other things that the Op said and how she feels, have gone way past the original problem, no?

Let me spell I out for you,wiki isn't go to for psychiatry,in case you didnt know
No reason you would know,seeing if you prone to online guessing you're not too sharp
Hth

AND the suggestion that I am not allowed to suggest that OP is extremely anxious, because I am not a proffessional Pyschologist or pyschariatrist, is nothing short of ridiculous.
Rhubarb and scottishmummy have been here for years, as have I. And if you think that someone is totally OTT, totally over protective, totally cotton wool wrapping, pyschologically unsound etc etc, whatever-you-want-to-call-it, you are now , per NEW MN rules? now not allowed to suggets that someone has counselling?

In relationship threads, parenting threads, behaviour, toddlers, AIBU, now not allowed to? Must have been a new rule, I'd missed.

I'm sorry. But what a load of cack.