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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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To expect that a mum supervises the children on a play date?

306 replies

Livvilou · 19/02/2013 20:27

Please bear with this long post. At my DDs school play dates are common. I am not so bothered about them as I didn't go to people's houses when I was a child. My DD went to a child's house the mother told me she would pick her up from school. I called later and it seemed to me the mother was not at her house as expected. I sent my DH to pick up our daughter and the mother of the child said she had run an errand and left my DD with her partner and her daughter. Her partner had also picked up my DD from school but I didn't even know his name, he has only ever said hello to me and she said she would pick up my DD. my DD didn't have a good time at the playdate because her daughter didn't want to play with my DD because another friend of hers was also at the house. The same mother asked if my DD could go on another play date and this time I spoke to her about what happened last time. She claimed to have no knowledge of the fact that her daughter didn't want to play with mine. Which is ludicrous as she told this to my husband when he came to pick up DD and my DD told me what happened too.
Today my DD went to another child house. This child was supposed to come to our house and this morning her father tell me she wants my DD to come to her house. I said this isn't what has been agreed. The father says he asked his daughter today and she wanted my DD to come to their house. He then asks my DD if she wants to go to their house. Of course she says yes. I was livid! The mother made the original appointment with me, and didn't tell me she would be working. I dropped my DD off at the house and her friend comes to the door in a vest and pants and I wonder what she is doing. Her father says she is dressing up. I pick my DD up an hour later and find that she has also been dressing up and has to put her trousers and socks on before she can go home with me. I do not feel happy having my DD being supervised my male partners. I am not saying that anything has happened but I can't imagine why this isn't seen as strange. My DH spoke with our DD and told her she is not to undress at anyone's house and she said the house was really hot, and she is right as I remember thinking that as I stood at the living room door. I understand that dads also look after their kids and i think that is great, but in the climate that we live today, I need to feel I am doing every thing I can to keep my DD safe without being paranoid. Any thoughts as I have been in a distressed state all day. Not only because a 5 year old managed to change the plans, but because I feel now I have to explain myself to keep my DD safe. I am sure I will upset someone if I say what I really want, ie. for the mother to be there at the play date. I have felt terrible all day from the worry.

OP posts:
shesariver · 20/02/2013 10:50

I do not feel happy having my DD being supervised my male partners. I am not saying that anything has happened but I can't imagine why this isn't seen as strange

Because it is not normal to be anxious and suspicious about half the human race thats why. I agree with the people who have said this thread has made them sad, because it has left me feeling the same.

MrsMushroom · 20/02/2013 10:51

Time but if you send your child home with another Mum then you have NO idea who has access to their home. uncle weirdo from over the road may be in and out all day...you'd have no idea! Same with neighbours...Mr or Mrs Perve from next door could have a friendly relationship with the household and be in and out all day.

miemohrs · 20/02/2013 10:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Timetoask · 20/02/2013 10:57

Mrs!ushroom, but if I send my child to a house it's because I trust the person who is looking after them. I would not leave my child with someone I don't know and do not trust.

MrsMushroom · 20/02/2013 11:00

Time most playdates at primary school...are arranged between parents who've only met at the gates. Some people know one another from outside school of course but not many generally.

Knowing someone to say hi to and chat, is not the same as knowing them well enough to really trust them. Many parents send their DC off on playdates with people they've met a few times at school.

VenusRising · 20/02/2013 11:00

OP, listen to your gut, and don't have any play dates bar ones you host yourself if that makes you feel more comfortable.

Don't mind the bashing you are getting on here, if you're not happy, just don't have the play dates.

I've had the same problem, and we don't do play dates with that family/ group anymore. I was tired of hearing that the cousins were over, my DD was ignored, the mother had gone out to have her hair done/ manicure, an uncle was looking after them, they had a bath together, and changed their clothes.

AngelWreakinHavoc · 20/02/2013 11:01

My two youngest dc live with their Dad, does that mean they should never have friends round to play?

What a fuckwit thing to say op. You need serious help!

seeker · 20/02/2013 11:03

"Call me paranoid, but the world is a dangerous place."

NO IT IS'NT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Has there ever been a single case of a child being abused while at a friend's house for a couple of hours after school?

lljkk · 20/02/2013 11:12

I dunno, I am kind of on the fence. OP hadn't even met one of these men and the other one she had never properly conversed with. Then they shouldn't have been so pushy about changing the venue. I wouldn't be very comfortable with it, either.

miemohrs · 20/02/2013 11:13

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BumBiscuits · 20/02/2013 11:20

When I collected my then 4 year-old from a playdate at her bessie mate's house the pair of them were running around naked in the garden.

It was a scorching day and her bessie's folks had put out the paddling pool and sprinklers/garden hose.

The DAD was there too, dun, dun, DUN. I think he may have even been spraying them with the garden hose as they ran past in fits of giggles. OMG, do I need to start clutching my pearls?

redskyatnight · 20/02/2013 11:22

This thread makes me sad.
DH has DD after school. Does this mean she can't ever have a friend home to play? Yes, he meets other parents at school, but not to the level that they could convince themselves that he wasn't an axe murderer. By the time your children get to school there's no reason why you should be getting to know their friends' parents. If you only ever sent your DC to houses where you knew the inhabitants inside out, that would very much limit their social lives!

Actually I've just had an awful though. DS's best friend's brother, who I don't know but have previously just thought of as DS's friend's brother has recently turned 18. This makes him a man I know nothing about... better stop DS going round methinks Hmm

Adversecamber · 20/02/2013 11:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

THERhubarb · 20/02/2013 11:26

Livvilou sorry you've had such a roasting by idiots who have nowt better to do. May I suggest you don't post in AIBU in future? Some people do unfortunately see this as a fight club and throw insults here that they would never normally do elsewhere.

I can see by your responses that you have been pushed into a corner and so have come out fighting and defending yourself, which is fully understandable given the frankly idiotic responses by some. Still, you haven't had any posts deleted that I can see which makes you a much better person than some of these do-gooders who obviously can't help themselves.

Criticising you for the use of the phrase play date says it all really. Have some people really got nothing better to do?

I fully appreciate what you are saying.

If I make arrangements to pick a child up from school then I make sure I keep that arrangement. I would not send dh because that child would not know him and therefore it just wouldn't be appropriate. Also it's downright rude to make arrangements to collect a child and then send someone else in your place, even if they happen to be your partner. If the other parent doesn't know your partner, and the child doesn't know him then you are being unreasonable and rude to expect that mother to let her child go off with him.

I would not have a problem leaving the children with the partner though if both kids are happy with that. Sometimes as a mother you have to pick up older kids or do the shopping or run errands, whatever. It can't be helped and you can understand why those mothers would think nothing of leaving their partners in charge for a while. Having said that, I do try to make sure that I'm here for when they are picked up again.

It's just about politeness really isn't it? If the other mother only knows you and not your partner then it's unreasonable to assume she would be ok with your partner picking up her child. It's also only polite to ensure that you are there to greet her when she comes to collect her child.

As for dressing up. Well I've had children come round here who bring a spare change of clothes to get into. It's not a problem. They've also played dressing up games and once I went to collect my dd from her friends house and both she and her friend were completely nude! The father was also present. dd was only about 5 at the time and the man was a German hippy type but still I remember doing a Mumsnet thread about it at the time!

As a parent you have certain limits that you feel comfortable with. These people obviously don't share those limits. That's not to say that they are wrong, just that you may have to compromise.

Personally I would not be happy if I had arranged for my child to be picked up by another mum and she sent her husband who I didn't know instead. I'm not sure what I would do in that situation as it's never happened, but provided my child was still raring to go and it was confirmed that he was in fact the partner and not some uncle or friend, then I might allow it but I would voice my disapproval in some way.

As for going to collect my child and discovering just the father home, well I might think it a bit off for the mum not to have made the effort to be there but things happen so I'd just accept that one and perhaps make the effort whilst I was there to get to know the father a bit better.

When it comes to getting undressed. Now might be a good time to explain safety to your child. I have told mine if someone tries to make them do something which makes them feel uncomfortable, no matter what it is, they have the right to say no and walk away. No one should touch them in the places that are covered up by their swimming costumes. No one should try to make them keep a secret and if they do feel uncomfortable around someone, they don't need an excuse to ask to go home.

From now on perhaps you should limit play dates and if you are making similar arrangements with a mum for her to collect your child just say something like "can I confirm that you will be picking them up then, it's just that last time it was your partner and it was a bit awkward as neither myself nor my child knew them".

It's a reasonable enough request.

You do have to remember though that not everyone shares your concerns and at some point you will have to place trust in other people. But if you have the talk with your children, you can ensure that they are as safe as they can be.

Abuse is thankfully, still uncommon. Your children are more likely to be exposed to inappropriate computer games or see adult internet content than they are to be abused. These are the things I worry about now.

And forget the abusive minority on Mumsnet. Some people can get mightily het up and take everything out of context and way too personally. You weren't calling fathers abusers, you were hitting out after some posters backed you into a corner and hurled abuse at you. I get what you were saying.

Most of us are very supportive and helpful so please don't let this put you off. Just stick to chat and the other boards as AIBU is notorious for attracting idiots Smile

scottishmummy · 20/02/2013 11:28

Seeker you're being purposefully provocative
Has there ever been case a single case of child abused at a friends house for couple hours after school
yes unfortunately.because it's beyond your comprehension doesn't mean doesn't happen

Timetoask · 20/02/2013 11:32

Time most playdates at primary school...are arranged between parents who've only met at the gates. Some people know one another from outside school of course but not many generally.

MrsMushroom: remember that the OPs daughter is 5years old, very young indeed. Myds is now 6, he has had a few playdates but I would never send him alone with someone I didn't know and yes that entiles more than a few hellos at the gate.

THERhubarb · 20/02/2013 11:39

Timetoask I make every effort to get to know the parents before I let my kids go on a play date. If they are happy to let their kids go off with me then that's up to them but I used to always make the effort to stay around for their first visit to a friend's house. I would have a cup of tea and chat to the mum/meet the partner if possible, etc.

You have to eventually allow them to go on their own and everyone does have certain limits. Like BumBiscuits is happy for her child to be naked at someone else's house. I wouldn't be. That doesn't make either of us wrong or right, just different.

The OP has different limits to others but she did not say that she thought fathers were abusers. Those words were put into her mouth by some very unkind, trouble-making posters who were out for a fight. The OP was just being honest with her thoughts and concerns and actually, most of us feel the same way.

I am guessing that the majority of posters on here would feel uncomfortable letting their child go off with the father of another child that they had never met before. That doesn't mean to say they think that father is an abuser at all.

This thread has been shameful to read. Bloody awful in fact.

seeker · 20/02/2013 11:42

"Seeker you're being purposefully provocative
Has there ever been case a single case of child abused at a friends house for couple hours after school
yes unfortunately.because it's beyond your comprehension doesn't mean doesn't happen"
It's not beyond my comprehension. That's why I asked.

scottishmummy · 20/02/2013 11:46

It didn't read as a simple query.at all
It read as provocative exasperated oh come on dont exagerate
No doubt you'll refute this,to stress it was a genuine question free of any nuance

THERhubarb · 20/02/2013 11:55

seeker, I think it would be polite to acknowledge adversecamber's contribution. She has answered your query.

It would be irresponsible to suggest that no child is abused by anyone outside of the family. There have been cases of abuse by friends, babysitters and yes, parents or relatives of other children. But these are RARE, even if the media would have us think that paedos lurk around every corner. They don't.

Yet a mother's worry is always present and is not always rational. We seem to spend our lives worrying about our children and the dangers that the world brings to them.

It doesn't sound as though the OP's worries have gone into overdrive at all. She just made the mistake of voicing her concerns and giving the idiot posters just enough ammunition to crucify her with.

As I said above, no poster would be happy to send their 5 year old child off with a father they had never met before. They might do it, but they wouldn't be happy about it. It's a normal and human response.

miemohrs · 20/02/2013 11:55

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

OutsideOverThere · 20/02/2013 12:46

I woudn't mind a father or partner so much - presumably a long term one that is trusted with the children - but when a parent takes my child home for a play, and then goes OUT leaving her child and my child alone together = that makes me incredibly cross.

OP I can see where you're coming from. Little children especially feel more secure when the adult they are with is familiar to them - not someone they've never seen or met.

Not sure I agree on the HUGE problem with it being a man, and children wearing their underwear etc but still, yes, I understand.

THERhubarb · 20/02/2013 12:50

I think that's the crux of it. Not so much that this was a man but a stranger to you and your child.

I agree that it doesn't really matter if it's a man or woman, if they are a stranger to you then it's unacceptable to expect you to allow your child to go off with them.

KellyElly · 20/02/2013 13:11

OP - wow what a first thread, poor you. I get where you're coming from - especially the change of plans and pick ups and destinations etc. I think at such a young age you need to know where your child is and who with etc. My DD is a bit younger than yours, 3, and I would only let he go unsupervised on play dates with friends children, if it's a mum from nursery or whatever I'll go too until I know them. I would feel extremely uncomfortable about my DD getting undressed around a strange man (dressing up or not), without the presence of a woman there but I have my own issues from my past on that and know my view on this probably isn't 'normal' but hey, you are just looking out for your daughter and trying to keep her safe. That's not something that deserves the pasting you've received on here.

middleeasternpromise · 20/02/2013 13:22

Im inclined to agree with you OP but its not the issue of whether dad hosts or mum hosts its about whether the arrangements are clear or not so you can feel confident what you have agreed to is what is actually happening.

The bigger issue here is the age. Playdates with the younger age group are always tricky as 5/6/7 year olds are not brilliant at negotiating things. Im always amazed that parents agree to have their children picked up by another parent without even knowing where that parent lives on the strength of a friendship the children have built in school.

The best way to handle play dates for the younger age group is to make sure you host the first one that way you get to see the relationship between the children and which ever parent comes to collect - you can have a chat with them and get to know them a bit better.

Bottom line is if you arent confident about arrangements and it makes you uncomfortable you need to say no to sending your child until (a) you've satisified yourself you trust the other family or (b) your daughter is older and your confident she will tell you if anything untoward happens.

Play dates and such like are part and parcel of school life and childrens friendships so you best figure out a strategy to manage it and then hold your ground.