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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Older boyfriend wants to retire early...??!!

342 replies

foxyfi111 · 11/02/2013 14:33

Hi all. I have no kids currently but hoping there are some nice people out there with more experience than me that can advise me. Essentially - I am 29, my partner is 40, we both currently work fulll time. I love my job (in pharmaceuticals), he hates working (teacher - gets lovely holidays off). He dropped a bombshell recently that he wants to retire at 55, ie 15 years time. We were thinking of starting a family in a few years. I think his plan is that I will continue to work (ie for another 20 years until Im 65, whilst he is retired). I hadnt thought that I would stop work as I enjoy it at the moment but I didnt see myself being the breadwinner

Am I being unreasonable to think he is being really selfish? He has money which he has made on property (about 80 grand) so its not like he's not going to be contributing to our relationship financially. His idea is that he will be a house-husband and keep things running at home. Does anyone else have such an arrangement, and does it cause loads of arguments? Its probably not right for me to say he cant retire early, as without me he could afford to do so, but Im just thinking - with a young family, someone has to pay the bills and I feel a bit forced into it being me

I feel I cant really make a big deal out of this yet as we dont have kids yet but it is something that keeps me awake at night. I'm worried that if we got married we'd end up arguing over it later in life. I know its a price you pay for going out with an older man but I just dont know whether I should put my foot down or not, help!!

OP posts:
lottiegarbanzo · 14/02/2013 11:32

Having read all OP's posts my impression is that the BF thinks it would be cool to have a 'Baby Mamma' i.e. a single-parent girlfriend, rather than being a proper father and husband. He probably doesn't think he thinks that(!) and would be offended and say he's just taking time to adjust to the idea of parenthood.

I would not entirely rule out that possibility but he is going to have to do a lot of adjusting of his ideas, quite fast. Don't forget that many 40yo men still think they're young, there isn't the same fertility threshold impinging on their ideas of age and identity.

But that's me going off into the realms of speculation based on quite little really. My earlier post raised questions that could help you identify any differences in values and aspiration and their consequences, in a more neutral way.

FWIW my DP, who I got together with when both in our early thirties, had spent quite a bit of time living alone, was of the 'my single life is work, fun and travel' mindset and was considering working only six or eight months a year and travelling the rest as a regular thing. He did take a while to adjust to being in a relationship and to the idea of children, so definitely not a case of 'our eyes met, all our desires were the same and a year later we had a baby'. In fact, we did delay TTC long enough to see that the relationship could work long term, with an obvious compromise about chances of success, given my age. But, but, but... DP was always open to embracing coupledom and family life and his 'single life' was more about making the best of necessity than an over-riding desire. So, the period of adjustment followed from a desire to make the relationship and a future family work, it did not function as a way of trying to drive that change.

kalidanger · 14/02/2013 12:34

A Valentines card for him

LessMissAbs · 14/02/2013 12:59

A lot of what you say sounds, for want of a kinder word, delusional, OP. You also sound as though you're under this man's thrall, and also his control. I think he is very deliberately going out with a much younger woman because she will be easier to control and manipulate. The "walking" statement is not a good sign.

Its delusional to think you are both going to buy a 600k house, that his mortgage will definately be portable, that he is going to retire at 50 and still afford all this. Its as if you are being drawn into his delusions.

CurlyhairedAssassin · 14/02/2013 16:17

Foxy: . This can't be an easy thread for you to read. But there are a lot of wise words on here. If you can face the very blunt and honest opinions that people are giving you (and everybody is on YOUR side, remember that), it might be worth coming back on after you see how tonight goes if you are not sure how to proceed with things. I would be concerned that he might win you over a bit if you fall into the whole valentines romance thing. And even if you did have a big talk with him today what if it ended badly, and you ended up breaking up? I would not then want the horrible journey home walking past loved up couples after just splitting up with my boyfriend.

Maybe just leave it for tonight, go out, enjoy the wine/food/film/whatever he has planned and enjoy it for what it is. Pay attention to how he treats you, how he talks to you, WHAT he talks about, even how much respect he shows the waiting staff etc Take it all in, give nothing away about how youre now feeling and then go home and have a bloody good think and evaluate your whole relationship. Leave the big serious conversation for tomorrow or a couple of days time.

Well, that's what I'd do anyway.

ZenNudist · 14/02/2013 19:52

Foxy I posted up thread that you're wasting your time if he won't commit after 2 years. But now you've confused me by saying you've been going out 18 months. I think that the first year or two of a relationship can be just fun but you'd expect a guy to start seeing you more without being asked. Not set a biweekly date limit. In conversations about the future you'd expect to be broadly in agreement. You definitely don't want to be persuading him at every step. There are men out there who would be happy to settle down with you!

But I'm confused because if you set off in your relationship trying to map out your entire future from the start, it's all rather forced. You need to gel as a couple. Get on well. Get to know each other. Sounds like he is pushing you away because you've come on too strong... and he's not convinced you're the one.

Loopy posted she 'nudged' a 30yo guy into a committed relationship. I don't think that's too unusual. It's possible your bf is very immature and stubborn and enjoyed single life too much to 'cave' in his 30s but he will be "ready" in his 40s. He just doesn't sound that great or worth it.

I think you should start living life for you and do what you want. If he wants the same things he will follow, if he doesn't you can move on without him. [wishes for a go girl! Emoticon]

OHforDUCKScake · 14/02/2013 21:30

Good luck tonight. I hope you're ok.

Dozer · 14/02/2013 21:46

From your last post foxy he sounds like a total loser. Commenting on his exes and other women / mocking your living arrangements and telling you to change them / saying he will "walk" if "dictated to"........

Leave the bastard! There are lots of men who are NICE!

foxyfi111 · 15/02/2013 09:29

Ok so. We had a nice evening, he took me out for dinner and then to a musical which was lovely. I did feel a bit tense during dinner as this has really been playing on my mind and I think he could probably tell. It's really hard to act all happy and in love when I'm having these doubts. I don't know if the doubts are whether or not he's right for me or whether or not he'll commit (or both). He seemed tense because he was paying gor everything and i know he hates that! but the musical was really great and romantic. With the commitment front I have made progress as he said how about we see each other 3 times a week now. He has a few buyers interested in his house and said to him what will he do after and he said "I don't know", he knows I want to rent with him, I just don't know what he's thinking. At the moment even I'm not sure (because he's not sure). When I left him today I felt really sad because I do love him I just don't know if its going to work :(

OP posts:
LessMissAbs · 15/02/2013 09:41

You sound as if you're almost scared to talk to him about the things normal couples talk to each other about.

As for "not knowing" what he'll do after hes sold his house, thats ridiculous. Most mortgages are portable for only 6 months and he should have contacted his mortgage provider by now to check the exact rules that apply to him. If he is planning to get a new mortgage entirely, he needs to check they will be happy giving one to someone who only plans to work another 15 years, or whether he is going to not disclose that and whether they will lend to someone of his age (the mortgage market has changed a lot since he will have got his last mortgage).

So basically hes going to be homeless if his house sells. Maybe hes encouraging you to rent something else so he can move in without any hassles and live free until he decides what to do.

As for your living arrangements, what does he expect when you're only 29?

Even if he does "commit", do you think spending your life with someone like this is going to be bunch of roses?

As for him "feeling tense" because hes paying for a meal on Valentines Day...what is it you are picking up on exactly? Theres something your gut instinct is feeling troubled about. So many times I've found out this means theres another woman somewhere...

PureQuintessence · 15/02/2013 09:44

How do you think you can share your life with him, when you cant share your thoughts with him? If after 18 /24 months you dont know where the relationship is headed, surely it is headed nowhere?

Agreeing to see each-other 3 times per week rather than twice sounds bizarre to be honest. If he was really keen to see you he would have made arrangements to see you more often without having made an agreement about it first! It would have come natural to him! It is like seeing you is a chore...

Adversecamber · 15/02/2013 09:47

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Alibabaandthe40nappies · 15/02/2013 10:00

Why would he be tense about paying for everything?

I find it absolutely bizarre that you are planning marriage and a future with a bloke who you can't even have a nice evening out with. You've only been together a couple of years, you don't live together so you haven't got any domestic crap to bog you down.

In short - you are not in love, the two of you. And if you aren't in love now then you sure as hell aren't going to be when you've got a £2000 a month mortgage payment, you're on maternity leave, he is still hating his job and you've got a screaming newborn so you are trying to survive on 3 hours sleep a night.
You need massive reserves of love, good times to look back on, shared goals, ambitions and dreams to make it through the tough times in a relationship. Now is when you should be building up that reserve, and you just aren't.

It should not be this hard

DIYapprentice · 15/02/2013 10:08

Foxy - I've read your posts and my heart is breaking for you. Your DBF sounds just like a wonderful friend of mine, who is 50.

He is lovely, caring, (sounds a little more generous than your DBF financially though), wants kids, keen to be in a relationship - but never seems to be able to make it work

Knowing him and caring for him as a friend I can see exactly why it never works for him, and I truly don't think it ever well. He doesn't know how to handle the difficult times in a relationship, he doesn't know how to deal with conflict, he doesn't know how to really 'share' - his space, his time, his emotions.

It was highly amusing - after the fact - seeing him trying to deal with me when he had pissed me off to no end and had to stay put and deal with it rather than escaping and waiting for the situation to calm down. His eyes kept flitting around trying to work out how to escape. But HE pissed me off, and HE was going to deal with the situation and get through it like a grown up. Given even the slightest opportunity he would have made a run for it (figuratively speaking, he wouldn't actually have RUN Grin) and still would.

At 40, I genuinely think he's too old now to make these changes to make the relationship work long term. If he could have done it sooner, he would have. But he has NEVER had a long term relationship before, and there is a very good reason for that. He can't, not unless HE wants to do it and is proactive about it, and without some damn good help such as a councillor, who HE wants to see.

TheNebulousBoojum · 15/02/2013 10:09

'With the commitment front I have made progress as he said how about we see each other 3 times a week now.'

You really are living in a hopeful bubble of fantasy here. If you move in together, you'll be seeing each other every day and night of the week. So, up to three nights in 18 months, you've got a way to go before he makes it to 7.
Why can't you see the relationship for what it is? It's a series of dates, not a long-term commitment.

JessieMcJessie · 15/02/2013 10:10

Oh Foxy, I'm so sorry that the best he could offer you was three dates a week. It doesn't bode well at all for him coming round to the idea of you living together any time soon. I hate to say it but if he felt like you were The One, he wouldn't be making a to-do list that said "See Foxy three times a week", he'd be planning things for you to do together and before you knew it you'd pretty much be seeing each other all week and he would not be keeping count. This sounds like a grudging concession and before you know it he'll be asking for "time off " because he did all his contracted hours six weeks in a row. Seriously, take a peek at "He's just not into you", it's a really good book.

Does he call you on the days you are not together? That's a really good barometer of how he feels - if he likes to ring up and chat about what his day's been like and what he's having for tea then it shows he sees you as part of his day-to-day. If you are doing all the calling, or it's radio silence between dates, he's compartmentalising you and after 18 months that's a bad sign.

Also, massive red flag at you noticing that he's always uncomfortable paying for things. Putting aside the question of whether that is a reasonable attitude (IMHO it isn't), how rude of him to act in a way that allows you to perceive his discomfort.

You've got time on your side (and probably are meeting all sorts f interesting peole travelling for your fun job) - might be time to cut and run I'm afraid.

PureQuintessence · 15/02/2013 10:13

Actually it is laughable.
The ONE day of the year where a bloke is required by some weird tradition to wine and dine and treat his girlfriend, he is tense because he has to open his wallet. YET, he wants you to fund his early retirement.

I bet he wont be keen to move in with you until he is close to 55.....

JessieMcJessie · 15/02/2013 10:18

This may be radical, but perhaps you could just tell him very calmly and non-accusingly that it's not moving forward enough for you, you can tell his heart isn't really in it, thanks for the good times but it's best that you both move on. Not an ultimatum. If by some stroke of luck what he feels is totally at odds with his behaviour, he'll get a bit opf a wake-up call, fight for you and ask you what he needs to do to keep you in his life. If he breathes a sigh of relief and evaporates into the ether then you'll know that it was the right thing to do.

TheDoctrineOfSciAndNatureClub · 15/02/2013 10:21

that sounds Like a good idea Jessie.

lottiegarbanzo · 15/02/2013 10:33

Oh dear. Thanks for updating but sorry it wasn't more hopeful.

Have you ever had a conversation with him about hopes and dreams? Not a serious, planning one but a fanciful, free-wheeling, what I've always hoped for and dreamed of one? Were his dreams anything like yours? Do his dreams and desires match the way he conducts his life in any way? Could the two converge, or not?

I'm afraid the retirement thing sounds like a statement of 'this is what I'm going to be doing with my life, take it or leave it'. So does the restricted dating.

The more time I spend on this thread, the more it appears you are just projecting your dreams onto him. He is 'the boyfriend', you have ideas about your future with a man, so, as he current candidate, you expect him to fit your plans. He's not 'generic boyfriend Y' he's a person, whose ideas, desires and aspirations appear to be pretty far from yours.

StuntGirl · 15/02/2013 10:46

Oh wow, well then, disregard everything that's been said on this thread. Three whole days?! He's surely a keeper.

And what's with all this militant planning? "Well darling we've spent the requisite 18 months seeing each other 2 days a week. I feel its gone rather well for me, let's go a bit crazy, how does THREE days a week sound? Gosh, I do think we'll be ready to move in together by the time I'm, ooh, 55."

Seriously. When it's right it isn't this hard. At all.

MsVestibule · 15/02/2013 10:47

I agree with Jessie 100%. You wouldn't be giving him an ultimatum; you're telling him that you both have different ideas about your medium term future and it's not working for you anymore. I'm hoping he evaporates into thin air, as from what you've told us on this thread, I don't think you'll make each happy in the long term.

Honestly foxy, I just want to give you a nice gentle shake to make you see your relationship as everybody else sees it. You don't have to 'just know' as soon as you meet the right person, but surely you can see that if a man kindly agrees to see you three times a week after two years, he just doesn't love you. And TBH, although I'm sure you're very fond of him, I don't think you love him either.

noddyholder · 15/02/2013 10:49

He is going to retire before you as he is older. As long as he has money in place to support himself it is up to you to work until you can afford to retire and if you have children then you both need to provide. He sounds like this has always been his plan and if he is financially ok its not your business tbh. IF you were married and with children and truly together this would surely change as it normally does when relationships get to that stage You adapt according to needs etc but it doesn't sound like you 2 are heading in that direction at all.

DonderandBlitzen · 15/02/2013 11:07

I agree with Alibaba

It should not be this hard

It is not going to get easier when you have children, it will get much harder. This should be the easy part of the relationship. You can do better OP. Don't waste your time with this man.

Bearbehind · 15/02/2013 11:08

Oh, foxy, I truly feel sad for you. If last night was the beginning of the rest of your life, it was pretty dismal.

It must be soul destroying to sit with a man who, on one hand, has done something lovely and generous but who is making it clear he is unhappy about paying for it and he actually begrudges it.

alibaba is so right, you should be making happy memories now, not sitting uncomfortably through an evening that he is paying for.

What would he be like if you did have children and whilst on maternity leave you only had his income, from a job he hates? How do you think he'd make you feel then?

On the subject of living arrangements I'm struggling to see how lessmissabs think he is going to become homeless when he sells his house though? The length of time you can port a mortgage is irrelevant because not all mortgages allow you to do this anyway and as he is going to to better somewhere bigger, hence, more expensive, he'll need to remortgage anyway.

If a single, 40 year old man with no dependants earning £55k and presumably with no debts if he's tight cant get a mortgage then the economy is screwed! Many don't make it onto the property ladder until their 30's.

As for disclosing his plans to retire at 55- why would he? Many people plan to retire before their actual retirement age but many also have mortgages over terms longer which run past their ideal age of retirement, particularly if they are currently funding children at university etc. If he hasn't paid off his mortgage before he wants to retire, he'll have to carry on working or sell and buy something he can afford-simple.

Back to you how it affects you though, he seems to me that he is not the kind of man who agrees with renting. It strikes me from his behaviour in other areas that he would see it as a waste of money and wouldn't like to lose the 'status' of owning.

I think that means that when he says he doesn't know what he'll do when he sells his place he is yet again talking crap. I doubt he's considering renting and he's not considering buying with you so that leaves one option, buying on his own again.

I like jessies suggestion too. It is make or break but wouldn't you rather that than waste more time and energy if he's not going to give you what you want. If he isn't committed enough to make more effort now and would rather walk away then it will save you heartache in the future.

I wouldn't hold your breathe for a fairy tale outcome though, I actually had to re-read the bit where he condescended to see you for an extra night a week- big wow!

That's not how it should be, couples who love each other just don't allow each other pre-defined blocks of their time, they want to spend as much time together as possible, which is how moving in together becomes the natural step- you're practically doing it already.

maleview70 · 15/02/2013 11:36

"couples who love each other want to spend as much time together as possible"

Not neccesarily true. Some people love their partners a great deal but don't want to spend every spare minute they have with their partner. One night a week my DW is not at home. I love it. Loves the peace and quiet and freedom to do what I want. Doesn't make me love her any less.

Not all relationships have to be so full on to work. This one does sound a bit on his terms though.

Only you can achieve what you want in life and when it involves someone else, you have to question if he will make you happy for the next 30 years or so. If you don't think he will then make the decision, shed a fyear ears and move on. You are 29. You have years ahead to rebuild your life.

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