Tory haters: shouldn't you start reining this in?

[Abitwobblynow]

Because the golden geese who have to pay for what you believe are entitlements and who you despise so much, are flying away:

"Almost half of all Britons who emigrate each year are professionals and company managers, potentially threatening the country?s supply of highly skilled workers, research for the Home Office found.
The attractions of a better lifestyle and climate, as well as career opportunities, meant a ?large and increasing? number of executives, scientists, academics and doctors have chosen to leave Britain in the last 20 years, the report said.
Business leaders blamed high rates of income tax for the ?disturbing? rises in the number of professionals leaving Britain for countries such as Australia, American and Canada. Around 149,000 British citizens emigrated last year, and 4.7 million now live overseas."

What do you think? Has the class resentment poison gone just a bit too far, and isn't it just a bit outdated? And was Labour right to stoke this narrative up?

Les who? Whoever he is, the Telegraph / Daily Mail seem to hate him!

I certainly wouldn't argue that Education is safe in Lib-dem hands, any more than it is in the Tories (or Labour for that matter). They all seem to have a gift for muffing things up.

celidh I think one of the problems with your assertion is that one person/business cannot often be simply replaced by another. The work/money often follows them IYSWIM.

If DH up sticks then his job won't become vacant IYSWIM. He'll just take his work/clients/money with him.

Same if I up sticks. The money I generate here in the UK and am taxed on and spend here, can't just be replaced by someone else. Because I will take it with me.

I'm not sure if I'm making much sense but I hope it's vaguely understandable.

They do indeed, Coat. He's diametrically opposed to everything you said ought to be done in your previous post.

and a goofy old lefty

teaches golf at the university of luton or something - now in charge of admissions policy

This just shows that people are more mobile these days - moving across the country and between countries too.

If some UK people want to go abroad, its ok because someone else is interested in coming here - a very good reason not to restrict immigration too much.

We should notice that one major reason stated is lifestyle. That means we should ensure a good quality of life, above setting arbitrary tax levels.

Of the talented people I know who have moved abroad, some have gone to Germany - where they are proud to pay the higher rate tax, and to Scandinavian countries - for the quality of their institutions.

Yes and I bet their education too.

Saw this in the Telegraph and thought it was a rather crude piece of spin, since the visa requirements for most countries require either qualifications, a study place or cash so therefore it is inevitable that emigrants will tend to be more qualified. That has been the case, I suspect for a long time.

If you read beyond the first para you will see that a lot of what they call 'emigration' actually appears to be short term stints or postings. At the moment lots of City workers are going to Asia and the Middle East simply because banks are cutting back on London, Frankfurt and New York teams. We will see how many can or do stay.

Much more interesting is the real brain drain of academics and scientists who go to work in English speaking universities or the pharma industry in America. They are attracted by higher salaries and job opportunities that don't exist in science and technology here, and, the report says, leave for the long term. This is an important, but very specific problem, and little to do with personal taxation, and probably nothing to do with 'class envy'. And I say that as a thoroughly middle class, private sector working, higher rate tax payer.

It's the University of Bedfordshire in Luton and when the higher fees were introduced they explicitly said they would not be raising their fees in line because of the socio economic groups that accessed the university. Which is weird. Because I looked at a course recently there and it was surprisingly 9k per annum.

The problem is lack of modern, skilled apprenticeships in my opinion and I feel sorry for young people today. When I left school even if you were average you still had to opportunity to get a job which would send you on day release to college to study something, it seems to me that nowadays this doesn't happen. My dh got an apprenticeship after doing a 1 year access to electronics thing at college and they trained you from the bottom up, put you through a degree eventually alongside work. I don't see anything like advertised anymore and I do believe it's to do with greed at a corporate level rather than particular governments

Please can we have a link to the article?

Call me naïve and simplistic possibly (rather than a tory hater) but I'd prefer to stop living in fear and would rather like to live in a society where everyone wants to contribute everything they can to ensure the vulnerable are protected first and foremost (rather than, for example, a society which forces parents whose contraception doesn?t work to choose between aborting, abandoning or not feeding their children).

If that means a lower standard of living for more people and fewer experience truly extravagant lifestyles, so be it.

Anyone is welcome to leave IMHO. And if some prefer to live elsewhere through choice, and take their clients with them, all power to them. I hope they lead full and satisfying lives, with respect for the country which enabled their choices.

If it did result in a mass exodus, it may well leave us a bit skint(er) for a while, and we?d have to cut our cloth, but I?d still prefer to know my neighbours were here out of choice and truly looked out for one another.

The Telegraph article is here

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/thomaspascoe/100021150/the-brain-drain-britain-is-losing-people-on-the-make-thats-bad-news/

You are joking Beer. You must live in a dream world.

I may have been a tad on the idealistic side there Brycie, but ultimately my points in essence are the values of all successful people I know and admire.

I like Beer's world a lot better than the paranoiac shit-fest that you seem to inhabit, Brycie.

Yes all socialists seem to inhabit that world, the world where no one runs out of other people's money.

Bless.

Not "Tory hater".

"Tory-hater".

A Tory hater is a hateful Tory. The latter hates Tories.

"the world where no one runs out of other people's money"

No, we have to cut our cloth. Just not at the expense of starving, homeless children.

Forth, I was quoting the op, but thanks for your pedanticness (is that a word?)

Surely "Tory hater" is a tautology?

Oh for goodness sake. Yes because we all just hate everything. What is this, Janet and John politics.

I think DISLIKE is a better word than HATE Or even disagree with.

You'd think.

What about abhor, I think it sounds nicer whilst conveying exactly how I feel about Tories.

MiniTheMinx, I agree with the link you posted. Both my kids don't see a future here in the UK when they finish their university education.

The sheer bile and hatred from the left is totally vile. They manage to combine complete nastiness with a faux moral superiority. It no longer surprises me though.

Oh OldMumsy some might, I don't know. I usually find that people on the left vary as much as those on the right, isn't it just personality. I'm very left but I would like to think there is little that is faux.

I agree though that it would seem wise to abandon the sinking ship, I have told mine that they can not be average because average won't get you a job with any future. I will be pushing them on a boat out of here I suspect.

Do you know the quickest way to change the debt to GDP ratio though?

I think you dangerously misunderstand when you talk of 'life habits that result in poverty' what do you think they are?