My Mums laziness is driving me nuts

[fluffypillow]

This can't be normal behaviour.

Bit of background..........I am happily married (20yrs) with 3 children 15, 10 and 22 months.

We have always lived with my parents, and it worked out well until recently.

My gorgeous Dad died suddenly nearly two years ago. It was a week before christmas, and two weeks before our beautiful Daughter was born. As you can imagine, it was a very difficult time.

My Mum then retired 6 months later. Again, a time of adjustment for us all. I am a SAHM, and my DH works from home, so suddenly we were all at home together all day, every day.

Now, heres the thing, my Mum has always been a 'can't do' kind of person. She has a huge list of hang up/phobias which constantly limit the rest of the family (DH, the children and I).

She has always been the kind of person to avoid physical activity of any kind, but recently it has got to the stage where it is really worrying.

She gets up at 11am every day, makes breakfast, then goes on her laptop in front of the TV for the rest of the day. She only moves when she needs the toilet. Sometimes she will drive to the shop, and is gone for about 30mins.

My DH is the cook in our house, and he serves dinner to her every day.

She has never helped with the housework, and I didn't mind doing it all when she was working, but now I wish she would help just a little.

I find it hard work sometimes to get all the chores done with a toddler running around, but she NEVER offers to watch her for me at all, even though she is just sitting there all day. I could never ask her to babysit as DD wouldn't be safe with her, so DH and I never go anywhere on our own.

I took her to a family 'do' in the summer (at her request), DH couldn't come due to work. Everyone else in the family has help from the Grandparents with their kids, playing with them etc.....but not my Mum. She gets me to wait on her! I was struggling to feed my DD a jacket potato off of a paper plate, and trying to stop her pulling it on the floor, when my Mum says 'I thought you were going to get me some food!!'. Honestly, she didn't move from her chair in the three hours we were there.

We have to take her on holiday with us, as she has made it clear she would not stay in the house alone, and we have nobody to ask for help. Everythng revolves around her, and it gets me down.

About 3 times in the last 6 months, she has fallen on the floor in the evening(because she has too much to drink). Dh and I have to pick her up, and we struggle as she is so overweight. My DH has a very physical job , and is used to lifting, but she won't bend her knees, so we have a real job. She spent the next day crying.......for herself, as she said 'what if I had been here on my own?, I wouldn't have been able to get up!' She doesn't seem to think about the fact that if my DH hurt his back, then we would not be able to feed our kids!
I hate it, and it makes me worry even more that we will never be able to go away without her. We need time together with the kids on our own.

My Mum is on anti depressants, and has been for years, but they make no difference. She doesn't see that she has a problem, and thinks that the way she lives is normal.

I am scared for the future. I don't know what will happen. She is only 67, but is getting worse by the day. I love her, but I have never known anyone to be this lazy, and I think she is being quite selfish.

So AIBU? Is this normal behaviour for a woman of her age?

Sympathies, fluffy! but I second those who say - take the necessary steps to change this. It sounds like you don't actually want her to eat dinner at table with you - fair enough, it's your family time - but your DH really doesn't have to cook for her! It's surely possible to draw better lines of demarcation if she has her own living room - not shopping/cooking for her or doing her laundry, at least. Her drinking sounds significant but she of course won't acknowledge that. If she spirals downhill when you withdraw practical help - not washing, eating etc - then it will be clear that what's needed is supported accommodation. Oh, and I really like the idea that when she goes boo hoo you're horrible, you respond with boo hoo so are you!!

Poor you. I think you have a massive and emotionally toxic situation here that will take a lot of work and pain to sort out. But I do think you need to do something, really. Do you want your children to feel obligated to you in this way when you are an older adult? The way you act towards your mother now will have a massive influence on their "family script". It sounds like both you and your dh have family scripts that emphasize caring, togetherness and closeness over individual fulfillment. And of course this has many obvious plus points indeed- the vulnerable members of the family are cared for, you don't become distant and estranged from each other, you all keep interested in what each other is doing, plenty of love and affection is on offer even when people are behaving in less than endearing ways etc etc .

But there are always dangers to any family style- in a close family the danger is that individuals become over dependent on each other and start to feel smothered and trapped, unable to make a move on their own because it transgresses a strongly held internalised "family rule". Breaking a family rule sounds minor but it's not- it can cause extreme panic and anxiety because rules are so entrenched that they feel like moral imperatives. It feels unthinkable, wrong, awful to break the rules. Even if the rules are appalling, unhelpful, a load of old bollocks. I think you are in this situation and it's a fundamentally unhealthy situation, which will affect your family down the generations if you don't try and sort it out. From your posts I think you will need external help- good counselling- to try and achieve this as my impression is that even the thought of breaking the family rules is unthinkable for you and provokes a panic response. I think this is why you have rejected all the suggestions on this thread- they make you feel too unbearably shit so you conclude that they must be "wrong". Really difficult stuff- but you need to figure out how to keep the positive bits of your close family style and lose the trapping, smothering bit before it kills your mental health and affects your relationship and your lovely children. Lifetime of work in some ways (as for all of us!) but there will be lots that can be done in the short to medium term if you want to. Good luck.

I am with chipping . Also from what I have learnt on MN about emotional abuse it sounds like that is what is happening to you OP

OP, I hope you come back and take some help from this thread.

You might consider reading Toxic parents.

She is controlling you (either conciously or unconciously) through triggering your guilt and pity, and you are behaving exactly the way that she wants. You are also forcing your children to endure the same control. Your DH, however lovely, will one day become fed up of being his MILs servant, and will break free.

I wonder if you would benefit from talking to a professional relationships counsellor / therapist to work through some of your feelings about your Mum. I am sure that beneath your kind and dutiful exterior there must be resentment bubbling?

I really feel for you and hope you manage to make some progress with this. Coming here and posting is a first step... you can do it! Good luck x

Good post, Sminko.

Op - not surprised you're being driven nuts - it sounds like you are trapped in a horrible position.

I would go and talk to her gp yoursel - if you live together then I'm assuming you are all registered at the same practice. If your mum won't go in to see the gp willingly, maybe the gp could say that she needs to come in for a medications review as she has been on ads for so long and that they won't issue a repeat prescription until she has had the review.

You can also get alarm buttons for elderly people that they wear around your neck. Then if you fall you push the button, speak to the control centre and they ring the contacts listed - ok in her case you are there but it would give you the freedom to go further afield without needing a full time carer. The gp or SS should be able to give you details.

Then once you have got that sorted arrange for the four of you to go away for the night. Either to visit friend's or an activity cente or somewhere you know she wouldn't like (but you would obviously!). Make it easy for her to start with so leave her a couple of meals in the fridge or freezer - at least one of them something cold like a salad all plated up so she just has to take it out of the fridge, take off the cling film and eat it. Make the other a ready meal that just needs to go in the microwave and then comes out ready to eat. Write the instructions out for her so she can't complain that she doesn't know what to do.

Then go away overnightand see what happens. If she falls and doesn't have her button on - more fool her. Remind her about it before you go and remember to say that as you are away it would be the ambulance that was called. And they would take her to hospital where they would make her do exercise in physio etc so paint a picture to make her not want to go and fall deliberately to spite you!

Then you go and have a lively short holiday together, just overnight bit will feel strange but getting that first night away without her is a massive step that will really help as it will prove the principle that she can be left. If she complains cheerfully remind her that she'll be much happier at home, she didn't like being away last time, she's got her button if she falls, you'll leave food, she can play on hercomputer all day... Every objection she comes up with, make sure you counter with a solution. Remind her it's just one night and she'll enjoy the peace and quiet. Don't point out though that it's the first step in you getting away to Florida!

Finally you do need to have a conversation with her again. Have you ever asked her why she feels like she is entitled to treat you like her slave or one of her team at work that she can just delegate her entire life to? You're her daughter and of course you want to help her but not when it results in her being like this, sitting on her computer until she dies? Point out how upset your dad would be to see her like this, he'd much prefer her to have friends and to be doing all sorts of things rather than sit rotting at home. Had she ever said about plans she had for retirement or what she thought of it? Age can be an attitude of mind - she's acting like she's 100 not 67 (my gran used to volunteer at her local oap club until she was in her early 90s because she didn't feel old enough and preferred to chat with the other volunteers while they did the washing up!)

Good luck op - I don't think you've got an easy challenge ahead of you, whether you get her to change or not.

(and on a lighter note, do you think there's a thread on gransnet that's the opposite of this one?!?)

And apologies if i have xposted with anyone - I got distracted by the dc half way through and am on the phone so can't check inthe thread without losing everything!

Theres depressed, and then there's taking the absolute piss.

This needs to be sorted out now, what about as she gets older and actually is incapable of doing things for herself? Its going to be even harder.

You have my deepest sympathies, but you need to be strong and tell her, and stop enabling this behaviour.

When you're depressed it's easy to get wrapped up in your own feelings, maybe she needs awakening to the fact that she's not the only person in the world.

I'm another person who thinks you are enabling her. She is grieving and may well be depressed and/or alcoholic but none of these actually stops you being able to use a mop.

Seeing her GP without her won't get you very far as the GP can only treat your mum if she wants treatment. Taking your mum to see her GP might put your mind at rest that she isn't developing dementia (which from what you have posted I think is unlikely) but the GP doesn't have a magic wand either that will fix this. It doesn't sound like she has an illness that needs treating, except possibly alcoholism which she is highly unlikely to admit to, neither does she need help with personal care. At which point there becomes very little the GP can offer. This is going to fall to you and your DH to decide what you can put up with.

It is practically unheard of for someone to have a carer 24/7 'in case they fall' - I think you sound trapped in your mum's illness behaviour if you think this is a sensible solution. All they will get is a pendant alarm to call for help if they have fallen and some physio/OT to make falls less likely. However if the main reason for falls is being drunk.....

As another poster has said, you are not looking at a difficult few years, you are potentially looking at a hideous 20-30 years. Is your lovely DH really up for this?

I think you should decide on one thing you want - whether it is a holiday without her, or a financial contribution for a cleaner - and keep demanding it until you get it. And when you have it, move on to the next. Otherwise you will be back here posting every year until you are posting about your lovely husband asking for a divorce. Sorry to be so harsh.

I'm afraid to say, Kundry, that I think another 20 or 30 years is highly unlikely unless measures are taken to stop this behaviour short term. (A very overweight woman who is also a 'heavy drinker' ?) And that's something else the OP will have to take into account.

When she left the lemonade, did you calm her on it, or just clean it up?

If you cleaned it, you should gave asked why if was still there? Then asked her to clean it up.

Re: falling - if the reason us due to being drunk, that is entirely her responsibility, and not yours.

She 'refuses' to stay alone when you go on holiday? Absolutely no problem, and entirely her choice. Your response when she says this? 'okay mum, well here are the dates when we're away, for you to sort out what you want to do'.

I agree, you are enabling her. She is young and fit enough to get herself to the shop, she does NOT need picking up off the floor (I strongly suggest you call an ambulance next time, if she truly cannot pick herself up) and she CAN be left alone.

Tackling this will not be easy for you, but it will be necessary if you want anything to change!

You say she has been on AD's for years but it doesn't make a difference, so she must be aware that there are some mental health issues.

Would she go to the doc with you to discuss this? She may need different meds or a change in dose (has she had her thyroid count done - underactive can cause weight gain, depression and lethargy?), and whilst there discuss the possibility of counselling or therapy of some description.

I don't know anything about it, but would it be worth speaking to SS about her issues and seeing if you could get any help/respite care? She may not like it, but if you are going to keep living with her and retain your sanity something has to change.

You sound lovely btw and your DH must be amazing - I think mine would rather divorce me than live with my parents!

I really feel for you having been in a similar situation with my mother.
We lived with her for a year and it was like living in a pressure pot.

As much as I loved her, the moment she went in to hospital, it was a massive relief all round.
I always remember someone saying "You need to have two front doors." Very wise words indeed.
Could you split off some of the house, so that you are completely separate? We wanted to do this but my mother was very offended, so we couldn't win either way. I know for many, this is the only way this situation works.

Maybe contact AgeUK or social services to find out how your mum can live her life more independently from you.

ADs will do cock-all good if she's drinking while taking them. Alcohol itself is a depressant.

Your mother is or sounds just like my mother. She doesn't want to help herself. Diagnosing her as alcoholic or depressed won't achieve anything because she's not going to get help or do anything about it and you can't force her to. The only thing you can do is change your own behaviour towards her and move her out.

Just popping in quickly, should be getting organised for a firework party here tonight!

Thank you SO much for all the replies. I really do appreciate you taking the time to help.

Just to clear up a few points that people have raised.....

My Mum and Dad paid more than their fair share of the bills over the years, and alway treated the kids well with gifts etc...... so we are more than happy to pay the lion share now. Mum only now pays for a few insurances, her car and her personal shopping, we pay the rest, but like I say, we feel we should do, as she was generous for so many years, that's not an issue.

The house was owned by my Mum, Dad, Gran and Grandad. We always lived together (can you see a pattern here?!). Grandad died, then I met my DH and he moved in, we married had the boys. Gran died 7yrs ago, leaving her 1/4 share of the house to me, then when Dad died, Mum signed another 1/4 share to me. So, we own half each. There is no mortgage on the house, but I don't feel it would be my right to demand to sell up. She gave me the share out of kindness, she didn't have to do it. I couldn't move out.

She drinks about 4 litres of whiskey per week, and sometimes a couple of lagers in the afternoon.........is she an alchohlic? I don't drink, so I don't really know if this is normal, but I don't think so. If you have a conversation with her after 9pm, she won't remember it the next day.

I have this overwhelming feeling of 'I've made my bed, and now I have to lie in it'. It has always been assumed that I would care for mum when she gets old, and I am still going to stick to that, but I really feel that she is 'running out to meet old age'. She is not considering what it will mean to DH, the kids and I if she becomes totally imobile. She is so heavy, I couldn't lift her alone if it came to it.

Dh has no family at all. I have no siblings. I have a fairly large extended family, but we're not close to them, maybe see them twice a year.

This is why I wanted 3 children. When I am older, I want the to make decisions together, and it will be made clear that they will NOT be expected to care for DH and I.

My Dads Brother looks after the house when we are away, but he is 81, so couldn't pick her up if she fell.

I like the idea of an emergency button to press, that is worth looking into.

My DH thinks I'm suffering from stress, I think he maybe right.

Oh, and the 'mop' situation .............. No, she has seriously NEVER mopped/swept a floor, ever. When I was a child my gran (who lived with us)did the house work. I guess I picked up things like that from her.

Funny story ( well, not at the time!)....We have a cabinet in the hallway full of her ornaments(clutter). She never cleans it. Well, last week I got some new bulbs for it to light it up inside, and was shocked at the amount of dust that was in there. I said to Mum, could you clean your bits and pieces in there, as they look awful. She said, can't you just turn the lights out again!!! I said 'no, it needs doing, and I don't have time. She was doing her usual, playing on the laptop. She got up some time later, and said 'no, I can't do this, as If I move these things, I might not be able to get them back in again!!! I said 'well, do one shelf at a time, and it will be fine'. To this she answered 'I can't because my foot is sore!!!!!!! SO I did it the next day when my DD was asleep, and Mum played on her laptop!

I guess you could say by doing the job for her, I was enabling her behaviour, BUT if I didn't do it, she wouldn't have. I can't physically force her to do it, and I can't leave things like that, as we all have to look at it.

4 litres of whisky a week and beer top ups ? That you know about?

Yes - that's alcoholism, I'm afraid, fluffy.

I have read some of this thread. She sounds a bit lazy and selfish tbh. How old is she? wasn't quite sure. Have you got any other family who could stay with her whilst you go to Florida.

Could she buy you out and you could go and live somewhere else away from her. I would have gone mad by now with her. Couldn't bear it if she was doing nothing whilst i was struggling with 3 young kids which i have done.

I know people get depressed but sometimes they do need to help themselves a bit.

Oh my god are you me ???? !

Our stories are the same even down to our home ownership between gran and mum and the percentages etc. And the rest re bills. All the same.

My gran lived with us. She died. Her partof the house transferred to me. Mum and I owned half each. Mum didnt work. We paid all the bills. Etc.

Thing is..... if your mum didint have you to pay the bills she would have to downsize.If you didn't live with your mum you would have brought your own home and built up equity. So both of you are entitled to your share. Don't feel that you haven't earnt your share !! You've paid the bills, kept the house going and looked after your mum. That money is yours.

You're not leaving her high and dry. Is there enough for her to buy somewhere if you remortgage ? That's what we did.

Honestly I do know you're sitting there thinking you could never do that... how would she cope ? I'm so mean etc etc there's no one else to care for her... right ? But you are enabling this to carry on.

My ex husband left because in the end my mum drove him mad even though he never said so at the time. He got fed up.

Don't let that be you.

When I met my now dh I moved mum out.I wasn't going to risk losing another marriage over a dysfunctional relationship with my mum.

I am an only child too.

Re the Florida trip you could say that you'll be having a v active holiday and it sadly won't be suitable for her. Say that it is educational for the children which of course is what a loving grandma would want.

Take her to see a respite place/care home where she can stay for a couple of weeks while you are away as you are too worried that she will fall. Find the most luxurious one that you can. It will probably cost more than the holiday! This is her holiday.

To go into a respite home she will need to be assessed by a GP and you may discover what some of the problems are.

Not normal. Even with depression and anxiety that is not a normal level of dependence.

Why don't you move out and break te cycle if dependence?

I'm sorry but I would say that yes she is an alcoholic / has issues with drink ,you should inform her GP if only because I don't know of any anti depressants that should be mixed with alcohol and he needs to tackle that with her . In regards to all your other issues I don't think you really want to do anything about it because there are fairly easy solutions that have been suggested here and you just keep coming back and saying that you can't do this or that . You are enabling her behaviour but TBH it's your life ( and your family's ) so that's up to you .

Oh I didn't realise there was more from the OP. yes you're in a hard situation.

Remortgage. Buy her a one bed flat near by. Move her out. Visit regularly. Tell her she is an alcoholic and you'll supper her through treatment.

Don't be a martyr!

I have to say, fluffy, that I'm almost overwhelmed by the difficulty and bleakness of your situation. You and your DH must be lovely people to be dealing with this as you have.

I'm wondering how long your mother has been abusing alcohol like this. (Why is another matter.) From her current heavy consumption, I would guess for some years, including before she retired. Her physical condition, even without the added weight, will likely be extremely problematic eg liver problems, heart problems, potential diabetes, potential gastrointestinal problems such as pancreatitis and so on and so on. The list is very long indeed and her age is not a good factor anyway.

I don't see how you're easily going to persuade her to change/get help because, frankly, right now she's happy! She's got her booze, her internet and no responsibilities (because you and DH are shouldering them) and can spend her days in a warm fug with no concerns other than how low the level on the bottle is creeping.

You could try an ultimatum or withdrawing services to her and see how that goes. (I feel pessimistic about that.) You must in any case stop any use of a car by her. If necessary, disable her car if she has one so that she can't drive it and park your own round the corner so that she doesn't know where it is. That will mean you buying the booze but it's dangerous to withdraw alcohol suddenly when someone is at that level so you may have to get it for her in the first instance. That's better than having her plough into someone because she's half cut.

Then, it's imperative that you seek professional help on this. I'd be phoning the doctor's surgery on Monday morning and asking for a referral to the practice mental health professional if they have one.