AIBU (or juat old fashioned) to think it strange that parents allow this?

[cinnamonnut]

Had dinner in a nice hotel and a couple with two sons sat near us. Through most of the evening, dinner and all, one of the boys had those clunky beats by dr dre headphones glued to his ears. He was old enough to be able to concentrate at a nice dinner for a little while.

AIBU to think it's a shame that people seem to ignore the world and what's going on around them - and to also find it rude? I'm under 21, not sure if I'm being overly old fashioned...

Trig I think that it is very rude and ignorant to assume that if a person displays poor manners or anti social behaviour then they automatically must have SN, yes.

So, trig, where's your empathy?!!

I repeat again, I am not saying that SN should never be mentioned, or that in any thread it might not be relevant to raise it, but some threads really are not about it and the issue the OP was trying to make gets lost. I wanted to read what people thought about the intrusion of technology into social interaction and what I got was a thread about how various forms of SN might necessitate wearing headphones or using electronic devices. That is fine, and interesting, and I learnt something (because I did read it), but it was not what the thread was supposed to be about.

Also, please read what I am saying.
Do you really do think that all people with SN are rude with no manners?
Do you really think that everyone who is rude and has no manners is SN?

I'm with Triggles here. Before judging anyone, please give a thought as to the reasons why, whether it's SN or not.

Triggles did not say that "if a person displays poor manners or anti social behaviour then they automatically must have SN, yes."

Well put trixie

seriously? you think I have no empathy for those with SNs? I'll trot over and tell my DS2 then... he'll find that interesting... since he has SNs...

Actually, let's clarify this, as you are getting ridiculously rude about this.

I don't assume that whether or not someone has SNs if they are displaying poor manners or antisocial behaviour. I do keep in mind, however, that there is the POSSIBILITY that they may, and therefore attempt to refrain from making a judgement.

Not necessarily likely kitty but certainly possible. Your post is irrelevant to the thread in question anyway as the boy in this situation was none of those things ( except maybe rude by some peoples standards)
The point is that we don't know, and that it is perfectly reasonable to suggest that this odd and unsociable bahaviour may well be down to a personal situation other than 'the worlds gone to shit'

If you'll note the title stated "AIBU or just old-fashioned to think it strange that parents allow this?" That rather implies that she is wondering why the parents allowed the child to wear the headphones at the table. Perfectly reasonable for someone to point out that it might be due to SNs.

Now, if the OP was titled something about "with all the new technology about, why wear clunky headphones when you can wear something that is much less obvious to the casual (nosy, judgemental) observer in a restaurant?" then she might get more answers in that regard.

"Not what the thread was supposed to be about"? I had no idea that we were required to follow a script in these threads.

Actually having read the thread I am not in the least offended by the OP. Okay she didn't consider the boy might have SN but if she has little experience of it then it won't necessarily cross her mind ( although I am betting in future that it will ).

My son is autistic and tbh I don't think twice about headphones in public anymore. I am fortunate that he does not need them in a restaurant but in the street with sirens etc he DOES need them to muffle the sound.

I don't care either what people think ....actually that's a lie because if I see them looking I nearly always point out that DS is autistic and scared of loud noises.

OP no YANBU to wonder why the child had headphones on. If he is NT then he is indeed old enough not to need them. IF he has SN then perhaps they serve a purpose but you know that now.

Ice yes, I agree. There are a million reasons why people behave the way they do. Bad day, bereavement, unhappy home life, unhappy past, sick friend/ relative etc etc. It's not always because of SNPaRole people are just not very nice as well.

kalisi my first post was in response to everyone talking about SN.

It wouldn't bother me & I wouldn't judge. I wouldn't let DC do it but I still wouldn't care what other people did. It would only bother me if something about the headphones bothered me directly (like if they clunked my face or I could hear annoying music coming out of them). yabu.

I find the whole 'manners' thing quite bizarre in all honesty.

I absolutely agree with being mindful and courteous towards others - doing nothing to harass,alarm or hurt them.Or spoil their ability to enjoy a situation.

But,manners for the sake of them ,is an odd concept to me.

There are certain elements of etiquette that demand that totally ridiculous and antiquated practices are followed.For example,port being passed around the table in the correct direction. Wtf has that got to do with anything?

Another person to be wearing headphones on another table is absolutely fuck all to do with me and doesn't affect me in any way, shape, or form.

I wouldn't like it within my family group at my table.But it wouldn't shake my world if it did happen.

jake the problem is when posters reasonably pointed out to the OP that the boy may have been wearing headphones due to SN they were greeted with 'sigh, not another SN debate'

That is utterly wrong ...and sad.

Deal with it folks,.....it's the reality of life for lots of us. No the boy might not have had SN but equally he might have done. Nothing wrong with that being pointed out.

And I have said, about 4 times, that it is perfectly reasonable and right for it to be pointed out, but once that happened, the vast majority of the posts were about that and not about whether, under other circumstances it might be strange, or inappropriate or whatever to wear headphones in a restaurant. Incidentally, what do people think about the issue of people who use these devices in restaurants interacting with the waiting staff? Do they notice when the waiter/ress is trying to serve, or ask them a question? Do they ask for what they want or just gesture at the menu? Just wondering really.

Bloody hell, some of you need to take a long hard look at your nasty attitudes.

sign, not another SN debate

As for but it was not what the thread was supposed to be about - what a stupid thing to say, the thread was about why parents would allow a child to wear headphones at the table and it was pointed out the SN might be one reason. IF the OP had wanted a debate on technology in modern society she could have phrased it that way... she didn't, she asked why parents would allow it. Completely different.

I wanted to read what people thought about the intrusion of technology into social interaction and what I got was a thread about how various forms of SN might necessitate wearing headphones or using electronic devices. That is fine, and interesting, and I learnt something (because I did read it), but it was not what the thread was supposed to be about

Frankly, I don't care what you wanted. It wasn't even you who started the thread, if you want a thread to discuss a certain aspect of something, start your own thread and word it appropriately

FGS!! WHY is SN brought into everything?! ... This lad was most likely a spoilt brat with no manners. Just like the majority of DC who take their DS out for a meal and ignore the company they are in

^ THIS is exactly why 'SN is brought into everything' to TRY to educate people, because people are so ignorant they don't even consider the child might have SN.

You rude, ignorant people, alienate people who have children with special needs, people who need support, people who need MN more than you will ever know. Is it so hard to think before open your mouth or post - is it so hard to consider there might be a reason for something you simply see as 'spoilt brat behaviour'.

Well said chipping

Great post chipping.

chipping people like you are the reason why people like me actually leave the house and enter public places with children.

Children, whatever their neurological status, aren't generally ordering and wearing headsets in restaurants simultaneously, are they? Their parents say, "Oi, Sam, take that off." "What do you want to order? No, you can't have that. It's too expensive. No, not that either."

oh never mind, clearly some of you are determined to ignore the parts of my posts where I am talking about SN and my absolute support for people to both discuss it and raise awareness and help those of us without direct experience to be more accomodating / accepting etc. My point was simply about the original issue that was posted about being lost. SN is one element of the discussion, but not all. I don't want to spend my Sunday defending myself against having a nasty attitude so I will leave you to it.

Trixie - Don't pull the 'poor old me, I'm so misunderstood' shite. Try reading your own posts again. Where exactly is that absolute support? Where is one flicker showing you have having listened and taken anything on board?

The original point of the thread was not lost - the OP asked 'Why a parent would allow this' and people replied.

I realise this thread has exploded into the usual MN tirades about appreciating special needs issues and whilst that is a perfectly valid thing to point out, I think MNHQ is going to soon have to issue guidance as to how to word an OP so fthat the actual point being raised is addressed and not always descend into the SN issue. Perhaps the OP box could have a pre-written first sentence along the lines of "Assuming no-one involved had SN, AIBU to think...." just to save us all some time? I do not wish to be at all dismissive of those with SN and the challenges they face but it is not always relevant to every discussion. And now I will duck and cover!

If you read what I said at the end of my post you'll see that I specifically said I am entirely sympathetic to those with special needs and that it was perfectly justifiable for it to be pointed out, but that isn't what the OP was about. The "descend" into a "tirade" was addressed to the tone of some of the posts, not to suggest that it's tedious and boring to consider it, just that it does sometimes overtake the actual issue of the OP

Where exactly, in the first post, does you say anything about being entirely sympathetic to those with SN?

Kalisi, PP, Sock - you are more than welcome, I just wish it wasn't necessary. Maybe one day people will think first - we can live in hope.