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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think that Freemasonry should not be allowed to exist?

573 replies

StickMeToTheMan · 06/10/2012 14:59

... or that members should declare their membership - especially those in positions of power - police, SS, politicians etc?

I am just flabbergasted that this is allowed in this day and age. Take a look at the JS scandal and the potential involvement of the masons, and surely no-one can dispute that this old boy network is dangerously shady.

Can anyone explain to me what it is really for, and if membership to any secret society is justifiable in this day and age?

AIBU?

(Namechanged as have been discussing on FB)

OP posts:
SarahStratton · 07/10/2012 00:57

A month ago, I'd have said very differently, but with everything that is coming out now about JS, Jersey, etc, I am firmly with LineRunner. Whoever said 'it's not a Secret Society, it's a Society with Secrets' was spot on.

I didn't know JS was a FM, but from what I do know it doesn't now surprise me. It's an impossible situation though, do anything about it and it will simply go underground.

LesleyPumpshaft · 07/10/2012 04:55

StickMeToTheMan

It's called Western Mysticism and it's nothing to be worried about. It's been around for a very long time under various names. Some people join the Masons with a view to networking etc, but other people join for the more esoteric stuff.

Spuddybean · 07/10/2012 05:15

Sorry Garlic and Linerunner. I wasn't being disingenuous, i was on bfing and am a bit sleep deprived, so i did miss that point earlier - apologies. :) But my point was just about the secret rituals which people keep mentioning, not any secret corruption (which i think is obviously more sinister than any 'dressing up' etc).

Beaverfeaver · 07/10/2012 06:01

My GF was a Grand Master FM whilst he was alive and was therefore involved quite heavily being in one of the top posisfions.

He kept a secret diary about it which my mum has read and hidden from us along with his Masonic robes/cloak. (Which I happen to have stumbled across once and seen) its more like a high priest cloak and is made of black/purply-blue/gold silk, with highly decorated drapes, a mitre (like a high priests hat).

Years ago before I was born my DF asked my GF if he could join them (you have to be invited), and GF told him that it wasn't for everyone and he wouldn't want a family member being involved.
It takes up a lot of time and money to be a FM.
The FM becomes more sacred to these people than their marriage.
It is a brotherhood, but more like a cult in some aspects. It will take over people's lives.
People who are involved have access to things most people don't. Their children get places in top schools without trying etc.
they do a lot for charity, but from what my DM has revealed it is ritualistic and hinted at there being sacrificial parts to it too

Beaverfeaver · 07/10/2012 06:24

Like this :

images.denhams.com/557/557lot698.jpg

images.denhams.com/557/557lot703.jpg

echt · 07/10/2012 07:39

Wasn't JS a Catholic? I didn't know RCs could be Freemasons. Thought they had rival organisations like the Knights of St.Columba.

amillionyears · 07/10/2012 08:46

I didnt realise that charity giving can be such a good smokescreen.

Madmum24 · 07/10/2012 09:01

The womens FM was only started because during one of the meetings a woman was discovered hiding in a cupboard. Two choices; kill her or start a womens FM in order to protect the organization. Obviously the latter happened. And this was told to me by a very devoted FM.

It's very naive to think that this was not a way of getting jobs etc, my dad told me himself that an unsaid criteria for his job (think law enforcement) was to be a FM! This was in early 80's so perhaps times have now changed.

theroseofwait · 07/10/2012 09:04

Came back to check this thread this morning and read Beaverfeaver's post of 06.01 out loud to dh. You will be pleased to know that has made his day already and he is now making coffee while chortling about them sacrificing many a virgin on a Saturday night. . .

YABRidiculous. Please try and ascertain a few facts before spouting such utter rubbish. I'm not sure what your DGF was but it certainly wasn't a freemason. Masons wear an apron and collar, no cloak and mitre. Knights of the Templar do wear the odd pair of tights (knight's attire) but dh was asking if you'd all been watching too much 'Eyes wide shut. . . .'

theroseofwait · 07/10/2012 09:13

. . .and dh just checked his toast list and as the Grand Master is the Duke of Kent and has been since 1967, and his father was Grand Master before him, elected in 1939, you're either the most well connected mumsnetter we've got or spouting utter crap.

MrsjREwing · 07/10/2012 09:16

That is correct Queen's cousin is GM, says so on wiki.

Vagaceratops · 07/10/2012 09:18

I havent read the whole thread, but I am a trustee of a small local charity and the Freemasons have been extremely generous to us.

Giggle78 · 07/10/2012 09:20

My dad was in the masons and he got quite high. It is an occult organisation.
He left when he became a Christian. At its lowest level it is about dinners and networking but get a bit higher and its much more sinister and its not just about dressing up but at its highest levels is about communing with Satan. I kid you not.

amillionyears · 07/10/2012 09:22

I'll say it again,I am so realising from this thread how great a smokescreen charity giving can be.
If people or organisations are generous to charity,then they msut be fine upstanding citizens mustnt they. Hmm

MrsjREwing · 07/10/2012 09:31

So is satan their random higher being then?

CoteDAzur · 07/10/2012 09:56

" how great a smokescreen charity giving can be"

Freemasonry isn't primarily about charity. It's goals are intellectual and geared towards the individual Freemason.

You think they pretend to be all about charity to hide some insidious intent, because you don't know anything about Freemasonry.

CoteDAzur · 07/10/2012 09:57

" at its highest levels is about communing with Satan"

That is pure bullshit.

IWantAnotherBaby · 07/10/2012 09:58

I find the suspicious hysteria surrounding freemasonary hilarious. It really feeds into paranoid people's conspiracy theory mindsets, and certainly lends itself to great yarns.

My father is a mason, as was his father. Both achieved very high rank. My grandfather was of a generation who felt women should be protected and was very secretive about the whole thing, to my grandmothers irritation. But my father has always been very open about it all, and told me pretty much everything. I find it the whole history and mythology fascinating, and would have no problem if DH was interested in joining (he isn't).

There is a lot of ritual, and some archaic language, but it is all very benign. Like-minded individuals meeting together for formal dinners, who support each other emotionally, and sometimes financially, are nothing to be afraid of. Why the hell shouldn't they exist? And why should they be made to disclose their membership? What business is it of anyone else? No-one calls for members of other organisations to declare their membership, and despite the hype and widespread invidious fictions spread about the masons, they are essentially no different.

The problem is ignorant people, scared of what they don't understand - rather like the witch hunts of the middle ages...

auntmargaret · 07/10/2012 09:59

Cote, if its goals are intellectual, why does it attract the lowest common denominator in society?

difficultpickle · 07/10/2012 10:04

Many years ago I had a boyfriend who was invited to join. He wasn't in the least bit interested. He was put under pressure to join but still declined. He was told that it would help further his career and would damage him if he didn't join. He still said no but was not at all impressed at the amount of pressure he was put under.

He thought that if he had a job stacking shelves in Tesco he wouldn't have been invited. Instead he had a job where he had contact with a large number of very powerful individuals (wealth management, tax planning for them).

If it is so charitable and so open then why don't they publish a membership list?

difficultpickle · 07/10/2012 10:05

IWant have you been to any meetings?

amillionyears · 07/10/2012 10:06

CoteDAzur,unfortuneately I do.

CoteDAzur · 07/10/2012 10:11

"auntmargaret - "if its goals are intellectual, why does it attract the lowest common denominator in society?"

What is the lowest common denominator in society? Love of our children?

Or do you mean the lowest members of society? As in, the least intellectual and the dumbest? I can assure you that is not the case. They may not be the best and the brightest but I would assume that they are interested in bettering themselves through thought and intellectual work.

Anyway, if you are going to subscribe to "Freemasons control the world!" conspiracy theory, surely you can't reconcile that with them all being stupid, shallow, and unintellectual.

CoteDAzur · 07/10/2012 10:13

Let's hear it amillionyears. What exactly do you know about Freemasonry?

What are the rituals? What are they for? What happens during the meetings?

Hint: Nothing to do with politics, and certainly no "communing with Satan" FFS.

28handicap · 07/10/2012 10:14

Morning - I am a freemason and still I play rubbish golf!