to think that Freemasonry should not be allowed to exist?

[StickMeToTheMan]

... or that members should declare their membership - especially those in positions of power - police, SS, politicians etc?

I am just flabbergasted that this is allowed in this day and age. Take a look at the JS scandal and the potential involvement of the masons, and surely no-one can dispute that this old boy network is dangerously shady.

Can anyone explain to me what it is really for, and if membership to any secret society is justifiable in this day and age?

AIBU?

(Namechanged as have been discussing on FB)

I'm talking about hearing other masons' million pound planning applications, for example.

You're really not getting LineRunner's point, are you Spuddy? Well, either that or you're obfuscating.

I did hear a hair-raising tale of how a lodge tried to manage a member's illegal business activities by itself, rather than by public procedure. (I won't say reporting him, since the people to whom he should have been reported were also members!) They eventually dobbed him in after he tried to defraud another member.

I'm being vague because the Mason who confided in me shouldn't have. It went on for months and months.

Nogrey, I thought Common Purpose was a leadership training institute? What am I missing?

It is, garlic. An independent charity to promote young leadership stuff.

garlic i have attended many other lodges as a hospitality and we have joint celebration events.

That's lovely, but what about the million pound planning applications?

So the JS scandal has nothing to with there are probably more high up people involved in his kind of paedophile circle who have covered up than we would know? Of course not, it has to be because the masons are involved.

Yabu. As a wife of a mason I freely help him with his learning. I confess to not knowing the ritual practise other than what is written and tbh I have no interest in that. All that concerns me is we have made some good friends, gained assistance from those with skills in areas we've needed help (employed an accountant, got to know a woodworker who has made us things, help from individuals, not the charity fund, when we needed to buy baby things.) nothing will help dh progress in work because unless he or others choose to reveal themselves how will they know? Round these parts you are far more likely to be favoured by how far you can trace your roots back to the area than by membership of a club which is commonly known as 'big boy scouts' to us wives.

No-one on the planning applications, then? Ah, well.

Around here the masons have a long history of obstructing child abuse investigations to protect their members.

Charity my arse. I wouldn't trust them full stop.

im a domestic violence consultant with qualifications in dv, housing law, child protection, welfare benefits,forensics and youth justice with a specialist intrest in multi agency crisis intervention.

i am compleatly unqualified to sit on a planning application panel and cant imagine any reason why i would be asked to, its fair to say nobody would ask me to push a planning app through.

i have obtained planning permision for building work and asked a friend from the cab to help me not a mason.

Well done to all those Masons who pretend its just a "little club" and their little women believe it. It's corrupt and insidious and there is a handshake. They seek to obtain advantage for themselves and their families bases not on merit, but on membership and its more widespread than you think. The charity aspect is a smokescreen, it's all about advancement for the member, and those the brotherhood deem to be like them. Membership should be a sacking offence in any public sector or publicly funded organisation.

I mean councillors who are masons sitting on planning committees, being advised by officers who are masons, determining planning applications submitted by fellow masons, worth possibly millions of pounds.

I asked this quite a way up the thread, and it remains unanswered as to why these masons wouldn't want to declare their innocent interest. (As in 'conflict of interest'.)

I've attended hospitality events and celebrations at Masonic Lodges, Sock, and, like Spuddy, went to a wedding at one. I am decidedly not a Mason of either gender! This thread has a very weird quality. Why on earth would you feel driven to insist women can join, when their own website says we can't? The order of women freemasons is not the order of freemasons. The clue's in the different name.

glad about that because i would rather swing naked from big ben singing ive got a lovely bunch of coconuts than sit on a planning commitee.

now i dont know how the committes work but i would have thought any personal friendships regardless of any club memberships with people seeking to benefit from the committies interaction should be declared as a potential conflict.

Well, the charities do charitable stuff, to be fair, margaret.

So did the Kray Brothers.

Sock, they should be, but they're not.

You have to be a councillor to sit on a panning commmittee. Councillors should be open and transparent.

Panning? FFS...

YY, Sock, they should. But they don't. So their lapdancing clubs and completely redundant multi-million developments (recent local fiasco) get signed off by professionals choosing to keep their mutual 'private club' membership quiet.

Such behaviour is not open, above-board, unbiased or even in the spirit of honesty. Yet it is rife. And everyone just burbles on about tree houses and trinkets

in the area i live female members are just treated like a different lodge(an area with loads of different lodges) and are recanised as freemasons the same as male members in different lodges are,ladys would never be told they are not masons nor would it be claimed that they are lesser masons because of gender.

most of the lodges in the county also archive there records in the same place that holds birth/death/marrige records they are all availible for public viewing for any reason they are also encouraged to publicise and be proud of membership.

when i said celebrations at lodges i was not refering to the lodge being hired out i ment actual formal lodge celebrations with no none masons attending.

Do they record how they voted on planning and licensing decisions, Sock? And what advice they offered? And what they applied for?

Sorry to bang on about this, but it's my main objection tbh to masonry.

xposted there.

surely thats down to the inderviduals involved, are they not even asked if there are any conflicts?

No, it is up to them to declare them, voluntarily.

They don't.

i would expect if the planning issue was directly relivant to that lodge yes.

however if its not to do with the lodge it would be a bit weird if they did,same as i wouldnt talk about customers of my work at any of the clubs i attend.

if they dont declare its dishonest, not being trustworthy honest law abiding and a good citizen goes against masonic values.

not saying they are all decent just that its encouraged and a value that is prized