Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be angry that the Chief Constable chose the words..

999 replies

seeker · 19/09/2012 09:20

"gentle" and "a chatterbox" respectively to describe the two women police officers who were murdered on duty yesterday.

Can you imagine those words ever being used to describe a man?

OP posts:
cynner · 19/09/2012 22:30

Well LadyBeagleEyes, I happen to fucking disagree. I also did not point any fingers or single anyone out. It appears that you might be in the grip of hysteria, and should calm the fuck down.

edam · 19/09/2012 22:32

Orwellian, robotic, wizened old crone... there are plenty more personal insults on this thread.

BupcakesandCunting · 19/09/2012 22:35

I don't think that me saying that those defending seeker are being cold-hearted and robotic is particularly nasty, tbh. That's how I feel they're conveying themselves.

Not one of you has acknowledged the fact that Peter Fahy DID in fact talk about them in work terms as well as having the temerity to speak about them on a personal level. Why? Because it would ruin your argument, that's why. You'd rather pick the poor bloke apart after he has made a statement in the very worst of circumstances, very shortly after it happened. To me, that is cold-hearted and robotic.

BupcakesandCunting · 19/09/2012 22:36

Yes, no life experience/mindless mob being other examples.

SigmundFraude · 19/09/2012 22:36

Swearing like that is totally unreasonable cynner.

cynner · 19/09/2012 22:37

Thanks, Edam. I come from a family of police officers. I have been to funerals of officers fallen in the line of duty. Not once have I ever heard anyone discuss how these individuals were described in the press. Everyone is too busy mourning and trying to be of support to the family.
Living in a free society gives us the right to voice an opinion, even if other's have an opposing view. I am horrified that people have gone to a base level. If you are that upset by a thread that you must lash out at strangers on the Internet, then perhaps you need to step away from that thread...as I intend to do...

Empusa · 19/09/2012 22:37

There are edam, may I also add mindless and baying to the list?

cynner · 19/09/2012 22:38

Well, Sig, just responding to LadyBeagles, comment to me. Do as done, eh?

SigmundFraude · 19/09/2012 22:38

Some of the language used HAS been strangely robotic and unemotional though, I'd have to agree with that.

LadyBeagleEyes · 19/09/2012 22:38

Nope, I never get hysterical. I'm perfectly calm.
I think I said way up thread that I disagreed with Seeker on this point but it was nothing personal, as I've agreed with her on other threads.
But I'll bugger off now, I've tried to keep to the point, but now you are getting personal.

ZombiesAreClammyDodgers · 19/09/2012 22:39

sygmund she was responding in kind to another poster.

edam · 19/09/2012 22:39

Bupcakes, afraid you are wrong, I did say I thought the Chief Constable's words were poignant and fine in context. I also think seeker had every right to start this thread and have a discussion without being shouted down by people who seem to be venting their anger at the event onto seeker in a very bizarre manner. Or maybe venting their anger generally. Or maybe angry with 'feminists' in some way and using this thread as an excuse. Who knows...

LestWeForget · 19/09/2012 22:39

As a serving officer with GMP I can only say that this is one of the most offensive and inappropriate threads I have read in along time.

I was in work yesterday when we heard the news and the overwhelming feeling of shock has been palpable. It has been like a black cloud has descended over Manchester. We then had to try and carry on doing our jobs despite the devastating news because we are professionals.

But I wept in the car on the way home. I was close to tears going to pick my children up thinking that maybe somewhere there were children waiting for a mother that may never come. I wept each time it came on the news and my youngest kept asking me what was wrong.

It was the first thing I thought of this morning when I woke up. I thought that only 24 hours earlier Fiona and Nicola would have been doing exactly the same not knowing it was the last time they would ever get ready to go to work. I thought of the people they had left behind and I shed a few more tears.

Today we had a minutes' silence at 11 o'clock but it was hardly necessary. Everyone had worked in almost complete silence with really only one thing on their minds. Colleagues went to the scene to lay flowers but I really just couldn't. It's been all so overwhelming.

I had never met Fiona or Nicola and never worked with them but the Chief Con used words to describe them as human beings not Police Officers in uniform. There have been many words used to describe their professionalism and dedication but the words used to their personalities, 'gentle', 'bubbly' chatterbox are so much more descriptive and meaningful. I am sure bubbly and chatterbox would be words used to describe me (in fact I think they were at a recent award ceremony)but I wouldn't think for one second that it in anyway was an attack on my professionalism because I would take that as read.

There have been a number of threads recently about 'why would a woman not want to be described as a feminist' and it's issues like this which mean I am one of those woman who will not refer to themselves as such. It is of so little consequence that the term 'girls' was used instead of 'women' (I imagine the word ladies would have offended some!!!) that I can't even waste a minutes thought on it. Personally I am extremely flattered if I am referred to as a girl due to my advanced age and as I am confident in my own abilities would never feel it was a reflection on my 'professionalism' which is how it should be.

Unlike a lot on this thread I will not upset myself over the use of insignificant words.I will instead go to work tomorrow and do the professional job I always do which involves managing a group of 20 officers most of whom are male. I know they respect me because I am good at my job and I really won't give a flying f**k whether they call me a girl, lady, woman, ma'am are boss because there really more important things to worry about................

RIP Fiona and Nicola

Empusa · 19/09/2012 22:40

I feel I should point out that while there have been insults thrown, there are a lot of posters on this thread, the majority of whom haven't resorted to throwing insults.

edam · 19/09/2012 22:41

Why is it so offensive to you, LestWe? I really don't get it. Seeker asked a thoughtful question about the language used to describe these two officers. You may disagree with her point but I don't understand why you find it so offensive.

SharonGless · 19/09/2012 22:42

Just home after another 10 hour shift in Gmp and I am disgusted and heartbroken at this thread.

The Chief Constable was quoting what family and friends said about the officers who had died only 4 hours before. In his speech I can see nothing which denigrates them.

Ian Hanson had come straight from comforting the grieving colleagues and was almost breaking down during the press conferences. He might be an inspector but he is an officer and we are all completely devastated. His use of the phrase girls may be construed as inappropriate but up here it's very much girls and lads, especially on the response teams, regardless of age.

I agree with the power of language debate but it's still too raw for me to debate properly.

Hiding thread

ZombiesAreClammyDodgers · 19/09/2012 22:43

Stepping away now. Strange how so many are having problems understanding that Seeker is talking about respecting the two fallen officers.
Her views on what is more respectful may conflict with other people's. Doesn't make this thread inappropriate.
I'm sorry but it really does not.

SharonGless · 19/09/2012 22:44

Lest. More eloquent than I, thank you for your post.

Edam, seeker had her facts wrong to start with and wouldn't acknowledge this.

ZombiesAreClammyDodgers · 19/09/2012 22:46

sharon, lest - thank you for adding more context to the matter. I guess it is easy to forget the stress that the persons making the statements were under.

BupcakesandCunting · 19/09/2012 22:46

Nah, she isn't talking about respecting the two fallen officers (and if we're nitpicking, they didn't fall, they were murdered, seeing as you're such a stickler for correct terminology!) Seeker is just annoyed because she thinks the menz wouldn't be spoken about in such a banal way. Even though Empusa and I have both provided several links where they have been.

Sorry for you both Sharon and Lest. It must be terrible for you both.

edam · 19/09/2012 22:46

Ah, OK, you are angry because you thought it was an attack on the chief constable?

I think the discussion was quite useful in teasing out what was involved in his tribute.

SigmundFraude · 19/09/2012 22:48

Really sorry, Lest and Sharon...it must be really hard.

BupcakesandCunting · 19/09/2012 22:48

"sharon, lest - thank you for adding more context to the matter. I guess it is easy to forget the stress that the persons making the statements were under."

Most of us disagreeing with seeker have said that the CC had to make the statement in terrible circumstances so cut him some slack. Confused But all we've heard back from seeker's supporters is "A man in his position should know better" and then wonder why robotic is bandied about

seeker · 19/09/2012 22:49

"There are edam, may I also add mindless and baying to the list?"

As I said, I used those words. And retracted them, when called on them.

And if I appeared "cold hearted and robotic" it was because I was determined to keep at least my side of the debate thoughtful, respectful and measured. The extraordinary level of personal abuse ( rather than disagreement- disagreement is fine) has been a bit shocking. But it's reassuring to know that I haven't sunk to the abusers' level.

OP posts:
BupcakesandCunting · 19/09/2012 22:51

Extraordinary level of personal abuse?

Never had you down as such a delicate flower, seeker.

Swipe left for the next trending thread