AIBU to think that it very sad that young girls

[fartattack]

nowadays seem to believe that all hair on their bodies must be waxed off entirely.

I know some people say they prefer it but IME young girls ALL seem to think it's normal to be totally hair free. WHY??

AIBU to think this is terribly sad that they are put under this pressure to wax it all off all the time.

Well done for putting my point concisely, Krumbum!

There is no evidence that women choose to spend time in a salon BECAUSE they don't like sport. And ten minutes on MN, listening to music or reading mags is much more likely to be done for the enjoyment of it.

"Where is the sadness..... for being ridiculed about being overweight" etc? That's sad too.

My god what is wrong with me I always get drawn into this argument.

My point is that its not specific to waxing, young girls, or women in general. Peer pressure and ridicule are everywhere, and that considering pube removal isn't exactly permanent or harmful I think there are other issues that can and should be prioritised as recipients for your sadness.

Men are open to ridicule and expected to conform too. I know friends and I've certainly seen it on mn, where men are ridiculed for having a wonky cock, being bald, a hairy back, being fat, ugly feet etc etc.

Its not just young women, older women are often ridiculed for their appearance.

The pressure and the option of being ridiculed when young was always there. I remember being at school, this is quite some years ago, and as i said girls being teased by boyfriends or boys in general for being fat, or their nipples or an 'ugly' fanny.

Or maybe its just me and I am completely deluded, afterall during this discussion last time on mn I was told I was responsible for the rape of children, quite specifically a 3 year old girl, so what do I know.

Maybe we're disagreeing about the OP's use of the word, 'sad'? Is your point that there are more important issues than this so you feel the OP should concentrate on more important things?
A matter of degree?
I can see how someone could feel like that, but I still agree that it is sad to see so many girls taking their grooming to the extent of removing all their body hair. I would like more for my DD than a world where it's normal to accept bullying/ridicule/unrealistic expectations for having a NORMAL body.

one of the male commedians on the tv said that in the 70's it was all there and it was alright, men knew where they were with that, then in the 80's it went smaller and they thought thats okay too.

but this all off stuff makes them feel wiered, they like it, but its a bit pervy at the same time... it scares them!

this made me laugh, cos i'm all natural and i like it like that, but i understand each woman can choose her own hairstyle and it doesnt matter what anyone else thinks, but its nice knowing what this particular man thought!

Come to think of it, I've never met anyone who's ever told me of a time that they or anyone else they knew had been teased for having "an ugly fanny" or a "wonky cock". That's really horrible and unacceptable.

But bring ridiculed about those things isnt directly related to your sexuality.
There also isn't the same expectation on men. We don't have ads everywhere telling men they should be waxing, we don't see all male celebrities bare and hair free.

Choc I think yes one of my points is that its such a small issue, another one of my points is that I think to say I'm 'sad' about it is quite patronising as it does remove the element of choice, and make hair removal something that is inflicted rather than an act that women, an men for that matter, choose to participate in.

My other point is its nothing new and that hair removal (which has as far as I know been done even in ancient times) could be replaced with various other beauty trends from the past decades or even centuries. There is always a certain look or style for a time period and like all the others this too shall pass. Now the look is healthy, previously it was very thin, before it was curvy or really voluptuous. There is always a look which will make some people feel inadequate.

I'm not going to argue with Krum because this is her favourite topic and I've had the discussion with her before. I will never agree with her.

Also I've certainly seen jokes on mn about the downfalls of ex partners that have included lots of insults about looks including their genitals. Surely you've heard the size of a mans cock or it being crooked mocked. Its mentioned on tv, I hear it as part of discussions I have with my female friends. Its not seen as unacceptable to criticise a man in that way.

I also remember being a teen and spending lots of time with a group of guys and they used to talk about a certain girls this or that or how she smelled or that her nether regions were ugly or whatever. I still hear this occasionally. Although it seems much more acceptable to criticise male genitalia than womens.

I've never started a post on this! I've just posted on a few that others have started. Because this is a feminist issue.

Ah, am I right to think you're saying that it's insulting to women who choose to remove their pubic hair to tell them you feel sad for them because it would be like saying, 'You're silly (that's the best word I can think of at the moment) because you think you're choosing to do this because it's something you want but actually you're being manipulated by social pressure?'
However, you can only choose to do something if you've heard of it and you can access the means to do it.

WHY is this a new and apparently widespread phenomenon? After all, most people won't see your pubes (I assume!) and it's not an activity that many people would enjoy for its own sake. (In fact waxing is likely to be at least a little bit unpleasant/uncomfortable).
I think I would go as far as to say that I'd be sad (though I take your point that there are worse things to dwell on) if my own DD felt the need to spend time/money/effort on removing her pubic hair, because I don't think the reason she'd be doing it would be a good one and it's time that she could have been having fun/doing something useful/learning something which would benefit her gone........forever.

I personally don't like the shaved all over look on a woman, I keep my genital region "tidy" (so basically in a bikini I don't look like I've got golden virginia hanging out the side) but of course they're doing it because of peer pressure.

As a teen I got ridiculed by a lad because of my "pyramid" shaped boobs. Ever since then (now 25) have never liked the shape of my boobs even though my OH tells me they are awesome.

Luckily I've never resorted to surgery and only used shaping bras to get desired "normal" look that I wanted (no need now, breastfeeding have melons now ) at least being hairless isn't harmful and gives the girls the confidence in their body that they crave without going under the knife etc.

Sorry to be on the fence ladies but I can see both sides

But I'd better be careful with that argument in case people tell me that it's s sad that I feel the need to spend (ahem, the whole evening) on MN when I could be doing something useful etc :o
(Definitely learning stuff though! Ruby, your posts make me think.)

I doubt many women who have plastic surgery don't depilate.

I feel a bit sad that DD feels the need to apply a load of make-up and spend ages on her hair every morning too. At least everyone gets to see the gorgeous outcome of her efforts. Loss of innocence and all that.
Krumbum come back and explain.

It's not just the time etc but the loss of innocence...... :(

Yay, Krumbum you're back!

I think thats a fair description Choc to me the word sad is quite linked with pity, so I'm not a big fan of it.

Personally I wax it all off, but I used to shave. Back in the days of bush being fashionable I was removing my pubes quite aggressively. I'd never really seen anyone without pubes, but certain things made me want to do it (heavy periods etc). I'm not saying some aren't victims of peer pressure but not all, I just prefer how it feels, as I said earlier I don't think it looks great.

To me peer pressure is teen life, as a teen your idols and your friends are who you look to. Your mum telling you something is fashionable is completely irrelevant, so to me all aspects of teen life are linked to peers so I just can't get upset about this one.

I'm quite shocked that people have mentioned boys at school ridiculing their boobs and even their fanjo. Is that par for the course in a mixed school? I went to a single sex school, but thought i would send my girls to mixed as that is what is available locally and also i thought it would be good for them to mix with boys and girls, rather than see boys as a separate species as I did.
I remember friendly ribbing from friends at school (girls) about my albino skin and other things, but nothing nasty.

Also for what its worth. My DD1 is 16 nearly 17, she wears make-up for nights out but for day to day she really doesn't wear that much, no more than I wore at that age.

When I was a teen every girl I knew was on the eyeliner, most of DDs friends are attached to mascara and lip gloss.

Her hair takes time but because of the way her hair is its more taming than styling. I feel she is just like me at that age, although grunge was in when I was her age so I probably spent even longer perfecting my courtney love look!

Can't say I know much about fake tan as dcs are mixed race.

Off on a tangent here, but do kids still smoke behind the bikesheds like in my day? Dont seem to hear about it. Also I don't seem to see "goths" (emos?) around at all now. As you were.

Quangle Having just interrogated DD1 about your questions and including my own opinion.

1. Maybe I hung around with a really horrible crowd or went to a nasty school (both highly plausible) but yes that teasing went on. Although only because they were seen, girls who weren't showing their boobs or bits to the boys didn't really experience the same level of teasing or teasing about the same things. DD was just telling me about a girl in her year who is known as 'Sausage Flaps', I'm sure you can imagine why, however this is came about after she sent various boys naked pictures of herself. There is also a girl who has a permanent nipple ere ton who gets teased for that, and that isn't really anything she's done. Is just school life.

1. We never smoked behind the bike sheds, we smoked in the toilets or outside. At DDs school they're allowed out at break and lunch so they just leave school and smoke. I imagine it still goes on, in the equivalent of the bike sheds. Although I so think less smoke than when I was a teen.

I don't believe that as many women would make this 'choice' if we lived in an equal, non sexist society.
We are judged for going against the grain and praised for going with it so it is difficult to say that paying a lot of money for someone to painfully rip out your hair is simply a choice that loads of women happen to make because they love it. It simply isn't that simplistic.

I do think it's sad we now live in a society where should a girl choose not to rip out all her pubic hair she stands the risk of being ridiculed by a lover. There are posters on here who have given RL examples of this.
I don't however believe all women shave because of peer pressure and don't feel sad for women who really do choose to have it all taken off.
There is a difference and I wonder if some posters are taking this too personally. If you shave/wax and are happy doing that then fine but some do it through peer pressure and others who don't have been ridiculed for their choice.