To think that Ian Brady...

[KittyFane1]

is playing a sick game.
His final victim is Winnie Johnson who is desperate to find her son Keith Bennet on the moors. She has terminal cancer and not long to live.
IB has been on hunger strike for years and wants to move out of the psychiatric hospital.
There is now, or rather, may or may not be a letter revealing where Keith is. Tormenting this woman in her final days.

Would it be unreasonable to tell IB that he can be moved if he stops this sick game, refusing to say where Keith is buried and if he does, not give him what he wants after all?

Dawndonna X post! I don't think there's a connection, just that the Horizon prog picked up on the same kind of thing Ronson did and they came to similar conclusions, that psychopathy isn't always a cut-and-dried matter. (I still think Brady is one of the clearest examples, mind.)

Just googled it (on nearly a year ago so couldn't remember) but the guy was a neuroscientist called Jim Fallon).

On the subject of advocacy, although it was general legal advocacy rather than MH, I read a book called 'Defending the Guilty' by Alex McBride. Explained it for me

Haven't read whole thread; but I think Ian Brady should have slices cut from him until he tells where the body is...

He's a devil

I agree with Jumping that we can't alter the way the justice system works just because of an arsehole like Brady. Brady is blot on the human race but he is an anomaly, most people including those with mental health disorders do not behave like he did nor would they have the capacity to do so. You can't take away the rights of other people because of one extreme case.

As a parent I can't find words to express my revulsion at Brady and what he has done. I really think this whole letter business should have been kept very quiet and out of the press until there was proof that it wasn't just Brady exercising another attention seeking headfuck.

This might be a long shot and totally against his 'human rights' but couldn't they truthdrug/hypnotise him to get to the bottom of this. I doubt anyone would protest...would they??

That drama on TV last year (Appropriate Adult?) about Fred West's advocate was quite an insight.

Yes, Shelley, peeople would protest and rightly so. What is justice if it isn't universally applied?
Is there really such a thing as a truth drug, anyway?

he's a disturbed man detained in secure hospital
the woman isn't a sw.she's a mh advocate
shes member of public visiting Brady.her professional background unknown

there's no such thing as truth drug

Ohhh. Clearly I watch too much tv!!! IDoctrine I know it might sound 'wrong' but I don't really give a flying fuck about justice for a man like this. I'm no DM reader but this man is scum and deserves to be treated as such. Imagine if it were your child..

a civilized society deals with dysfunction in a humane way
yes some acts some individuals are wholly repugnant
but that individual has to receive health,social,psychiatric care they require

Did Fred West have a mental health advocate? Because didn't she end up helping the investigation due to his revelations?

I met Mrs Johnson once through work, when she was campaigning against one of Hindleys' endless appeals. I was just struck by her bravery and her dignity. I felt very humbled and her whole life has been heartbreaking. Much like Ann West's.

I don't know whether they will find the letter or if it is of any help, but i did question if it said it was to be given to her after his death, when this was possibly going to happen when she is currently fighting Cancer and he may outlive her.

But justice cannot work on that basis.

I have been against the death penalty my whole life. A friend of mine was murdered. For a few days I would have happily applied the death penalty to her killer despite my personal and intellectual conviction against it. I am glad that I had no power at that time to implement my feelings.

Of course losing a child is thousands of times worse, but justice cann

... Justice cannot by case by case

All very well. But once you've hung/stabbed/tortured/blow torched said perpetrator does that bring your loved one back?

It's not going to make it better, nothing will.

Commiting logical fallacies does nothing to enhance an argument.
Imagine if Ian Brady were your child......

See my point?

Ian Brady is a vile human being, but still a human being. He is totally beyond rehabilitaion, but no one is beyond redemption.

I hope so much Keith's body is found before his mum dies.

But Doctrine it is often case by case. Look at the bankers who have committed fraud and then look at the ordinary Joes who have been severely dealt with for lesser financial crimes. Look at the varying degrees of severity that the rioters were dealt with last year. Look at the cases where people have protected their properties and some have been jailed while others let off..

Shelly the problem is where do you draw the line? You take away Brady's rights but what about the schizophrenic who stabs someone when having a psychotic episode. Is that schizophrenic more guilty if they have refused to take the medication prescribed for them?

As the old legal saying goes "Hard cases make bad law" i.e. don't base laws that affect the wider population on the more extreme and unpleasant situations.

I too am against the death penalty, and, as posters have already argued here, that means every case without exception. Brady really tests that limit but it's stll there. However, the flip side of that is that if the reports are true, he finds it worse being kept alive. So let him continue with his miserable existence for as long as he lasts. I hope they refuse the transfer to Scotland. Certainly given the recent decision about Tony Nicklinson, it would seem pretty unfair that Brady might get to choose to end his life when Tony Nicklinson has been denied this choice.

If Ian Brady was my child...I imagine my responses would be flamed so I'm not going to go there.

Chasz Fair point!

Shelly the individual application of the law is done on a fact specific case by case basis. However, the laws themselves are made for society in general not just because of one or two individuals.

x post

Exactly, Chas. Two people prosecuted under the same law for similar offences might get two different sentences but both ought to be within sentencing guidelines for that law. That would be justice at work,

If one was being hypnotised or tortured or coerced, it wouldn't be.