AIBU re: sending your newborn to the hospital nursery?

[coraltoes]

A good friend of mine has given birth in a private london hospital. I popped in yesterday to visit her, on what is was day 2 of her stay there post CS. I have to say what an amazing place it was, but i was left feeling a bit cold about something and wondered if I was wrong to?

She looked well rested, and I asked how the days and nights were going, as god knows newborns can be all over the place with their sleep and feeds. Her reply surprised me. She had been sending him to the nursery to sleep at night, from about 8pm with them bottle feeding him (she has chosen not to BF) through the night when he needs it. She did this from day 1.

Now, it is the kind of place that would help you in the night by your bed if you needed it, so she wouldnt have to make up bottles whilst struggling to walk with a scar etc. So I was a bit "hmmmmm" about not even letting your newborn sleep near you on his first night in the world, so you can get some sleep. If you had laboured for 2 nights i can see the appeal but her Csection was scheduled, and took place at the start of the day.

What do you guys make of it? Would you use the same service? Maybe i'm being a bit precious!

Janey- no i didnt stay awake all night in case she woke. Her cry would wake me. Once home i had an alarm to wake me for her feeds as she had a tendency to sleep through regardless of hunger. I'm a light sleeper.

I'm no martyr.

I think some people are misconstruing what i was surprised by. For those of you exhausted by nights of labour, i clearly said it was not that situation, it was also not SCBU or anything else where a baby HAS to be apart, it was not a few hours for a nap. So taking offence on behalf of all those situations is fine of course, but was not what I was referring to.

My elder DD's are nearly 27, 17, i'm still waiting for my award for enduring severe exhaustion because i couldn't express and my DD's were extreme feeders.

My DH was off work when i had my youngest (14) and because i got a break and some sleep, i enjoyed her so much more, it didn't effect how much i loved her or her sisters, but i remember it more because i wasn't in a fog of tiredness.

My point about the not letting baby out of your sight is that some people suggested earlier in the thread that there might be some 'risk' of the baby being stolen or something, if let out of ones sight. Which is odd as unless you stay awake all night you can't be constantly watching your baby.

Dd went to the NHS nursery for an hour at 4am having cried for a long time keeping all other nuns and babies awake. She slept there and they brought her back when hungry (so only an hour between feeds ). Was the only sleep I got. The first night was horrific - I had a catheter but no help in getting out of bed for nappy changes or feeding.

holler, I love the image of a ward full of nuns and babies .

I can't help feeling that if men gave birth it would mean that they got 2 weeks of bed rest afterwards with the baby in the hospital nursery. They certainly wouldn't be expected to care for a screaming newborn after a 40 hour labour whilst still numb from an epidural with hundreds of stitches and a catheter bag, that's for certain!

I know it's best to be with the baby for bonding, etc, but giving birth is exhausting, and leaves you feeling like you've been run over by a bus. I'm guessing it's even worse if you've had a caesarean, ie major surgery. Yet you are just expected to go through all of that and then instantly start looking after your baby yourself. With any other medical procedure you would be able to rest afterwards so why is it so different if a woman has given birth?

When it appeared that my DD was a fusser and a crier, and I was getting complaints from the other women in my ward, I allowed the nurses to take my DD away so I could rest, they returned her for feeds, which I did lying down in bed, and removed her when she was done.

It allowed me that time to recover from the birth. The midwives had a baby to fuss over. My room mates stopped telling me to "shut that fucking baby up". We all benefited and my baby was fussed over instead of fussing and keeping us all awake.

Don't see what the problem is?

Agreed, Hexagonal. You're a mother for a long time, and it's a bad start if you're weeping with exhaustion before you even get out of hospital. I often wonder how many women would avoid PND if they just got enough sleep.

Coral - people are deliberately misreading your post. This ALWAYS happens in relation to this issue and with breastfeeding.

There seems to be this absolute insistence that emphasising the importance of keeping mums and babies physically together in the first few hours and days after birth somehow implies that exhausted and unwell mums must be left to care for their baby unsupported. And having taken this as the point being made people will argue at length that it's inhumane to mothers. Which it is. But that's not the case which you're making. Or me.

It's very frustrating.

Hexagonal, i think if men gave birth a LOT would change, such as the birther's right to adequate pain relief!

At this hospital Csection recovering mothers are not left to it, they can have the baby in their room and buzz a midwife (and get one! i know- def not NHS!!) for assistance with any feeds or nappy changes, or to help them out of bed etc. It is a wonderfully supportive service. I think that seemed enough to me without the nursery.

Coraltoes "I think some people are misconstruing what i was surprised by. For those of you exhausted by nights of labour, i clearly said it was not that situation, it was also not SCBU or anything else where a baby HAS to be apart, it was not a few hours for a nap. So taking offence on behalf of all those situations is fine of course, but was not what I was referring to."

No, she had just had major abdominal surgery, wide awake, and with some heavy duty drugs. Hardly a walk in the park, is it?

I had friends whos twin dd were in sbcu for a week but at night the mum and dad came home to sleep because "the nurses expected them to give the girls a bottle and change them in the night if they staied with them"

I judged :(

Downandoutnumbered I totally agree about PND. I have had it twice and am convinced that I had I received adequate sleep and rest for the few days after the birth, and support at home (from DH but that's another story), I would have avoided PND. It did seem to be a build-up of tiredness in my case. With DD1 I had an instrumental delivery, a long labour, a massive blood loss, yet was just left to deal with her on my own, with no help from ward staff, and no one willing to show me how to do anything to care for her.

coraltoes, yes I bet the pain relief availability would increase ten-fold if men were giving birth.

Coraltoes- have you had a c section? I only ask ,cos as others have said , it is major surgery. Nothing prepared me for how unwell and tired (not to mention drugs effect) I felt after my c section. And help is good but sometimes you need rest.

downandout
Frickin' auto correct. No nuns, but there was a heroin dealer doing deals on her phone all night. You don't see that on OBEM.

Rabbits - if all the adults were happy and the midwives got a baby to play with then hurrah, all's well!

I always find the sight of a newborn wrapped up in a cot and shoved into the corner of the midwives' station under fluorescent lights while everyone bustles about around it a rather sad sight.

No wonder we have the biggest failure rate when it comes to bf of all mammals. But then we know better than to routinely separate other mammals from their newborns if we want them to feed their offspring. We only ignore the knowledge about how lactation works - knowledge born if thousands of years of experience, when it comes to modern humans.

And I guess, giving it more though, I gave birth in the early afternoon, and had established breastfeeding fairly well straight after birth (great latch that kid!) and had done the majority of the first night into the early hours, we had plenty of time to bond with skin to skin. In fact, she was only taken away because I was co-sleeping with her and they didn't like it. I got a hook on cot after that so she was right next to the bed, and they only took her away when it was the middle of the night and I couldn't settle her after feeds.

She's since been very difficult to settle at nights, still is and she is four years old. We shared a bed until she wanted her own space. Got far more sleep like that at home, no idea why they are very anti at the hospital.

Duelling I was in a v similar situation - c-section, baby in nicu for 10 days and expressing all that time to establish bf. I totally agree with you. And for all those crying "martyr", as you will no doubt know, there was a huge emphasis on touch and mother's voice as part of the recovery process.

Why would kangaroo care be so heavily advocated by consultant neo-natologists if it were not proven to be effective in comforting newborn babies who have (all) had a pretty traumatic experience? Of course heartbeat/smell/voice is going to have a positive emotional effect.

I was never sceptical about this, but having been syringing a dwindling supply of colostrum for the 5 days I couldn't hold my baby while he was in nicu, the first time I held him my milk came flooding through minutes later. It just proved to me that we are just mammals at the end of the day - biologically programmed to be symbiotic with our babies...

I gave birth to my son in the States where sending the baby to the nursery is standard (and encouraged) practice, even if you're breastfeeding. Wouldn't have coped without it at times, to be honest. I had a EMCS with general anesthesia and a transfusion and I really wasn't able to function until 24 hours later. Without the nursery, I don't know what would have happened.

I didn't think that NHS hospitals had nurseries. That's honestly a huge thing along with appalling tales of negligent postnatal carethat is putting me off of considering Baby#2 here at the moment.

X post shagmund. Totally agree.

Op - have you had a c section?

A c section is major abdominal surgery. Its very painful afterwards. the drugs for pain make you feel sleepy and can make you feel a bit out of it e.g morphine. I felt woozy and lightheaded, when the drugs where off, its agony. Its hard to move. Its not standard post-birth tiredness, its recovery from major surgery.

To you, assistance from the midwife 'seemed enough'. But you (I assume) have not had a c section so you are not in a position to judge.

I have to say I think your posts are terribly mean to a so-called friend. How would she feel if she knew you were saying this about her? I'm not sure what point you are trying to make - you think your friend is lazy because she is allowing her child to be cared for by someone else at night whilst she recovers from surgery/drug affects etc? When you say you are a bit 'hmmmmm' about this - what do you mean? Your friend is not as good mother as you are because she says 'yes' to the help on offer on hospital? Or is it jealousy at the 'amazing' hospital she is in.

Stop judging and start being a friend. You are making yourself out to be a jealous, nit picking judgey person and I am sure you don't mean to!

I dont think you could have prized my PFB away from me! Whilst in hospital I even wheeled her cot into the toilet so that I could have a wee!! Each to their own but not for me.

The trouble is, Shagmund that keeping mothers and babies together after birth means leaving mothers to cope totally unsupported in most cases, in the current state of the NHS (shortage of midwives and so on), and then people blame the mothers for not coping, rather than blaming a system that gives them no support. It's like BF: it would be much better to spend less money on "Breast is best" posters and more on post-natal breastfeeding support. I managed to feed DS, but only because I was lucky and got a home visit from a midwife who looked at his latch and suggested a different feeding position that worked for us. I'd have given up in despair if I hadn't had that help.

trickychalice hope your son is well now.

OP, you seem to be underestimating how hard even a planned C section is on the body. It is not an easy option, and even with the help you describe, ie help getting out of bed, it is still a massive shock to the system. As big as a shock to the system as vaginal birth. A C section even in a private hospital is not an easy option, as you and so many people seem to think.

So saying you could understand if it was a traumatic birth, or if labour had been long, or whatever, doesn't quite work. Just because you as a patient are inactive during a c-section doesn't mean to say your body isn't working bloody hard to get through it.

No-one would be as unsympathetic to patients recovering from any type of surgery as it is apparently acceptable to be to women recovering from c-sections. Give your friend, and other women who for whatever reason decide to make use of a hospital nursery to help them through the first night. It's really wrong to judge people in this way, and not what someone does with a friend.