More of a WWYD,explaining headscarves/veils to a child?

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DC1 is wondering why women of certain cultures and religions cover their hair and sometimes their faces. I have explained about differing religions etc but still the question persists as to why only the women,why don't the men have to.
Does anyone have a simple way to explain it to ages 5-12 (DC2 is joining in with it) ? I'm trying and obviously failing.

This is what I'd say

Because they do
Now run away and play darling

it's easy - I tell mine that some people believe that they should cover their hair or faces etc as a sign of respect for their god. This applies to some Muslims, Jews and Christians - job done

Mine did once freak out at a garage when '3 burglars' where sat in the car next to ours at the pumps - I had to explain they where women who where not wearing balacavas!

there is no simple way to explain this. You and your dd are obviously uncomfortable with what a headscarf suggests and you can discuss that. Saying that women choose to wear the headscarf is as misleading as saying it is because they are seen as men's possessions.

It would be worth saying (especially to the 12 y o) that this is a custom that stems back to a time when women were considered chattels, and were hidden from other eyes. You could say that women were seen the same way in the west, as well, but then things changed with the rise of secularism and feminism. You could say that some women freely choose to wear a head scarf because of religious, cultural or political reasons. Even in these cases, you might question whether it is a positive choice. Others might find there was overt or insidious family or community pressure to wear it. Others, as hackmum says, have no choice. Al quaeda have just taken over much of Mali. I imagine among the other restrictions that will be placed on women there, they will be forced to cover themselves.

All that would be fine for a 12 y o. I try to talk like this even to my six year old, mostly because dh is very black and white and I want ds to understand that issues are complex.

what about Nuns? Honestly it's not just Muslim women who cover their heads

"why can't women wear whatever they want?"

They have been told that it makes the god that they believe in happy if they do it, and they believe that it's true.

People believe God is true - people don't eat fish on Friday, or use technology on Fridays, people believe praying absolves you of sin ...people believe lots of things in the name of religion - why is only this one 'wrong' - it FAITH

People are told lots of things

With regards to the women wearing head scarves/veils because they want to, I think you'll find a lot of the time that the Father and then eventually the Husband has the final say on whether they cover up totally or not.

I don't know many traditional muslims who get the final say over their Father or their Husband's wishes to be honest.

Why is that lady wearing a head scarf? Because she wants to.

Why doesn't Uncle come to the crib service with us?
Because he doesn't want to

My daughter accepted both these. She'll ask more questions when she's ready.

"Because they like wearing them and feel more comfortable with their hair covered up."

I know a fair few Muslim women - they don't fit the oppressed wall flower model at all - sorry

and again - why just Muslim women ? are Nuns oppressed? Hasidic Jewish women, Greece grannies?

Only Muslim women cover their faces, afaik. Afaik, it is only Muslim states that punish women who don't cover themselves. I am happy to be corrected, if I'm wrong.

And i do think some Hasidic women are repressed. Nuns, probably not, these days.

Oppressed, I mean

Having lived most of my life in Muslim countries and having chosen to leave Islam after reading the Koran and other religious texts as I found them immensely discriminating in what they wanted of women. When my much loved daughter is born I will tell her the truth that these women wear scarves because their religion tells then to dress modestly so that they do not make men sexually arosed (need to find a way of putting this to a toddler). Also I will tell her that women are not equal to men in Islam for example in divorce and also when they act as witnesses. And so on...

Why is that Sikh man wearing a turban - because he is oppressed or because he has a religious duty to cover his (uncut) hair.

My muslim SIL cover their hair but wear about 4x more make up than me.

warzonemummy - I am a lapsed Catholic and believe me, if you read the Bible, you are not struck by the equal treatment of women either.

anyone being forced to do or wear anything against their wishes is wrong - but that doesn't mean people can't choose to do something - it's just as oppressive and insulting to argue that Muslim women don't actually make informed choices as it is to force women to do something

Explaining why women chose to dress a certain way does not need to lead into a discussion on anti women laws in Saudi or other places - just as a discussion about Jesus with a 5 year old doesn;t have to lead into a debate about Christianity and Nazis or child abuse ... you see

Explain that they are "new to this country" and that is "fashion" in their own country. Essentially this is true. In most cases, there is no point in getting into a big religious or human rights debate with a child. You also don't want to put negative ideas into the child's head at such a young age. When they're mid-teens you can have a proper discussion and let them know how degrading and uncivilized a practice it is.

"new to this country"

I was born and bred here, like many other hijab wearers you ignorant bigot.

Thank you Chaz, for pointing out the hypocrisy of those who see no problem with a Sikh turban, but get all judgmental over Muslim women.

chaz I agree with you and Judaism also falls in the same catagory - oh and hinduism. Hence, for my family and I antheism is the way even if it comes with the danger of being stonned to death one day (I still frequent Muslim countries where leaving the faith is panishable by death.)

The subject isn't neccessarily about Islamic practice.
Nuns often cover their heads.
Jewish men cover theirs, as do Sikhs.
Covering your hair in public if you are married is what many traditional African cultures do, of many religious persuasions, including traditional, animistic ones.
I told my DCs that people did this bcause it was a way they thought they could honour God better...so ensued really good decision about attitudes of the heart vs external trappings of religious practice.

not that I was 'dissing' external representations of faith at all, just saying what a thoughtful discussion it led onto, rather than just not having a dialogue with the DCs at all

Goth I don't have problem with the hijab, because it doesn't cover the face. I don't have a problem with turbans or muslim women. I have a problem when women are forced (through cultural brainwashing) to hide their face, and I think Britain would do well to follow France's example on this.

However the topic was in relation to children. And the point is that our culture has no history of face covering. I don't think children should be encourage to think face covering is acceptable in Britain. It may be acceptable in the Middle Eastern deserts, but isn't something we should be encouraging.

Ah yes, France. Where it has been decided that wearing a face veil is such an imposition on personal freedom, that to stop you doing so, the police will arrest you, detain you and then take some money from you.

• sounds very liberating.

if you go to Saudi, non muslims dont have to cover! lol

But anyway, I think there are some weird comments on this thread, "the fashion in their own country" are you for real? lol why are you telling me this is not my own country! my parents were born in South Africa is it the fashion there, one that I was unaware of? lol

warzone you are right to teach a child your own beliefs.

Personally I just use the "that is what they believe and this is what I believe approach"

worra do you really believe that about the father/husband? I didnt even tell my husband before i started wearing hijab, I just went out and bought it then put it on. It was nothing to do with him.

My nieces in their twenties, one started wearing it at 21, two started wearing at 14, one at 17, one at 9, That doesnt really fit it to your perception of the husband/father having say. My oldest niece wanted to wear niqaab and I remember her father saying "what you think you too pretty then!" lol

My sis in law started wearing hijab in her fourties, and was influenced by her grown up daughters (my nieces).

My other sis in law doesnt wear it.

one of my relatives was offended her sister wore it in front of her husband! in Pakistan! even the back home relatives some wear and some dont.

So this is all in one family! lol

I can give many more examples.

In the majority of places it comes down to personal choice.

If you want to talk about the places where women have to wear it, dont forget the Muslim majority countries where women are not allowed to wear it, ie Turkey, until recently Tunisia etc

Saying "fashion in their own country" does not mean the person wearing a burka is not from this country...obviously. It's a simplified explanation for a child, and it's a neutral explanation for a young child. It's better than saying something negative to a young child like "that woman is repressed". We all have our opinions on this and there is a big divide, so it becomes a question of how to avoid the issue until the child is old enough to judge for herself. It's a white lie in a sense. Good point about Turkey and Tunisia, I will add them to the sensible country's list along with France!