DS's school

[worrywortisworrying]

OK... very calmly and rationally (and possibly very long), I am going to put down all the facts and ask all you lovely MN'ers whether IABU or not...

FACTS:

1. DS is 4
2. DS has been awarded a place in our local state school for Reception, starting Sept 2012 (First choice)
3. DS currently attends a private nursery (read childcare, not preschool) 2 mornings a week (funded by 15 hours provision)
4. DS has a diagnosis of High functioning Autism (in simple terms: Very high IQ (around 200) and very poor social skills)
5. I am currently applying for a statutory assessment (to provide a statement)

Current issue:
The proposed school do not wish to accept DS in September, but have him stay at nursery, but do longer hours which would have to be privately funded (almost £800 per month for him to do 9-3)
The school will then 'look at' transitional move starting around January 2013 but could be as long as September 2013.

So, AIBU to think this is a pants 'solution' for DS, which will distance him from his peer group (there will be no other child in the nursery of his 'year) and not give him anywhere near the academic input he needs or am I being completely irrational, emotional and over reacting about my PFB staying at nursery? And having to pay £800 for the 'privilege'????

Opinions please!

Have they said why they want him to do that?
I would have thought he would be better off staying at the nursery for his 15 hours per week and starting at school in September part time (assuming that they feel he is not ready to start full time in September) and gradually increaing his hours at school.

so no YANBU.

I don't think you're being unreasonable.
Have the school given any concrete reasons for their suggestion?
Have they actually met your DS and had a chance to see his behaviour and ability?
Does the school have any special needs experience?

Have you been able to discuss this with the school and see if they'll be flexible about it?

The school have bee forced to take 2 bulge classes this year, so are taking 150 children rather than their usual 90.

They are worried about how he will cope in such a busy environment and how they will cope with a 'problem' student (It is fair to say that DS WILL test them at every turn. He is massively intelligent and will test them. I am not doubting that)

OK, I have to pop into the nursery just now to discuss the latest 'incident' (DS has a bit of a habit of testing their security procedures)

Will be back in a bit.

Please... as many suggestions as possible. I really, truly don't know what to do or suggest anymore.

Are they any alternatives to this school?
With smaller classes where your DS will get better support.

There should be a dedicated SEN team for your local education authority who could help you.

Admittedly i'm a secondary teacher but we've had autistic pupils in the past who've done a half timetable with us for academic work and a half timetable with the local special school the social skills etc, thus accessing the best of both worlds and expertees. Would that be an option?

Is it maybe that they feel he needs a 1-2-1 TA and won't be able to get it until he has a statement? Maybe they want the statement before he starts?

I assume with "testing" the security procedures you mean he tries to escape? You probably need to discuss the arangements for preventing that. And realise that if you have a determined child they may be able to work out ways round it.

Is there a smaller school where he will be nurtured better around you?

I'd agree with you that staying in nursery sounds a bad idea. However part time to start with may be beneficial, if the school will do that, with the idea of building up. Particularly as he's only doing 2 mornings at present, I think building up is better for most children.

However it sounds to me like the school is trying to get out of having him. I suspect come January they'll say, I think he'd be better waiting until September-and they (I think) they don't have any obligation to hold the place.

I'd also talk to the nursery and ask their opinions. Obviously they may want the money (if they haven't a waiting list) or not want him in there (if they're finding him an issue) but they may be able to give you an idea of things the school would need to do, and whether they think the school's being reasonable.

I would make an appointment to go and see the Senco at the school and discuss this with them. When is he 5? I'd also ring the LEA and see what they have to say.

Two questions:

You said he had been awarded a place starting in September but then said they don't want to accept him in September. So did they make the offer and then renege on it or what?

When will your DS be 5? If he is at the younger end of the year group then it might not be such a bad thing. I know several people whose child had a birthday in July / August who delayed their child's entry to school.

When will your DS be 5? If he is at the younger end of the year group then it might not be such a bad thing. I know several people whose child had a birthday in July / August who delayed their child's entry to school.

But if you defer the place you will go straight into Y1 which would mean missing the whole of Reception. I think Reception is one of the most important years there is!

It may be an idea to ask MNHQ to move this to special needs children as there are some real experts over there!

Cwtches - I agree that there are amazing people on the SN boards and I do post over there alot. But right now, I want a cross section of views (Perhaps, even, from parents who might have a problem with my DS being in the class.)

DEWe - My belief is that they do not want to take him. They are SOOO stretched this year.

He will be 5 in May 2013. Trouble is, he is already ahead, academically and physically, of his current year group. He would stick out a MILE and I don't think this would help his social needs AT ALL in the future.

by 'testing' their security measures, I actually don't mean he wants to escape. he likes to understand how the locks / security measures work... He's let himself out of classrooms but never tried to leave the premises (but he has let 2 other children out of the main door). It's more he just wants to work out how the locks work. I think it just stresses them out because, once they know HE knows how to get out, there is no guarantee that he won't let himself / another child out.

DeWe - I agree they probably want a 1-2-1 for him, but a statement won't access that. I think if a statement comes back with that 'requirement', they will argue that they feel it would be better 'accessed' at the nursery (presumably with me paying for that too) and so it continues.

Sadly, where we are, very few of the prep schools would even consider a high functioning autistic child. We have tried a couple, without success.

A statement means that the TA is paid for by the LEA not the school, so someone somewhere is talking out of their arse...

Also, he has a place in a school. Why the fuck should you fork out £800 a month in nursery fees for a school age child?

Unfortunately, you may find that the way to get help is to watch him fail in that environment before they admit he needs more (which will likely be what you've been saying all along)

Have you been in touch with your local parent partnership?
If you feel you need more help you could contact SEN SOS for help too or ipsea may be able to help.
More advice can be got from the SEN boards here too.

It's not that I mind paying (FWIW, I went private to get the diagnosis and I would have sent him to a prep school but they won't take him either)

It's paying for him to stay in nursery. He does NOT need nursery. He is already bored rigid there.

I have a child with a similar diagnosis. He was awarded a place at our first choice school and we went along to the meet the teacher evening. We told his teacher about him and 2 days later had a phone call from the headmistress asking us to meet with her. She told us she did not want him in her school, if there were any problems with him at all during the day they phone me to pick him up and I should send him to special school.
I complained as high as possible and turned down his place. Luckily the other local school had places and was perfect but I would've kept him at home until a space became available rather than send him to the other school.
I know it's a little different from your situation but I was not willing to send my child to a school who were not prepared to give him their all. And I don't mean special 1-1 treatment but I mean treated the same as the other children.
Good luck.

£800 is a lot of music therapy/social skills classes/whatever he needs. He is entitled to access the same opportunities as other children his age - why shouldn't he have that (with reasonable adjustments) just because you can afford it?

Drives me mad every time someone on here has a dc about to start school who has been in early years provision but the early years setting hasn't worked to get a statement in place.

Now you are at this stage, If there is an agreement with the LEA that a statement is needed before school then the LEA should fund the time at the nursery to get the statement. If the LEA disagree that a statement is needed before school then school will have to accept him.

The school is well out of order to try to get out of their obligations in this way.

He has a place, they have to take him. They will need to sort out suitable extra support for him if he needs it, that's their job. I don't doubt you will need to be a vocal advocate for him to ensure this happens, but it is principally their responsibility.

I would speak to the county council next rather than the school, they are really not supposed to do this. (I have a child in primary and am a governor)

Oddboots - this is what I WANT to do: I want to say: He doesn't have a statement. So, accept him. I worry about the damage that will be caused with the friendships he does have when he is held back in nursery.

But, then I worry that maybe sending him to a school who are over capacity (they are... they cannot cope with 150 children) and who don't want him is not where I want to send my gorgeous, sensitive and gregarious 4YO.

The only thing I have demanded is that he is allowed to attend the settling session (I have said I will stay with him if they don't believe they can cope with him). Surely, it's the only way to see what he's actually like in the school setting.

PurplePidjin As a former parent governor of a primary school I can confirm that statements will ensure a TA is paid for by the LA, BUT the funding does not always tie in with the immediate requirement and often means that the school may have to take a risk and hire someone before funding comes through, which could be ages. It was an ongoing nightmare during my time on the school's budget committee.

OK, my emotions are getting the better of me.

I have asked for the nursery to take my son for 3 extra hours this week: FLAT OUT NO

This has happened every SINGLE time I've asked him to have extra hours there (even though they appear to be agreeing to take him more from September). I know they don't want him there, because he makes them work really hard.

Right now, I want to tell them all to bugger off, but I know if I do, they will immediatly re-allocate DS's place and it will be MY fault (which, of course, if would be).

I have asked for DS's hours to upped now so that he can 'prove' he can do 9-3 before September (he already does 8-1 so not a million miles away).

I just know they don't want to accept him. I'm on a hiding to nothing. I know it already. Sorry, sticking to facts didn't last too long, did it?

I really feel for you, but I thnk your ds sounds awesome!

My ds has AS. It is hard.

I think you need to get the nursery on side here. Schools will sometimes listen to nurserys more than they listen to parents. Wrong, but they both come from the same professional POV without the emotional attachment you have. I would ask for copies of his achievements under the EYFS to be sent to the school ASAP and then have a meeting with the school after they have them. If your ds is achieving well in most of the areas, then it backs up your theory that he is ready to move up. If he's just lacking in the social skills department, well that's what reception is for, and I woudo argue that he needs as much time as possible under the EYFS but in a school setting to prepare those skills for Y1.

I can understand the schools reluctance, especially if they already have to take double the number of pupils. They are probably worried about how they will settle and accomodate so many children as it is, and they just want to be able to do that to the best of their ability, as well as give your ds the best transitional experience possible. But frankly, that's not your problem, nor is it your ds's.

The school is obliged to put the measures in place that your ds needs. If that means they have to provide a TA for him out of the school budget then so be it. It can be done. If you are going to start working with them at this stage then you can encourage them to get the behaviour support people in now so that thing are ready in September.

How do you feel about your ds doing mornings only for the first term? Does the school do anything like that anyway?

Outraged - thankyou, he really is awsome (and Freddos are 20p now... which is actually quite outrageous )

I'm just not sure I want to keep him at nursery at all.

Or school. (at least the one he's been allocated, now I've seen them in action) I Have been so honest re. information and left the originals with them, which they have not returned)

The school don't seem to be willing to consider part time from September, which makes me think they have another agenda

Tho, FWIW, I applied for a SA last week and his case is being heard on 17th July, even though I was told it would be at least 6 week (I applied last week)