So David Cameron (we are in it together) really wants to fuck up our children then!

[belleMarie]

How can anyone be taken in by this muppet? whilst him, Sam (and her £1000 pound frocks) and kiddies eat good, sleep good, shit good - we're basically screwed?

His hate for the poor/have-not is staggering and apart from a a couple of grunts here and there, this man is unstoppable.

Cameron to axe housing benefits for feckless under 25s as he declares war on welfare culture
Prime Minister gives exclusive interview to the MAIL ON SUNDAY
Reveals housing benefit will be scrapped for under 25s, who'll be forced to live with their parents
Dole money will be stopped for those who refuse to find work
Mr Cameron shares his views on Euro2012, Jimmy Carr, and what really happened when he left his daughter in the pub

Radical new welfare cuts targeting feckless couples who have children and expect to live on state handouts will be proposed by David Cameron tomorrow.
His bold reforms could also lead to 380,000 people under 25 being stripped of housing benefits and forced to join the growing number of young adults who still live with their parents.
In a keynote speech likely to inflame tensions with his deputy Nick Clegg, the Prime Minister will call for a debate on the welfare state, focusing on reforms to ?working-age benefits?.

Among the ideas being considered by Mr Cameron are:
Scrapping most of the £1.8 billion in housing benefits paid to 380,000 under-25s, worth an average £90 a week, forcing them to support themselves or live with their parents.
Stopping the £70-a-week dole money for the unemployed who refuse to try hard to find work or produce a CV.
Forcing a hardcore of workshy claimants to do community work after two years on the dole ? or lose all their benefits.
Well-placed sources say Ministers are also taking a fresh look at plans to limit child benefit to a couple?s first three children, although Mr Cameron is not expected to address this issue directly tomorrow.
Speaking exclusively to The Mail on Sunday, Mr Cameron said: ?We are sending out strange signals on working, housing and fa8milies.?

He argued that some young people lived with their parents, worked hard, planned ahead and got nothing from the State, while others left home, made little effort to seek work and got a home paid for by the benefits system.

?A couple will say, ?We are engaged, we are both living with our parents, we are trying to save before we get married and have children and be good parents. But how does it make us feel, Mr Cameron, when we see someone who goes ahead, has the child, gets the council home, gets the help that isn?t available to us???
?One is trapped in a welfare system that discourages them from working, the other is doing the right thing and getting no help.?
Asked if he would take action against large families who were paid large sums in benefits, he replied:
?This is a difficult area but it is right to pose questions about it. At the moment the system encourages people not to work and have children, but we should help people to work AND have children.?
His plan to axe housing benefit for the under-25s will have exemptions for special cases, such as domestic violence, but he said: ?We are spending nearly £2 billion on housing benefit for under-25s ? a fortune. We need a bigger debate about welfare and what we expect of people. The system currently sends the signal you are better off not working, or working less.?
He also favours new curbs on the Jobseeker?s Allowance, demanding the unemployed do more to find work. He said: ?We aren?t even asking them, ?Have you got a CV ready to go?? ? A small minority of hardcore workshy, an estimated 5,000 to 10,000, could be forced to take part in community work if they fail or refuse to find work or training after two years.
The Prime Minister wants to show he is committed to radical policies, but his speech could exacerbate strains with Coalition partner Mr Clegg, whose Lib Dems oppose drastic welfare cuts.
It follows the row over plans to revive O-levels and will fuel rumours the Coalition could end long before the 2015 Election. ?As leader of a political party as well as running a Coalition it?s right sometimes to make a more broad-ranging speech,? said Mr Cameron.
A Government official said: ?Decent folk are fed up with the increasing abuse of the welfare system. Responsible people who work damned hard, often on low incomes, to support themselves, are sick and tired of seeing others do nothing and live off the state.
?Labour threw ever greater sums of money at the problem and made it worse. If we want to encourage responsibility we have be bold enough to tackle these issues. We suspect some of those who refuse point-blank to seek work are working on the black market and claiming fraudulently.?
But a Labour source said: ?It is easy for rich Tories with big houses to have grown-up children at home while they find their feet. It?s different if you live in a tiny council flat and your daughter is a single mum.? Ministers said curbs on housing benefit for the under-25s, had helped slash the welfare bill in Germany and Holland

Don't be upset LST.
I for one don't begrudge your cat. A pet does wonders for your self esteem,serenity, and ability to cope, and that is important.
Sanity, like compassion, can be underrated.
Give that baby a cuddle x

LST from me.

FWIW I had a job weekends and holidays.

I don't even claim HB. It's just disgusting how someone could think its ok in our society to begrudge someone of something that would improve their and their children's lives.

Thank you

lst its upset me as well. i just find it soul destroying that people cant understand the whole concept of equity and the cost of living and can be so very rude about it.

on paper im loaded and yes my company does really well and yes ive paid off all the mortgages on the propertys i own but my family and my best friend all live in those houses rent free and can do so for as long as they want, every thing i have has gone into my company and i dont pay myself any more than i pay staff members my admin lady gets paid more than i take out as my salery (in all fairness she compleatly earns it due to my spelling and social issues lol) i lived in a LA house when i was little my parents had nothing and at 16 i was pregnant living in a bedsit with no support whatso ever i compleatly understand how differcult things can be, im just bloody lucky that as a teenager i was able to earn alot of money from modeling and used that to pay for uni and start up my company.

my houses were peanuts to buy apsolute peanuts and the cost of housing is nothing like it used to be.

its not the difference of opinun that gets to me its the really nasty way thats expressed ffs BABY MILK what a god awfull thing to say.

its expressed not expressed baby milk lol

She was earning GBP30K a year and he could have easily found a 2nd job in London to support them renting a 1 bed or studio privately in zone 2. He got housing benefit because of his low wage and he didn't declare his girlfriend as living with him as she only spent Tues through Thursday night at his (on paper at least).

So just because someone is a benefit cheat - who you didn't report - we should scrap HB?

Most people who recieve housing benefit a) don't see the money b) are in work.

"Food: £20 a week
Extra heating water/bills: £10 a week
Clothes: £5 a week
Travel costs: £10 a week
£11.25 a week spare."

hahaha bus passes are £13 a week, which you would need if you wanted to get to job interviews. I honestly don't know how people survive on that amount.

Here they ARE £13 believe me, I can't drive. Thats privatisation for you. AND we have two companies in this city. Depending where you need to go you could be forking out double that. This often hits the working poor and makes it hard to take a low paid job. Travel expenses are out of control, and are one of the contributing factors to some people being better off on benefits.

www.plymouthbus.co.uk/tickets/ticket-types/1-week-period-pass/

www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/devon_cornwall/tickets/plymouth/firstweek.php

BUS FARES IN MY CITY

Lst. Eveyone I know lived in shared houses in their twenties. Some of them were overoccupied e.g. 7 in a 3 bed house. Some didn't have heating and froze in winter. But we didn't Feel Poor and we didn't expect anyone else to work to fund us. My brother lived in my room for 3 months when he could not afford rent. Dps cousin works ft and he is young and lives with his parents. Of course he would rather not, but he is cutting his cloth according to his means.

You have been sold a lie if you think life was ever or will be any different. Yes of course children being abused need state support but the reason the able bodied population needs to live within it means is so we can fund those who don't have any choice.

you can think its nasty someone saying this. I think its risky to not be realistic about the cold realities of life.

of course it would be easy to think, i was born with a silver spoon etc. When my family comes from one of the top ten areas of deprivation in the UK and the Indian part people live very basically and are despirate for any opportunity to improve their lot. But they can and do.

in the UK, many people have lost this desire. It is of course easier to think Its Unfair and Someone Else Should Do Something. But it doesn't achieve any thing.

Of course now I expect cries of nasty and probably more swearing. But life will get better if you ever realise Its Your Responsibility.

How you respond is interesting but I dont need yours or anyone elses validation. On top of all the taxes, I create high paid jobs which actually make lives better than Oh Poor You Sad Face ever will. My newest starter is on £40k and I have to fund him until he starts to earn his keep. That is Taking Responsibilty. so for, you as well, no. Its Your Responsibilty.

agree very much with this:

" the reason the able bodied population needs to live within it means is so we can fund those who don't have any choice."

I am not sure "the change" will happen though, culture of entitlement and instant gratification may be too embedded in our culture. which means not enough money for those who really need it!

YoYo so your saying it need to get myself a better job then?

Ok then I'll get on to that

"Lst. Eveyone I know lived in shared houses in their twenties"

Davis Cameron isn't suggesting they live in shared houses. He has already done that. he is suggesting NO SUPPORT. at at time when there are MANY applicants per JOB.

It's INEVITABLE that there will always be some unemployed people. There has NEVER been such a thing as 100% employment.

I don't understand why this is so difficult to grasp.

There ARE parents so cruel that they would let their kids sleep on the streets, or so bad kids that would rather sleep on the streets.Some of these kids are not on social services at risk register, so where is the proof for their HB claim?

Some people on here won't believe this will cause homelessness until they see people lying in the gutter and even than they will probably say it's all their fault.

I am not sure "the change" will happen though, culture of entitlement and instant gratification may be too embedded in our culture. which means not enough money for those who really need it

The scroungers who milk the system won't be posting here and to sort the problem some people will be hurt but imo for the future pop of UK this dire setup needs fixed.
A teacher phoned Any Answers. She had 40 years experience and described some innercity parents as using their children as cash cows. The children didn't get sleep, weren't fed etc etc. How can this be good for those children, and all the future unloved children who will be born unless this situation changes.

Immigrants come here after living on the streets/selling their bodies on the streets. They have a child then get a home and benefits in a British city centre which is better than the other option but we can't take on the problems of everyone in the third world.

Let, you need to work out how to improve your own situation. if I were you, in the shrt term I would post a SOA on moneysavinvexpert and take the advice offered. I would also start working towards being in a better situation for when the economy improves e.g. Training, starting a business you can do after work. It will take years to improve your situation but there will be people in you situation who end up where they want to be and those that dont. The ones who succeed will be resilient, learn from their mistakes and succeses, make short term sacrifices, plan for the future, and work for years before they see a major improvement.

I get so wound up listing to Cameron's views on the welfare state and the way he likens often vulnerable people to scroungers.. It makes me so mad that I can't even think about it sensibly or argue my case!

I remember the last recession (old) and I was in my early 20's living in shared accommodation. I claimed HB. No way could I have lived with my parents for many reasons. I now own my own home outright.

I shudder to think what would have happened if I had not been able to claim vital benefits to survive and keep a roof over my head. At the same time I volunteered with Women's Aid and Homeless charities so I certainly repaid what I took. I think scrapping HB for under 25s will create a homeless epidemic.

We need to get the over privileged Bullingdon Boy out!!!!

refering to the OP:

Wage subsidy plan for young workers brought forward www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18606178

Josie
"Immigrants come here after living on the streets/selling their bodies on the streets. They have a child then get a home and benefits in a British city centre which is better than the other option but we can't take on the problems of everyone in the third world."

What do you mean by this remark?

You do know that recent research by the London School of Economics has shown that immigrants from developping countries are less likely to be in social housing than their UK born counterparts?
www.cityam.com/latest-news/impact-immigration-the-labour-market-exaggerated

Well, I know about parts of London where it is the case that the first thing many female immigrants from certain parts of teh world will do is have a baby. This then entitles her to accommodation and eventually residency as baby is entititled to British nationality (I believe).

Others posters were saying that no one would choose to live on benefits, I was making the point, not too well, that if you are from a country which has no benefit system and no jobs what you get in the UK is great (includes free health care and education too).

There is also the issue of a right to family life. We can't deport people because of this, so another incentive to have children.

The baby is not repeat not entitled to British Citizenship by virtue of being born here

This is from the Border Agency website
"If you were born in the UK on or after 1 January 1983
If you were born in the UK on or after 1 January 1983, you are a British citizen if at the time of your birth one of your parents was:

a British citizen; or
legally settled in the UK."

Legally settled means a permanent right to stay so at minimum Indefinite Leave to Remain. It takes years to become legally settled (even if you are Refugee).

How lovely it is to read that a majority of MN users are compationate about other peoples situations. It just goes to show that cameron doesn't have the sort of support he thinks he has. I for one will admit that I have never voted purely because I believe that all polaticians are arse wipes, in it for their own gratification. Next general election I'M VOTING.
I'm not under twenty five so that part of the welfare reform doesn't affect me yet (DS 6, DD13) but other parts that have already been put into affect have.
Long story but I'll keep it short. DH and myself have very rough upbringings, no parental support to stay in school or to succeed. Left school early, claimed benefit as soon as entitled (get a good slaging off for that). All you got from the job centre was "have you looked for work in the last two weeks?" us "yes" , here then have some money, must add this was during the last con. gov during the last reccession. Neither offered help, no guidance, no insentives. A really bad time. Fast forward twenty years, due to no qualifications, (from school) minimum wage is all we can expect. Can't have a mortgage even if we saved for a deposit as we wouldn't earn enough, last con gov sold off all the la housing and failed to re-invest it so only option is private renting. In our area rent for an average 3 bed property is in excess of £1200 pcm. So Two adults working 40 hour weeks on minimum wage, with cost of childcare for 2 kids (London) plus food, heating, lighting, one of the highest costs for council tax (nearly £300 pm). I'll leave it to somebody who can number crunch to work out that the sums don't add up and without a little help to pay rent and council tax.........
We have tried to better ourselves, but with no GCSE's or educational qualifications it is very difficult. We have both tried to look for retraining but at our age there are no government funded schemes and to pay would cost thousands, which we just don't have. Credit cards pay for uniform for the kids and shoes.
No school trips, no extra corricular activities, no holidays. These are the lessons to our kids, to work hard at school and get good jobs (bit of a problem when DS has learning probs). Hopefully these lessons and some love and encouragement will mean that should there still be a welfare system when they are older then they will never have to use it and struggle like their parents do.
All this is coming from a scrounging, work shy waster who sits back and lets the rest of the country support her family!!!! This is why the new reforms will never work, until the government stop lumping everyone into catagories and see everyone as individuals and look into their personnal circumstances.
For the sake of a few people the greater majority must suffer.
To those of you with plenty of money and a privleged upbringing- I hope that nothing horrible ever happens to you or your family that would mean that you would ever need to ask for help, but should you ever I hope I'm around to laugh at your misfortune and call you scum and scrounger.

David Cameron is a fucking cunt.
Thats all i have to say on the subject.

debsl75
That's a very good post.