not to want to buy BIL a new house?

[MoneyGrowsOnTrees]

Am a regular but have namechanged as my other posts would make me quite identifiable while the below is quite sensitive.

In a nutshell, AIBU to want to stay out of the financial arrangements for buying BIL a new house? Background is that BIL has a house, but has jacked in previous job and taken a new one about 2 hours' drive from where his existing house is, but near where PILs live. New job has started and he has moved in with the PILs. Plan is for him to buy a new house in the new location, but the existing house is not yet sold and realistically it will be three months or more before that happens. BIL is not the easiest person to live with (massive understatement), so current living arrangements are not sustainable.

MIL has seen a house that she considers perfect for BIL and is very keen to buy it, but, the PILs being elderly, it is difficult for them to raise a mortgage. BIL will have some money once his current house sells, but there is no saying when or how much that will be. BIL and PILs are not good at communicating, so at the moment there is a lot of stress and they are basically no longer talking to each other.

DH would like to avoid his family "imploding" and so would like to suggest that we take on the mortgage for BIL, on the understanding that BIL or PILs finance the repayments and that we fall out of the arrangements in 2-3 years' time.

I am very wary of all this as BIL has a very checquered financial history and I can see that we would be stuck with a mortgage on an unsaleable property in a part of the country not many people want to live in. Plus, BIL does not look after anything he owns, so any investment would be likely to depreciate rather than at least hold its value.

Also, if DH and I take on a second mortgage for this, it will mean we cannot move house (which we might want to do) and potentially could even affect our ability to provide for our children in the way in which we would like (and have been working hard for). However, DH does not see how we can avoid offering to help, given we both have good jobs and given that, one way or the other, we will have to provide for BIL (and/or PILs) when this all goes wrong.

I am also annoyed/concerned that nobody is talking openly to anyone about this, so, for example, nobody has had the courage to suggest to BIL that he cuts his coat according to his cloth (you know, not trying to buy a multi-bedroom house that he cannot afford and frankly does not need, given he is on his own) or that, for example, he rents somewhere while waiting for the existing house to sell. I can see that this would continue going forward.

AIBU to want to stay out of it all? And if IANBU, any suggestions as to how to achieve this diplomatically?

Never in a million years would I agree to something like this.

it is all good and well having the good intention to prevent his family from "imploding" but to be quite frank, he is suggesting doing something that could well cause his family that consists of you and dc to "implode" even more when it WILL go wrong!

How about help. Eg helping with part of the deposit - say interest free loan- an amount that you can live with writing off if it goes tits up. Might mean giving up your savings for a year, if you can afford to.

FFS-I dont care if you are bloody millionaires-that still doesnt mean that you have to finance the whims of a grown man. Who cares if the ils or bil fall out with you-you would be well rid of them imo.

Neither you or your dh are responsible for any of them. Quite frankly it sounds as if your dh needs to cut the apron strings...

I just don't see it, you don't want to and presumably you and dh discuss all matters financial?? If you say no then it's no...

Incidentally your bil sounds an unpleasant brat who needs to grow up.

Just get financial advice with your dh and see what they say!! I suspect the resultant laughter followed by a 'not in a million years' will convince your dh.

HELL to the NO!

BIL, as an adult, will have to do what other adults do. Rent somewhere until his house sells. Rent his old house out. You know, sort his own finances out himself.

You could offer to get a solicitor to write a water tight contract, but why should you - he's a grown up, he's not asked you for anything, you don't owe him anything - you can't afford to give the money away, so don't.

"How on earth can we stay out without appearing mean?"

Why on earth do you think that you owe your husband's brother a house?

You don't.

He has a house. The timing of the sale of his house is his problem - nothing whatsoever to do with you.

He's not in need of any kind, he just doesn't fancy renting, which is what any sensible person would do.

There is not even the faintest whiff of an obligation for you and your DH to do anything here.

There is no genuine problem that needs solving.

Just manufactured family drama and some really bizarre senses of entitlement and duty where there should be none.

You should have nothing to do with this bullshit.

And be quite clear with your husband that it is utter bullshit.

He has a house, it's just in the wrong place. If it won't sell, or won't sell quickly enough, the obvious answer is to rent it out and rent somewhere in the right place. You shouldn't be involved at all.

just bonkers.

not in a million years

don't!

what they all said ^^

Your dh wants to avoid his family imploding? Well, this plan is the fastest way to that, as far as I can see. Not to mention his marriage going tits up as well. Make sure he's aware of that.

Do. Not. Have. Anything. To. Do. With. It.

At. All.

It's insane, why on earth would you be expect to fund a house for a grown man who is not your dependent or currently ill?

When I couldn't afford to buy, I rented.

He already has a house.

It's ridiculous!

I think you're completely bonkers - in the nicest possible way - to think that this is in any way your responsibility. Anyone who thinks you are being "mean"... where are we? In the playground? Anyway, who cares what they think? You're looking after the future of yourselves and your children.
If you really think the family will implode then they are a pretty sad bunch. But if they will, then better they do it without taking you down financially with them.
As others have said, this can only be a joint decision, so if you say no, it has to be no.
Get him to come here and read!

bil can rent and let his house out

You will end up having to pay tax on the 2nd house, there are all sort of nightmare situations, what if he dies, and illegitmate child CSA claim etc etc etc

Just say no, he can rent he is not homeless!!!!

Run run run away as fast as you can. His house = his problem.

Find a rental for the BIL and give MIL the details? That way you look super helpful and BIL can pay for his own fucking house.

I have no idea how this could possibly have become your problem. In my family we all have to pay for our own lives. We might buy each other dinner.

I know you don't wish to appear mean, but this is good, general advice.

Don't lend family or friends any more money than you could cheerfully write off (i.e. with no hard feelings) if they could not repay it. Anything else will endanger your relationship with family more than it will save it.

For some people, that will be a lot of money, for others a little, and for others, not at all. It might depend on whether you are on the breadline, just won the euromillions or somewhere in between. It might not. It might depend on your attitude to money.

If your inlaws/husband take offence at your apparent meaness, then you can stress that as much as you love them, this is not something that you can afford to lose.

You can only take out a second mortgage (or indeed act as a guaranteur for someone else) if you can genuinely afford to make payments on both mortgages and your other financial obligations without hardship. Unless you have just won the euro lottery you lucky sods this is not the case for you. You will also find that taking out a buy-to-let mortgage will be harder than a regular one because you have to have a bigger deposit and have proper insurance etc. You'll still need to make mortgage payments even if the rent doesn't appear.

Please, you can be generous with your time, generous with your advice and generous with your emotional support. You can even (if it would fall into the category above of being something you could cheerfully write off) be generous in helping with a deposit on a rented place/moving costs. All without taking on a liability that could result in the loss of your own financial security. There's no point in putting the whole family at risk, you are better placed to help family from a position of financial strength.

I see that your PIL and DH see it as no/low risk because you'd own an asset (and they might have greater faith in your BIL than you do) but as your BIL is finding out, an asset that you can't cash immediately can become a burden.

Would it be possible for you to agree with a little white lie to DH's Parents & brother that one or both of you are under threat of redundancy so are worried about your finances? (If you work for the same sector then it's perfectly possible you could both be facing the chop...) Gives you the perfect get out clause that you can't commit to anything big financially right now, that you need to save every penny etc. keep repeating, "Well, if there's no other solutions, it makes sense for BIL to rent." Don't offer alternatives, or go with "We'd like to help if we could, but we don't have that sort of money saved and we can't borrow it when facing redundancy."

If he does rent or finally sells his place and buys another, then you could have the 'great news' a month later that you've missed this round of redundancies (keeping it clear that there might be more in the future, should you ever need it...).

Will get DH to read this: it will be helpful, I think, to see that the MN consensus so far is that getting involved financially would be a very bad idea and that it would not achieve the desired result (avoid implosion) but rather lead to a bigger implosion, probably sooner.

Have suggested to ILs that BIL should look into renting out his current house: apparently rent would not cover the mortgage and you cannot sell a house with tenants. Is that last bit really the case? As for rent not covering the mortgage, it confirms what DH and I said when BIL was looking at buying current house: that it was unlikely to be a good investment. But BIL went ahead anyway-what would we know?

Don't tell a white lie.

Disabuse this family of their weird notions that your family owes this grown man a living.

You can see a house with tenants but you have to honour their tenancy agreement. Ie, if you let it for 6months you can't make them move out sooner.

*sell

DontmindifIdo: it would not even be a complete lie: both our employers have run redundancy programmes every year for the last few years. The problem is that DH feels helping financially is the only solution. I hope this thread will help him see that 1) it is not a solution; 2) it would make the problem bigger; 3) there are other things we could usefully do; 4) no-one in their right mind would do this.

OMG You are SOOOO NBU. Is your husband completely MAD? Why on earth are you even indulging him by having these discussions? Just say No. Immediately. N.O.

your BIL does not need you and DH, or his parents to hold his hand throughout this - he can rent somewhere very small and cheap until his sale goes through, or rent his house out instead of selling it, or just live with his parents and learn to get along.

I am completely and at this thread! Put your foot down woman!

spot on re your last post moneygrows.

absolutely do not buy him a house thereby enabling him yet again.

if you do this it will not end there. he will still not have understood and will continue to be financially irresponsible safe in the knowledge that you will bail him out. yet. again. and all that will have happened is that you'll be paying 2 mortgages, depriving your kids of niceties that you've worked hard for and simply postponed that awful moment where you tell your bil that he has to sort out his own life. except it'll be even worse because he'll be older and there will be a bigger financial mess.

No way, no how, not a chance. I don't believe my DH would ever be toid enough to suggest this ridiculous 'solution' to a grown mans problem. I use the term problem loosely btw. He has somewhere to stay if he got his act together and behaved well enough so he could co exist with his parents. Failing that he can rent out his own house and rent a small bedsit or flat to tide him over.
I think you said PILs are in a part of the country with lw demand so rent should be cheap. If he rents a small place he should be able t afford it plus the difference on the mortgage on his old house.
Not sure what the law in UK is but here in Ireland selling a house with a sitting tenant is not a problem. I would be very surprised if it was there.
Under no circumstances agree to this. It is not your concern. Stay well out of it.