To think that adults should not pass on fears to children? <dog related>

[buttonmoon78]

Yesterday I took ds1&2 to the local park. Ds1 climbed on the frame, ds2 was in buggy with me sat on a bench. Dog (collie) sat next to me.

There was another mum in the fenced area (for younger children) whose dd was playing on the other frame. When the mum saw us she said loudly 'come on dd - we have to go. That dog's going to bite you'. Cue wailing from dd

I do understand that people are frightened of things I am not and I understand that dogs can be frightening - I am frightened of several dogs I see daily. I am frightened of spiders (really frightened - I am allergic to the venom) but I try really hard not to let the dcs know that. And if that spider was behaving very calmly, behind a suitably spider-sized fence I certainly would not be telling my dcs that it was going to bite them.

This is not a 'dogs are marvellous' rant although mine is nor an 'everyone should love my dog because he's soppy' thread although he is but AIBU to wonder why people don't try harder to show their children a balanced view of the world?

Whatever our fears, shouldn't we try to put them aside to allow our dcs to discover for themselves what they fear and what they don't?

Dogs are wolves and maybe people have a right to be feel scared of them. There is more logic to be scared of dogs than many phobias people have.

There are strong animal welfare reasons for restricting the keeping of large dogs.
Ie. It is sheer stupidity keep a large breed dog in a small flat.

Unless the keeping of dogs is better controlled, how do I know how well controlled a strange dog is. A large dog can pull the lead from its owner's hands easily.

Some people are too stupid to keep animals (or even kids sadly).

There is sometimes much hysteria about dogs - thats what gets me !

The majority of people are responsible dogs owners and when people call for more regulations an restrictions the irresponsible dog owners will ignore it anyway as current dog restrictions are hardly enforced !

Responsible dog owners will be responsible regardless of what restricts/ regulations are or are not in place .

YANBU about that the mother over-reacting in that particular encounter in the park.

But YABU about 'why people don't try harder to show their children a balanced view of the world?'

The problem is that many people have been jaded by regular encounters with dogs that bounce up to you and jump up 'to say hello' and whose owners seem to think that is totally normal and refuse to acknowledge that dogs can be dangerous and that not everybody likes them.

When DS was 3 he was bitten three times in the thigh, and I was bitten in the arm by the same dog when I tried to chase it off. All of this was witnessed by DD, who was 4 at the time. It was a completely unprovoked attack, the dog bounced up (to say hello?) but DS didn't want to say hello and ran off, the dog starting chasing him and snapping at him, then biting me in the arm when I intervened. Maybe the dog was frightened, but that is not our fault, you can't expect a 3yo to know what to do when he come face-to-face with a bouncy dog the same size as him. The owner was some way off, called the dog off and disappeared. Didn't even stop to check we were OK or needed help.

I try to hide my feelings about dogs when I go out with the kids, DD is petrified of them but DS is not frightened of them and will happily boast about his scars on his leg and even wants a puppy himself! But I really don't like any strange dog coming close to my kids.

Some dogs aren't safe and frankly need to be put down. If a dog attacks someone in a public place then there should be no second chances or excuses. The dog should be destroyed as swiftly as possible.

Really tired - that is already the case, its called the Dangerous Dogs Act
Its the only law in which the defendant (canine) is proved guilty unless proven innocent.

And this thread isn't about dangerous dogs, its about somebody creating a fear in a childs mind about a sitting, under control dog, when they could've kept their child safe without trying to give them a phobia.

Dogs are not wolves. It can be perfectly reasonable to have a large dog in a small house or flat (often the large breeds can be the most lazy and laid-back!), as long as they get to go out regularly. Neither of my large dogs can pull the lead from my hand, easily or otherwise.

I completely agree that there are irresponsible dog owners, and of course children should be able to play in a park without being attacked by dogs. No one is arguing otherwise! But the OP, based on her account of things at least, was being perfectly responsible, and her dog did not harm or threaten the child in any way.

Sorry did you say the dog was on a lead - if it was the she IBU. Dogs should always be on leads around children especially play areas.

When you see something you're scared of AND you're with your child, I've found phobias actually intensify.

I've been working on the spider phobia since my teens, BECAUSE I never wanted my child to pick up on it. I can pick up small ones barehanded, and look at spiders behind glass without flinching very much. I can catch almost all sizes of British spider and put them outside.

However, last month, I was sitting on the floor, when I saw a small spider (ten pence piece size) running towards twin 2, who is 2. Twin 2 was between me and the spider, i.e. I was NOT shielding twin 2 from a small creature smaller than the heel of his foot.

I reacted at practically reflex action speed, thus:
First second- Jessie sees spider and screeches a warning to the tribe county.
Two seconds later- Jessie has swooped to rescue toddler and is holding him aloft, out of the way.

At 5 seconds after initially seeing spider, rationality kicked in. The next five minutes were spent talking about how interesting the spider was, and how mummy was just a little startled, as we looked at it in a jar, but Twin 2 looks slightly anxious every time we find a spider in the house now!

I am also scared of spiders jessie. I have worked quite hard at it and can now pick up small spiders and even catch the big buggers that come into the house in the autumn (with the aid of a piece of card and a jam jar). But my eldest son knew I was scared (he isn't) and found it funny - one on occasion he put a plastic tarantula on my bed and I played along pretending to be frightened. DS2 was with me and was 18m at the time - he became utterly hysterical, crying and sobbing in terror, because mummy was 'scared'. It has made me much more aware of how I react to things in front of children - they take their queue from the adults they trust.

"Really tired - that is already the case, its called the Dangerous Dogs Act
Its the only law in which the defendant (canine) is proved guilty unless proven innocent. "

A dog is a dog. Its not a person and doesn't have human rights. The important thing is that animal is put to sleep humanly as possible. Plenty of mammals (including dogs) are killed every day by human beings. Ie. dogs that cannot be rehomed by the RSPCA or animals that are killed for food. I think its one of situations where the feelings of the owner are not a priority.

"When DS was 3 he was bitten three times in the thigh, and I was bitten in the arm by the same dog when I tried to chase it off. All of this was witnessed by DD, who was 4 at the time. It was a completely unprovoked attack, the dog bounced up (to say hello?) but DS didn't want to say hello and ran off, the dog starting chasing him and snapping at him, then biting me in the arm when I intervened. Maybe the dog was frightened, but that is not our fault, you can't expect a 3yo to know what to do when he come face-to-face with a bouncy dog the same size as him. The owner was some way off, called the dog off and disappeared. Didn't even stop to check we were OK or needed help. "

Poor little boy. It must have been horrific for you both. That is definately an example where the dog needs to be destroyed and the owner punished.

.

My mother was terrified of dogs , as a result of being bitten as a child . I was never scared of dogs growing up . My mother used this to her advantage when it came to delivering envelopes for christian aid , any house with a dog or a sign saying beware of the dog etc , she sent me to deliver /collect the envelope because apparently dogs know and recognise people who arnt scared of them and so will not savage them . I believed her at 9 years old , but as i got older i was bit about it

My mum used to have tearful panic attacks if faced by a dog. I'm not really scared of them but am wary.

Mind you she's scared of lifts, aeroplanes and ( sometimes) IKEA can induce a panic attack, while I am not bothered at all by those.

YANBU.
The woman obviously has had a bad experience previously. Wariness of dogs you don't know is no bad thing but that was over the top.

ReallyTired

I wasn't trying to say that dogs should have human rights (I realise I kind of worded it like that though, sorry) - just that there already is a law in place, and it is not a soft one.

That dog you mention, that bit the child and mum - of course it and the owner should be tried under the act. The owner should have been close enough to their dog to stop it bouncing up to a 3 yr old.

But this thread was about a calm, under control dog on a lead, and parenting so that your child is safe, but without a phobia if possible. anothermadamebutterfly sounds like she's doing just that, despite a horrific attack.

I will pick spiders up with a cup/dustpan/whatever springs to hand. But I can't CAN'T pick them up with my hands.

I know that if I'm bitten again I'll end up with the bitten limb looking like it belongs to the elephant man and in pain for several months.

So I do get the dcs (the older two anyway) to sort them for me whenever possible!

Dog very much enjoyed his visit to school today - grinned his way through the hour and took great delight in being patted and fed his treats by many willing hands. He was a great visual aid when teaching dog safety (not) as he tried to lick me every time I threatened him whereas at home he will play fight. However, he did startle the only child who pulled his tail when his head whipped round. I think she thought he was going to nip her but he simply looked at her as if to say 'oi - that's mine'.

Mind you, same child wanted to know if she could look at 'where the dog poo comes out'...

have had a life-long horror of stag beetles and (oddly) butterflies because of my mum telling me that if they got in my hair (!) it would all have to be shaved off. You would not believe the strength it takes to remove butterflies from the house in summer without shrieking hysterically so as not to scare the DCs. YANBU!

Obviously the YANBU people have only got fears As opposed to PHOBIAS.

I'm getting more and more
Pissed off with this thread

"It is wholely selfish and self indulgent to pass on such ridiculous fears to little children"

Fears are often passed on unintentionally. What is ridiculous to you is not ridiculous to someone else. I have never said anything to my children, the look on my face is unfortunately enough. Thankfully I have a nice neigbour with a small dog who is trying to get my children more confident with dogs.

I am fearful dogs because some idiot failed to control a dog nearly 30 years ago. Alastians still give me flash backs. I can cope with small dogs provided they don't bound up to me.

Phobia is greek for fear. Lots of people have strange phobias. I am sure there is something LeQueen is scared of

I once witnessed a mother shrieking to her toddler, who was running around Paddington Station chasing pigeons, "Come here! You'll get bird-flu!"

YANBU. I try really hard at this. I grew up in a country with rabies and my Mum - while trying to keep me safe - terrified me about dogs. I was doing really well with it - DD loved dogs - until two unsupervised dogs raced up to us in a wood and started jumping up at her (she's 2). I had a serious back injury so couldn't lift her up and away from it - all I could do was yell for the owners to come and take control of them. One of the owners refused to even look at me I'm trying to repair the damage "Oh, look! It's a lovely doggie!" but she's made her own mind up.

And breathe.

I disagree with LeQueen. I'm scared of spiders, because my mother is, but she wasn't selfish and self-indulgent. She was merely not possessed of a robotic visage! As it happens, I now know that she was nervous of most insects, because of their similarity to arachnids, but she took great care that I WASN'T scared of insects. She bought i-spy books, and we went around identifying them, and I picked them up (carefully, so as not to hurt them, obv.)

I can rant on MN for hours about incidents where my mother was "selfish and self-indulgent" (such as all the horror films she watched before I went to bed, when I was little), but displaying body language would be going a teensy wee bit far.

Hmmm but body language that you can't suppress is not the same thing as saying 'Don't go near that horrible dog it will eat you!' is it?

YABU - It is difficult to contain fears, particularly when you are faced daily with dog owners who feel that its ok for their dog to flounce up to anyone they like.

I had dogs growing up and love them but my DH was bitten twice (bad neighbours who didnt control their dog)

My DD is now scared of dogs, I am guessing because of this. I wish she wasnt but what I really wish is that people would control their dogs and if they are leaving them off the leash do so early morning and evening. They are dogs not people and peoples comfort, to me, comes first.

I have a perfectly rational fear of spiders (they are bloody scary, end of) & am VERY proud of how I have conducted myself around the kids when there is one in sight-believe me when I say it is HARD but have so far managed to keep the fear in check as I really don't want to pass my phobia on to them.

Orm While I see the point that you're trying to make, I'm afraid that I can't actually see that self-same differentation in LeQueen's post. Just a group-wide vituperative attack on anyone who doesn't avoid passing their fear on to their children.