AIBU to not allow my DD in the taxi with this man?

[mickeyvsminnie]

My DD is 13. We live very rurally and the council provide a taxi for her and several other village children due to our distance from the school. I suppose it's the country equivalent of a school bus!

Anyway, she is in year 8 so has been going in the taxi for almost two years now. There is one driver - I shall call him 'Dave,' who does some of the journeys, along with Paul and Marie - the owners of the taxi company [ the council contract out the job ].... Dave does around 50% of the journeys.

My DD has mentioned several times to me in the past that he is a 'bit weird ' and she 'feels uncomfortable ' when in the taxi on her own with him [ this happens sometimes due to other drop off/illness of other kids etc] but I brushed it off until a few weeks ago.

She was off school for a day or two with a stomach bug. She returned to school and was alone in the taxi with Dave on her first day back. He asked her if she was feeling better, she replied ' yes thank you.' He then said ' was it your periods that you were off with? ' and she was obviously mortified. He then went on to talk about my DDs friend , referring to her as the 'under developed ' girl and ' I bet she hasn't started her periods yet .. ' My DD said he often talks about 'girl things' like this.

So, I call the council and tell them that i feel this is highly inappropriate for any man, let alone a taxi driver in his 50s with the job of driving young girls to and from school. They take it seriously, speak to Paul, the owner of the company and Dave is spoken to. 'Yes,' he says, he did indeed speak to DD about her periods but he thought this was entirely normal and he is puzzled as to why it is not appropriate. the council call me to advise they will look into further but they will remove Dave from the runs. I reiterate that I do NOT think he is a padophile - more that he is crass, highly inappropriate and stupid. I then think that this is the end of it.

Anyway, the council call me again today. They wish to reinstate Dave to driving the kids again. He will have 'additional training' and they will ensure that DD is not alone with him [ they cannot ensure this - what happens if a child is ill, for example? ' ]

I am unhappy with this. My DD would not want to be in a taxi with him - far to mortified and uncomfortable.

So- WWYD? AIBU to insist that he is NOT to drive the children to school, that this is a possible warning sign that should be heeded?

TIA!

Absolutely go with your instincts and do not let your daughter back in with this man.

Years ago, I took my two girls and neighbours daughter to the school minibus and a local lad was sat on it who had a reputation of being inappropriately interested in young girls. Awkward situation, but I told the driver I would not put the girls on the mini-bus and would take the other children off if he did not put this lad off the bus. He told me he was on the minibus because he had missed the secondary school bus. I said to make his choice and after a long silence he put the lad off.

He now has convictions for serious sexual assaults on young girls (one being three years old).

I know this is not the same thing but it is all about instinct and this is wrong, wrong, wrong.

Oh My goodness. Have read all through and your daughter saying " he spoke about periods around 4 times, mentioned her friend's development to her once [ referred to her as under developed ] and he spoke a lot about ballerinas being sexy and dancing in a sexy way "
Erm case closed!! I wouldn't mention periods to my neice (same age) that many times if I saw she was uncomfortable. This is serious. I'd be going to the police and saying you suspect this man of grooming and want it noted. That way any other reportings can be noted too. It seriously is inappropriate and since is way more than one occasion is desperately worrying. Good luck with this.

BR, absolutely listen to what your gut is telling you. protect your DD, show her that accepting this shitty behaviour is not acceptable. ever.

My goodness, stick to your guns!

In your shoes I would be looking to have a discussion with your police forces public protection unit as they can identify dodgy behaviours at the drop of a hat, and these most definitely are dodgy behaviours!

And OP, thank you it is parents like you who make the world a safer place for all of our children x

If he gets dismissed from the council there is nothing stopping him from getting another driving job with children at another council or working with children in a different capacity. I would go straight to the police.

He should have been sacked. I'm shocked they're continuing to employ him.

I recommend that in future all your dealings with the council are in writing, for two reasons. One is that once they have a written complaint they cannot ignore it - it is proof that you have complained and they can't pretend they never had the conversation.

The second is that, if it's in writing, they can't play a game of "He said, she said," and start pretending you had omitted certain relevant facts or alternatively made worse accusations than you actually did.

I don't think you should write to your MP, as your MP doesn't have any authority to deal with it. If you're not satisfied with the council, you'd be better off writing to your local councillor, who will have to act on it - though they may just pass it on to the relevant department. If they're any good, though, they will make waves.

No need for your DD to talk to social services, in my view, though again you could write to them setting out your account of what happened and why you don't want this man near your daughter.

I wouldn't have thought it was the hardest thing in the world for them to find a different driver to take your DD to school. They are being a) ridiculous b) appallingly negligent.

Thanks all.

My plan of action in the short term is to speak with SS tomorrow and speak with the school. I'm still faintly puzzled as to why no one is taking this seriously. I have spoken with three people at the council - two men and a woman - and they were all obviously taken aback by it but all of them feel that a bit of extra training will do the trick.

I've thought more about going to the police. I'm not keen however I am tossing it over in my mind. I'll see how far I get tomorrow and what SS have to say. According the the risk assessor at the council they think it is nothing to worry about, not a safe guarding issue and just an extra training issue. I'll see tomorrow if that is genuinely the case.

I think you're right not to talk to the police (he's done nothing illegal) but I am very curious as to what this "training" might be. Have they given any clues?

And do consider putting everything in writing - it helps enormously to have a paper trail.

Another vote for contacting your district/regional councillor, they are elected to deal with these sort of issues

OP councils are notoriously bad at dealing with situations like this, as you are finding. I really hope you decide to go to the police, I would be surprised if they tell you they are not interested as he has done nothing illegal as hackmum suggests . Bottom line is this man has made sexually inappropriate comments to a child, a man who has access to children alone. What do you think grooming is hackmum?
In this day and age I think the police would indeed be interested. What have you got to lose? And what if it had been a younger girl who wasn't able to articulate this man's behaviour who has the misfortune to be in his taxi.

For what it's worth as a Headteacher with lots of safeguarding training and child protection experience, I would ask SS if they would log this 'incident' with the police; if not I'd do it myself.
It is not making a damning accusation of a maybe innocent man. What it's doing is building a picture should it ever be needed. If ten different people all name the same person as having made sexual/inappropriate comments it is more than likely someone who needs investigating. If its the first and only comment made about this man then no harm done. If it's not, you could be helping to save many children.

The comments the driver made were wholly innappropriate and I would bet my bottom dollar that he knows that. The socially inept/bit dim defence doesnt wash with me. I know too many people who use the I'm not very bright/worldly wise/clever as you/confidant/whatever as a way of ducking responsibility for all sorts of things.

IME men do not talk about periods, they just dont.

Exactly MushroomSoup. You would be best to approach them yourself though OP as would not trust the council to do it themselves, in fact they would have done it already if they did not have the mindset of keeping things "in house".

x post Gnome. exactly, and why is it some people always fall for this and are too ready to make excuses for these people?! Paedophiles get away with things because we do this, they rely on us thinking " oh no they can't poss be a paedophile", esp when their behaviour is only seemingly blurring boundaries, nothing concrete at the beginning. Though would say this man's behaviour is v concrete indeed.

I think you are wrong not to tell the police.

It would not be your faut if he assaulted another girl but I am sure it would devastate you all the same. It isn't your call. You have a moral duty to tell them imo.

fault

I'll deal with it just fine justfab - don't you worry ...

"The other girl now attends another school so she is quite safe!"

So everyone else is in danger..

What an horrible attitude.

I think I'll ignore you justfab as A you're clearly still mad and B you are projecting. And getting it wrong. Please feel free not to offer any more advice.

Mushroom - as a headteacher , is this something that you would want to be made aware of?

It may well be in society's best interests for the OP to report to the police or to make her daughter give a statement to SS. But it is unlikely to be in the daughter's best interests to do so. And it's a decision that should very much be the OP's to judge.

Criminal procedures are set up to ensure a fair trial of the accused. They are not designed in the best interests of the OP's daughter. Equally, Social Services are frequently criticised for having too much emphasis on form filling and box ticking and too little emphasis on ensuring the child is treated well; too much emphasis on following procedures and too little on developing good judgement, not to mention they seem to be totally over stretched (this is not supposed to be SW bashing, it's an institutional and cultural issue).

If the OP thinks she can keep her daughter safe and she has told the council about her concerns she is well within her rights to decide not to put her daughter through an experience that could be as bad as the one she has already gone through. It isn't the OP's fault that the council refuses to put the welfare of children ahead of the perceived employment rights of the taxi driver. They have the OP's concerns and a confession from the taxi driver - it shouldn't be necessary for the OP's DD to do anything more.

No, not mad or projecting and I will post what I want.

OP, have you asked your daughter whether she'd be comfortable discussing this with "the authorites" (SS/police/whatever seems appropriate)? Appologies if you've said and I've missed it (remembered the thread from when it first came up, but only skimmed it on my re-read just now)

Also, is there any chance that there's just a big misunderstanding over what they mean by "she won't be alone with him"? It's possible that they're trying to say "we've hired an escort to go with him" and you're just hearing "other children will be with him so what's the big deal"? Even if it's not a misunderstanding, get it in writing that they expect children to act as chaperones... that's pretty

I would absolutely not allow my daughter of that age in a tax with this man. He is totally out of order and really I wonder if he should be driving unaccompanied children at all. I find this really worrying.

Yes OP as a Head I would want to know this. It may be out of my line if responsibility but it it's still my responsibility to look after the welfare of my pupils. I would inform SS and the police but tbh I'd refer them to YOU.