To think it's wrong to become pregnant via a sperm bank...

[pinkpainter]

Ok - this isn't a couple where the man isn't able to produce sperm, this is a single 30 something year old who has never had a boyfriend and thinks this could be a solution to her wanting a baby if she can't find a man.
Firstly - is it legal?
Secondly - she would have no support from a partner, I've tried to tell her how very very difficult and lonely it would be bringing up a baby on her own.
Thirdly - she has no savings or a career that would pay enough for childcare, so she would be relying either on her parents or on government handouts so she could bring up the baby.
Fourthly - I imagine all the emotional support and practical support would be from her mum, and I don't think it's fair to burden her like this at this time in her life.
Fifthly - I worry about what sort of people give their sperm to a sperm bank, would there be a medical history with the sperm?
And lastly - is it moral to bring a baby into the world like this?
But AIBU - does everyone have a right to children, whatever the circumstances?

I agree with a lot of what you say Sunshine regarding the need for meaningful relationships. However, I still personally believe that a dad who cares is better than no dad.

I also believe that it can be worthwhile a child knowing even a shit parent (bar serious abuse obviously). It's partly about choices, the choice to get to know a biological parent, and judge them. To choose not to be like them, to choose to form a relationship with them. To know what your roots are. It is this same desire that drives thousands of people to search through their family trees and their family history and discover people and ancestors they will not even meet. If it's important to them why would it be less so to a child?

All children grow up and judge their parents, and all children have a right to do so. I am waiting for my children to start asking me questions about my choices and am happy to be able to provide them with the answers they may want. The thing is I and their father can provide all those answers.

YABU

1. Yes, it's legal

1. Plenty of people decide to become parents by themselves, and do it very well. Judgement and interference from others is unnecessary and unhelpful.

1. Someone else's financial situation is none of your business.

1. This will be her mum's grandchild. Do you really think she'd prefer to not have this grandchild, rather than to help out?

1. If a reputable clinic is used then the tests will be done to ensure the sperm is fine.

1. Yes, it's fine to have children in a world "like this". You could ask anyone thinking of having a baby the same question - why only ask those using sperm donation?

1. Yes, I think everyone has the right to try to have children.

fotheringhay I understand where you're coming from. I'm a single parent and all my family are dead with the exception of my DSis (who lives abroad) and a few elderly aunts. I have a very small 'safety net' and I frequently wish my children had more loving adults involved in their lives. I identify with you there.

My X was abusive, which is why I left him shortly after my DTs were born. He is only allowed supervised contact so my DC's relationship with him is superficial to say the least. If my happily married and very loving parents were still alive it would add a special dimension to my DC's lives and relieve some of my concerns, but even without them my DC will still be fine.

That proves two things - the Children's Society point about the number and quality of relationships having more effect rather than the biological parent bit (my Ps being much more supportive than the father), and that while extra support can enhance things and lack of support can make things more difficult (which is basically common sense), none of these necessarily affect the outcome for the child. I love my DC, I care passionately about their welfare, education and life experiences and do my best to maximise these. There are parents who do more and parents who do less than me, and whether or not they are single or married to the father of their child won't make a bit of difference to the value they put on their child's welfare as that's down to them as individuals.

I see the sense in bigger family groups (which I would extend to include long-term family friends BTW), but I don't see that they necessarily have to include the father. The father is certainly a logical assumption because he provides one half of the genetic material that created the child, but in terms of stability, love, support, guidance and nurturing, any adult can provide those, so the absence of a father if one neither exists or isn't suitable for whatever reason, is neither here nor there IMO.

To come back to the point made by fabulousdarling I think it's a false dichotomy to equate the lack of a father in the child's life with being completely ignorant about that side of the child's heritage. In the case of modern sperm donors, it is now common for complete medical background to be taken and for a history of the donor's likes, dislikes, hobbies, interests, work experience, etc. to be provided. Obviously it is anonymous, but you only have to look at some of the posts on MN to realise how much of a picture you can build up of an anonymous person.

sunshine I'm glad you left your abusive X and you sound like a wonderful mum

Totally agree that the absence of a father can be more than compensated for. In some cases this happens, in others it doesn't.

(I have a daydream where I live in a huge house with friends and their dc, and all contribute to their upbringing!)

OP you obviously don't count yourself in her support network should she go ahead with this, great friend you are.
YABTU

can sperm banks be found in any local high street? and were the sperm bankers responsible for the global recession?

that's what i want to know!

Of course YABU. She gets to decide what is right for her life and the only morals that need to come into it are her own morals.

My parents divorced while I was young, I started off with weekend visits with my dad then stopped seeing him completely after a few years because he wasn't interested. My mum raised four children and she did a brilliant job of it. I've never felt any shame or embarrassment from the fact that my parents are divorced and, seeing as there are so many different types of families these days, I highly doubt that any child will.

What affected me more was the fact that my dad wasn't interested in a relationship with me at all, he was (and probably still is) an alcoholic so alcohol always came first. The difference with your friend is that the child will not grow up wondering why they aren't important to their father as they will know that there wasn't a father there to begin with. There aren't going to be feelings of abandonment or resentment towards an absent father which exist in many cases of children having an absentee parent.

Just coming back to answer your other questions:

• yes you get a pretty full medical history. And various tests are done on the donor anyway to rule out things like CF carrier status etc so you find out things you wouldn't know in an ordinary relationship

• these days in the UK you cannot use an anonymous donor. The child has the right to find out the identity of the donor when the child reaches 18. Of course that doesn't mean to say the donor will be interested in having any meaningful contact - or indeed any contact - but they will at least have access to information.

Of course I would love my children to have a loving dad. Although my dad was somewhat rubbish, it's still important to me that I have him in my life so I do know where you and others are coming from on this. But life is not perfect and I could choose either to have them and love them and not give them a dad or not have them at all. Teenage tantrums aside, I am confident they won't think I should not have had them at all. They are loved, have a strong family around them, and think that their family life is utterly normal.

To be honest, I also have confidence in myself that I can do this. I think that is important. I don't pine over the husband I don't have - I got over that a long time ago. I'm not constantly comparing what I/my DCs have over what others have. I feel lucky. I think they are lucky. We have a good life.

I agree with a previous poster, this looks like someone's PSHE/ sociology gcse homework.

Why shouldn't she?

Why is it your buiness?

*buisness?

Yes it's just like preparing for an essay, isn't it ComposHat? I thought so too. Decided to give my opinions nonetheless - may as well try to influence the philosophy/sociology seminar/homework in the right direction :o

As someone who has tried for TEN years to have a child with my lovely husband, and whose only choices are now (1) have an affair and (2) go to a sperm bank... I think you have my answer.

Of course there is a thorough medical history of the sperm donors, and it's legal, we would not consider it otherwise.

Re it being anyone's business.. we are going to try this without even telling our family/close friends, if it's successful they will know, if it's not successful, they will not know. It's not their business and we don't need any more pressure, we have enough as it is. We just want a child.

Good luck to you ElizabethDarcy I hope you're a mum very soon! Your dc will have a dad too

Thank you Fothering!!!

I grew up sans a dad myself, and here I have the most amazing husband who will be a great dad. My mindees (I am a CM) love it when they get to see him now and again. Has a wonderful way with children. Am blessed to have him.

I do have a couple of single friends who have adopted abroad.. where there are many orphans in need of a loving home, and they are great parents too. Mum did a pretty awesome job too :) Not ideal to do it on one's own, but one great parent is better than none (ime and imo) :)

No, I'm not a student, I'm not against sperm donation in the right circumstances, I'm not saying that if you don't have enough money you don't have the right to have a child, I'm not saying that single parents don't make good parents and I was genuinely asking the question to get some points of view as I wasn't sure if I was being unreasonable - that is the point of this area isn't it?

I now understand a lot more about sperm donation and feel better able to support the person concerned if it does come to it. I was very shocked at the harshness of some of the responses, some were downright nasty and actually quite upsetting, mumsnet have actually deleted quite a few of the posts here. I thought mumsnet forums were about supporting each other.... :(

Ok - fair point - I can understand how my wording could have been better in the original post.

Yabu

The 'right' circumstances? FFS.

You don't really sound as though you have taken any of the opinions on here into consideration. You just wanted everyone to say, 'oh yes, how irresponsible and feckless of your friend, etc etc'. If you had wanted information on sperm banks, why did you not go to one and ask how they worked, and if it was legal for a single woman to use their services

Go and read some more threads - MN is a really fantastic place in that it has such a broad spectrum of people here; you really can find out a lot about peoples' strength and experience and I would say that I have learnt a lot, just by reading posts by some incredibly interesting women and what they are going through / have gone through / how they live. It is abundantly clear that there are no universally 'right' circumstances, but it is also clear that people are capable of of much strength and love, especially when there are children involved.

Anecdotally, my mum's best friend used a sperm donor, back in the early 80's, and her child is incredibly bright, successful, and actually one of the most well adjusted people I know. I also know women now who have used sperm donors to become single parents and I really don't see them as anything other than perfectly normal parents, though I do really admire them, as I admire any single parent, because I struggled immensely when I had DD, and I have a DH, as well as a really supportive extended family who helped out LOADS.

Sorry for the long post, but the idea that any of us have a right to judge anyone else's family set up just makes me really angry.

OP, I agree with you. I think it's wrong.

My single friend has the loveliest little baby boy, conceived by donor sperm. She had treatment abroad (couldn't afford UK) so I don't know whether her boy will ever be able to trace his Dad. But he is loved and wanted and I'm so happy for her that she's got to be a Mum at last after years of looking for Mr Right and failing and years of IVF that didn't work.

We all call children in this world because we want them. And everybody's circumstances are different - even if they are 'ideal' (who gets to decide what's ideal, btw?) when the child is conceived, they may not be ideal by the time baby is born, or for his or her entire childhood. Do you know that domestic violence often starts in pregnancy, for instance?

I think its wrong too in her circumstances. Part of having a child is financially supporting them but she doesnt appear to be able to do that and has no partner to help. If she is going to have to rely heavily on her parents then she is asking them to make huge sacrifices and potentially alter their lives so that they are not free to do what they want.

Its not a right to have a child.

it take more than alittle bit of sperm to be a good dad.

a child concived using a sperm doner and knows about it will not have to feel that there father didn't love them, feel angry that he didn't care and just left.