To think it's wrong to become pregnant via a sperm bank...

[pinkpainter]

Ok - this isn't a couple where the man isn't able to produce sperm, this is a single 30 something year old who has never had a boyfriend and thinks this could be a solution to her wanting a baby if she can't find a man.
Firstly - is it legal?
Secondly - she would have no support from a partner, I've tried to tell her how very very difficult and lonely it would be bringing up a baby on her own.
Thirdly - she has no savings or a career that would pay enough for childcare, so she would be relying either on her parents or on government handouts so she could bring up the baby.
Fourthly - I imagine all the emotional support and practical support would be from her mum, and I don't think it's fair to burden her like this at this time in her life.
Fifthly - I worry about what sort of people give their sperm to a sperm bank, would there be a medical history with the sperm?
And lastly - is it moral to bring a baby into the world like this?
But AIBU - does everyone have a right to children, whatever the circumstances?

I'd never judge someone for wanting to have a child, that's not the issue here. We all (most of us) know how that feels, and I might even do the same thing if I was desperate enough. I know it could all work out beautifully but I can't help but think of the potential for harm in terms of missing a dad.

I wish I didn't believe that a child benefits from two parents, honestly.

People always zone in on the issue of money 'as long as they earn enough' etc.

I think this is very short sighted. There are plenty of well off people who don't make good parents. My dad's parents were like this - he had everything he wanted materially but his mum and dad messed him up completely with their totally dysfunctional lives.

I have a friend that did this three years ago - she is happy, the little boy is fine - what is the problem?

I think she found it harder than she thought, but she was a rational and adult human being, who wanted the baby, but hadn't found the right bloke.

Dowagers i meant having to hide the burning jealousy. But actually I did find that other children's parents treated me differently because mum was a single parent (not strictly relevant to this thread, but any single parent situation). As I'm pouring it all out, I might as well add that I did try to hid the fact that my parents were divorced, as I (like many children) believed it was my fault and was therefore deeply ashamed.

None of your business really is it?

And how fortunate you are that life has worked out how you planned it for you.

Lots of people seem to be assuming that she is going to sit about in the proverbial single parent luxury council flat if she has this baby she is only thinking about from a sperm donor.

If her parents are willing to help with childcare, she may support the child herself. Lots of women, without a stellar career, do jobs that support their family. Not many people get that kind of help and have to pay for childcare (myself included), but some lucky people have parents who really want to help in that way as the OP's friend may well do. Government handouts include CB and tc too.

She chose for her life to be harder than mine so I still don't think its fair, to be fair she had always worked hard but gave up work completely as she wouldn't have got enough in benefits, not entirely her fault but a system that is extremely flawed. Not for one minute do I think it would be easier being a single parent, I rely on my DH for support hugely, not just financially but emotionally and probably would struggle on my own.

Also, my friend did not live in a shitty council flat, she lived in a lovely 2 bed flat in a really nice area which was actually nicer than my brother and SIL could afford when they got married at about the same time even though they both worked.

Your situation sounds tough and is completely different to what is being described here by the Op and myself.

yes it's legal.
lots of people raise babies on their own
people manage without a career - we are all entitled to statutory maternity pay and leave and if she has a family who want to help then that is lovely and means she won't be raising a baby alone
it's her mum, not yours, so why does it matter to you?
yes there will be a medical history/info with the sperm from a sperm bank
Define 'moral'

no one has a right to children but no one has a right to deny someone the chance.

your friend could go and sleep with someone they never intend to see again and get pregnant.

YAB totally Unreasonable and a bit weird.

Sorry that post was in response to wibblybibble.

I think everyone has different experiences and no one is wrong here - just what we believe or have known in the past.

opener ..i have to disagree. its great that your friends child had such a great experience....but for others having one parent not there and not even knowing who they are and who their grandparents etc would have been is a huge deal

it can't just be dismissed by saying " you know what other people fill in the gaps" and "its the same for adopted children" ..that's not true for all children.

my hubby loved his adopted parents greatly and they gave him a great life but has always felt something was missing. he looks at our children and always likes to see how they are like him in looks and personality and i know he would love to see if his father is similar. he might not like his real father if he met him - he might be a real asshole but it would be walking down the street and not wondering if you had just walked past your dad. there are other aspects that run deeper too - just having that genetic link.

Having the missing medical history is a problem when filling in life insurance forms, having medical reviews cos you are always asked about your family history and he simply didn't know his.

If my hubby didn't later find out that most of his family have had bowel problems starting in their forties he wouldn't know to look out for the signs - he is 39 now. That is why i think that although there is nothing wrong with wanting to use a doner i think the child should have a right to find out who their father is.

You can think what you like, no matter how judgemental and holier than thou your thoughts. It would be none of your business and totally out of order to tell the woman what you think though.

YANBU There are a lot of children who having grown up feel very 'lost' not having a real idea or meaningful link about the other half of their paternal history. Having been a single parent myself, I would not deliberately choose that path for my children, it does affect them always. All you can try and do is minimise the effect on them (and my children have regular contact with their father)

I am 37 and would love another child - a little girl, I have boys - and I feel I haven't really parented (because of the circumstances, the stress under which I had my children) but never would I deliberately choose single parenthood again.

Sorry, but IMO it is very selfish to deliberately choose to have a child this way. It really isn't fair on them, and you take a gamble that they will be alright with it and not grow up with a sense that something is missing.

there is nothing wrong with using a doner

I know it could all work out beautifully but I can't help but think of the potential for harm in terms of missing a dad.

Quite a lot of children are protected from harm precisely because they are missing a dad.

A happy, functional single parent can offer a far superior upbringing for a child than an unhappy, dysfunctional couple can.

Your stance only makes sense if you assume that all fathers are good and all couples are happy. Given that nearly half of all relationships fail, the latter is clearly not true, and given the incidence of child abuse in the UK and fathers who abdicate their financial, practical and emotional responsibilities, the former is stretching it too (as it

I'm all for personal responsibility and I wouldn't advise anyone to get pregnant (regardless of circumstances) without having thought long and hard about it. But according to the UN and the World Health Organisation, reproductive rights rest on the recognition of the basic right of all couples and individuals to decide freely and responsibly the number, spacing and timing of their children, so having children is considered a right, not a privilege in terms of international human rights.

"Sorry, but IMO it is very selfish to deliberately choose to have a child this way. It really isn't fair on them, and you take a gamble that they will be alright with it and not grow up with a sense that something is missing."

fabulous, if you're concerned about taking a gamble perhaps no-one should have children at all. I look around my friends and consider my own situation too, seeing the lone parents who were once married to their childrens' fathers, the guys living in unhappy marriages, parents who have been widowed, parents who have faced/are facing life threatening illness. How selfish I and they must be to have taken the gamble of bringing children into this world.

sunshine don't worry I'm all too aware of child abuse from fathers

I of course meant missing a good dad. Which obviously might not be there in many cases anyway, but would still be missed. At least with a dad around there's the chance he'd be a good dad.

Am surprised to read that about the UN and the World Health Organisation rights.

Yes GrahamTribe but that's the result of life happening, not a deliberate setting up of a potentially huge disadvantage.

Look as a SP I got the 'SP are shit parents' message all the time but I knew my children were far better brought up than some children living in two parent households. But i wasn't measuring myself up against those families as the lowest denominator, I was comparing myself with the children growing up in functional 2 parent homes, and yes i wished my children didn't have to continually wave goodbye to their father, even though they get on great with him.

Why do people pretend that it doesn't matter if a child doesn't have the other side of their family around when it's convenient? Of course it does. It doesn't have to be devastating and children can get through it very well. But it is a gamble isn't it? Sometimes I lay awake as I'm sure all parents do worrying about the children - only on my own. If I'd had better luck and more sense when I was younger no way would I choose to have children under my circumstances again.

O.P. If I had a friend considering this option I'd tell her what I think and then leave it up to her.

I don't believe any dad, regardless of his ability to be a decent parent, is better than no dad.

A child deserves to have unconditional love and support in their life and having two parents, only one of which is interested is being a parent (or worse) must surely be worse in terms of outcomes than only having one who is entirely committed?

-----~~~~~~~~~~[[[[[

My friend used a donor for two of her dc. She was desperate to be a mum again. She is a single parent and she struggles every day. She has no savings, but her mum helps her out quite a lot.
She is a great mum, but I wish for her sake she had found a partner, rather than a donor as perhaps her life would have been a bit easier.

The Children's Society report concluded that it was the number of meaningful relationships a child had that had most influence on factors such as reducing child abuse, later happiness, etc. It also concluded that it didn't really matter what the biological relationship is.

If you go on that basis, anyone in a nuclear family is denying their child to the extra advantages afforded by an extended family. A small commune could offer more than a couple. Similarly, an adoptive couple can provide just as good a home as biological parents.

Ultimately, it's common sense. A child that has a number of adults who all care deeply about that's child welfare is going to have a bigger safety net than a child brought up by a lone parent with no family and a tiny support network. But that's all it is - a safety net. It in no way can be used as a measure of the quality of parenting or as any meaningful indication of a specific child's future success or happiness.

Put it this way, if my DC became orphaned tomorrow and I didn't have any other plans already in place, I'd far rather my DC go to a competent and caring single woman than I would to many couples out there.

Agree with all that sunshine like you say, it's common sense. You're getting very close to changing my mind on sperm donation

But I still think that everything else being equal, having a good dad is preferable to having no dad (notwithstanding loads of other factors, like the apparent lack of good dads out there)

The thing is though, I just don't think you can apply the rule of 'all things being equal' when it comes to family. No two families are ever the same. I think it's high time we recognised that there are all sorts of family, all are equally valid and all can offer a child the same opportunities in life depending on how healthy they function. Ultimately, the qualities of the parent(s) are going to be far more influential than the relationship (or lack thereof) between them.

Glad to hear I'm making you rethink though.

Yes I think I'm letting my own lack of a father or any other "meaningful relationships" cloud my judgement. If I'd had a nice dad it would've made all the difference to me, but I can't extrapolate that to "every child should start out with two parents" because they may be surrounded by lots of other caring adults, or alternatively damaging parents.