AIBU to think the "40 Days for Life" campaigners are utterly immoral

[technodad]

news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/newsid_9705000/9705877.stm

Surely harassment and intimidation are illegal? I don't understand how these spineless scum get away with this. There needs to be larger and vocal counter demonstrations back. They need to be bullied right back, harder. They only do this because these vulnerable women are such easy targets.

am agreeing with practically everybody on here[thought it was awful myself when I heard it this morning....thought there was something 'vain' and attention seeking about the protesters : like they liked showing off more than anything else really]. I hadn't thought this happened in britain

So do you you think these people should be protesting outside the clinic, halfpastwine?

No, they don't need to be bullied back. Two wrongs don't make a right. But you can "deflect attention" if you are in a position to do so.

I used to live next door to the Marie Stopes clinic in ealing. Every bloody Saturday there'd be protesters outside, and they would consistently directly approach women going in to hand out their propaganda. I used to yell abuse at them - prob should have called the police, but I was a lot younger then and didnt always have the best judgement

demisemiquaver That's the point, it does happen in Britian. It's a great thing that we have freedom of speech but it can go too far sometimes and cross boundaries.

Glad I'm not the only one who was absolutely enraged by this, I was actually shaking with fury listening to that man trying to justify his actions. My DH was so annoyed he turned the radio off towards the end of the interview.

Is there anything we can do to stop this? I know in the states people actually volunteer to help women access abortion clinics. I hope it never comes to that in this country.

re abuse of freedom of speech: for catspee to say '99% of anti-abortionists are vitriolic to single mothers' .......wtf? What an unfair and way over the top statement; does catspee not know that women in couples have abortions too? to say all antiabortionists are like that is itself a vitriolic statement[unlike the majority of the good posts here]

Okay, I am not in the UK, but in Ireland, where instead of 40 Days for Life-rs, we have Youth Defence. Just as distasteful, to my mind. Protesters on O Connell Street, with their placards of aborted foetuses, harassing people. Disgusting. HalfPastWine, why do you want to make abortion illegal? Should any woman not be allowed autonomy over her body?

As I said, I am in Ireland, and I am heavily involved with the Action On X campaign. Actually, I would urge any of you to support this. I have travelled to the UK with many women wanting an abortion, so as to provide support. I will continue to do so.

i'm very anti abortion personally but i do think its wrong for them to harrass the women and make a scene outside the clinics, as those are women in such a vulnerable situation as people have mentioned. if they want to support women and help them consider options other than abortion they could make a service to support people, and widely advertise it and leave the message out there about the support they can give. even leaving leaflets in the waiting room of abortion clinic i think would be okay, as people can read it or not, depending if they want to and are free to ignore. but not gathering outside the centre in an intimidating way. that is going about things the totally wrong way

I am always surprised that the police don't get involved, I've seen public order offences be made out for far less but they've obviously been told it's political and to stay out of it.

Shocking, I had no idea this sort of thing went on in the UK. I thought it was only in the States.

Amelia Earhart - that was the bit that made me spit my tea out, and he should be challenged on that by medical professionals live on air. What a dick. We were in London last week and saw some of these nutjobs somewhere near Russell Square - what a crew.

Whatmeworry said: The best way is to get people to counter protest - facebook campaign?

To be honest the best way to approach this might be to setup an e-petition. The people-power of Mumsnet could reach 100,000 signatures within about 25 minutes (especially if every user spread the petition via Facebook and twitter and sent it viral)!

You could create one with a link to this radio article so that people can see how disgraceful it is and then ask for a review of the law with an aim to make it illegal for some of their practices to be conducted, for example:

• Protesting within 100 m (for example) of a clinic.
• Actively attempting to identify users or employees of the clinic and harassing them by any means (e.g. "escorting them").
• Filming anyone entering or leaving the clinics.

(I am sure there are some other completely reasonable stipulations that would allow legal protest without casing the harassment of vulnerable individuals and the respectable people who seek to help them - please add them to the list).

This proposed law would accept that individuals are allowed freedom of speech, yet reflect the extremist nature of their methods and the effect these methods have on vulnerable individuals in need of support.

Clearly as the only man on this thread, I can not set it up because it would cause my MN identity to be somewhat open (you have to provide your full name to set one up)!

If I had one of these protests near me, I would be tempted to organise a counter-protest. A bigger group of people with messages of support, and try and 'outdo' the protesters so that their message loses impact.

I don't care if someone is anti-abortion or not, but this is a vile way to behave towards women that are going through an immensely difficult time.

I too was disgusted, how these people get away with it is beyond me. The chap representing them, certainly on Radio 4 did not really answer any questions put to him, just kept repeating a mantra about how many women they had helped. Helped in what way?
As for right to protest etc. In what way is escorting these women to the door whilst forcing literature on to them, acceptable? This is what was reported by more than one woman.

Interested that halfpastwine won't answer direct questions either........

"Debate me, debate my policy team but leave the women alone"

Nail on the head. There are better ways to "protest" against abortion, and that's to do with law, not individual women or workers.

They should fuck the fuck off and do their protesting outside parliament or wherever, not harrass people outside clinics. I have been there.

I think that HalfPastWine is saying(and excuse me if I'm wrong HPW) that all members of this society have a right to peaceful protest.

As far as I know HPW is not a spokesperson for this group! I think what s/he is saying is fair enough. It is the reality. It doesn't mean it's morally right, although the protesters clearly think they are taking a correct moral stance what a fucking joke

I agree that there is a right to protest and it should be very strongly defended, but I also agree with HPW and all other posters that the manner in which these idiots (my very mild choice of word) go about it is wrong. The women being targeted have a right to go about their lawful business unmolested.

I think we all agree with that.

seeker You asked So do you you think these people should be protesting outside the clinic, halfpastwine?

Well, as with all campaigns it depends on what their aim is and what they're trying to achieve. I am not familiar with the group who did this protest, I quickly listened to the radio report so I don't actually know their background.
If their aim was to intimidate then yes, they picked the right spot to do it however if their aim is to change law/views then no, they would have been best campaigning outside parliament etc. As with all campaigns, for maximum impact you have to make sure you get the right audience.

Peppermint Thanks for understanding where I'm coming from!

Shadowscolidewithpeople ^HalfPastWine, why do you want to make abortion illegal? Should any woman not be allowed autonomy over her body?
^

Please show me where on this thread I have said I wish to make abortion illegal and say why a women should not be allowed autonomy over her body.

I am amazed that the police have not done anything to stop the filming. The whole thing is a disgraceful assault upon the lawful rights of women to access safe abortions. Hope the 'campaigners' burn in hell.

awful people and nothing new - i have been spat on, kicked, driven at and hit with placards ...i used to escort women to Brook when i volunteered for rape crisis - these people lack any sense of compassion and empathy

Nobody with any sense of decency would think that these people should demonstrate in any way outside the clinic- even though they have a legal right to do so.

Anybody who does not agree with this statement is, by association, on the side of the campaigners.

I expressed myself badly in my last post, what I was trying to say was that IN MY PERSONAL experience, any anti-abortionists I have spoken to/with were of the flawed assumption that only single women had abortions.

This is not my personal view

Of course women in all kinds of situations have abortions and for all different reasons.

I am sure there are caring kind anti abortionists out there who care deeply about the woman as well as the fetus, I've just not meet any.