AIBU to think that WOHM's don't "do the same as SAHMs AND work too!"

[eppa]

Firstly this is not a WOHM bashing thread at all.

Its just that I'm a SAHM and have been offended and hurt by a couple of real life comments basically saying that I shouldn't complain as I'm only a SAHM and that WOHM have to do everything I do AND they manage to work as well.

I disagree with this because for me an average day includes: making and clearing up after three meals, going out to baby groups, park, docs appts, trying to think up and doing activities such as cooking and painting and reading AND trying to keep on top of the mess that having 2 children in the house all day entails.

However a WOHM would get DC up and dressed, drop them at nursery where they would get their 3 meals, do activities etc, pick them up and return to a house that was clean (or the same state as it was left in!).

Obviously both WOHMs and SAHMs work and they both work hard and WOHMs do parent when they are at home. Its just that I don't think its fair to claim that WOHMs somehow do more than SAHMS.

I see what you mean

Job = task rather than job= paid employment

tomverlaine - rest assured, as a SAHM my weekends are also a hell of a lot more relaxing than my weekdays ; indeed, the school holidays are a hell of a lot more relaxing than term time.

I've never said or thought that being a SAHM meant you were a dull drudge. If you have people in your life that say or imply that then you really need to get some new friends. Stop hanging out with all these people who have their children in nursery for 3 meals a day, lovely working lunches, time to do their admin in work and yet look down on you for your choices. How's about meeting up with other SAHMs - hey maybe those ones you see at baby & toddler groups!

If you are looking at the actual, physical being WITH your children then yes, in the cases you describe the mother is not with her child for all those hours and working (don't forget the tag parenting and shift working that people have described though).

But a WOHM does everything essential to keep a family/home going AND works. Nailing my colours to the mast, I do genuinely think it's harder. (Described my current WOHM position above, but have been a SAHM (for longer than a year too, and a WAHM).

badpoet - I have examples, close to home, of WOHMs who use their working status as an excuse to wriggle out of all those things that keep home and family going, outsourcing them to all and sundry (preferably unpaid). It's not uncommon.

Bugster I explained why upthread. Being a SAHM is not beneficial in itself so just being one is not worthy of any more appreciation than any other normally functioning member of society.

"WOHMs are of SAHMs, and so belittle them in order to feel better about themselves slaving over a hot computer/whatever "

you meant to say 'some WOHMs'?

Or you can speak for all of them?

Librarian - you could say that any number of jobs were not particularly beneficial to society though so why should WOHMs be lauded above SAHMs

I just dont' think you can compare them at all. There are two many variables:

The personality of the mother.
The nature of the job
The temperament of the child/ren
The number of children
The school run(s)
Type of accommodation
Location
Income
Parental support
Childcare
(and those are just off the top of my head. I am sure there are more)

Just as one woman loves being a SAHM while another hates it, one SAHM might find it easier than being a WOHM while another might find it a lot harder. Isn't that why we should be trying to achieve genuine choice - so that individual women can take up the role they are best suited to?

This is puzzling me a bit about some of the posts on here.
Why do people with partners/husbands post that they work and do absoloutely everything else home and child related?

When I was at work we shared household chores (cooking/cleaning/shopping etc) straight down the middle and ditto children related matters (drs appts/sickness/drop off and pick up from nursery.

Why are those with partners describing doing everything?

This does not move me away from my basic position that this whole debate is a crock of shit because we are women not cookies and our lives are all different. But it is puzzling me.

I can say absolutely hand on heart that I do not belittle SAHMs, I simply refuse to accept that it is hard. The two are not the same. I recognise the value of what they do.

I can absolutely say also that I am not remotely jealous of SAHMs.
I could stll be a SAHM if I wanted, but I don't. It's that simple.

Also, if half the SAHMs find it as hard as they proffess, what's to be jealous of?

librarian I just don't agree at all that being SAHM is not beneficial in itself. Of course it's an emotive topic and opinions are divided but many mothers, psychologists and others believe there is a great benefit to a child's development in being cared for primarily by parents. Supporting healthy development of our children is in the interests of society as a whole.

sunshineandbooks - I agree wholeheartedly that there are multiple variables involved in the decision to have a SAHP in a family. I am also fascinated by some people's inability to measure work done unless it has been institutionalised.

I have many (high-level) skills I use on a daily basis, for free, for the benefit of others, in which I have no formal qualification. Does that make the tasks I accomplish with those skills worthless?

For me pag it was because DH works such long and unpredictable hours.

It was impossible to rely on him for any childcare or even to take the DC to nursery/school. It was also impossible to expect him to do housework during the week as he leaves at 6.40am amd returns at 8.30 needing to catch up with the DC and eat.

Or he might be abroad. He often is.

So I found myself juggling everyhting...which was bloody bloody hard work!

"Librarian - you could say that any number of jobs were not particularly beneficial to society though so why should WOHMs be lauded above SAHMs"

They aren't! Any more than SAHMs are being denigrated. Working harder does not mean you are a better or worse person than anyone else.

Good post wordfactory

Good post wordfactory

Instead of everyone saying how hard they have it, has anyone got any tips for making life easier? I plan to go back full time after mat leave as I'm not cut out for full time mummying. There's only so many baby groups you can go to before insanity kicks in IMHO! So far my ideas to keep it simple when I go back to work are:

Pick nursery on way to work
Do online shopping
Only buy clothes that can be tumble dried and that don't need ironing
Continue employing lovely cleaner :)
Make sure dh saves some days for emergency childcare - I teach so not option to take hols when I like
Sign up with emergency childcare agency if dh or anyone else can't do it
Make sure all paperwork electronic and direct debit where possible
Have a range of easy, nutritional, quick to make teas up my sleeve
Don't cook separate meals for adults and children

Anything else I've not thought of?

I think for me bonsoir the difference between the tasks I perform in my home and family life and the tasks I perfrom as part of my work is the interaction with the wider world.

It's not the exchange of cash per se (I have to do many, far too many, things for free as part of my work) but more the recognition and interaction with the world outside the sphere of my home and family.

To me there is a difference or there certainly feels to be so. Today I met a friend for lunch to discuss a work project and it felt like work whereas if we'd met up to discuss lift shares or whatever it wouldn't.

Bugster Of course it isn't beneficial in itself. Being a SAHM is not inherently valuable to society. Being cared for primarily by parents is, I think most people would agree, best for children, but this does not require one parent to give up employment to be a SAHP. Primarily does not mean 24/7. It does not mean just one parent. It can be a joint effort from Mum and Dad. It can include grandparents, or do they stop being able to parent as soon as their own children become parents?

I agree that Supporting healthy development of our children is in the interests of society as a whole, but is not the sole preserve of of a SAHM.

When DD was fulltime in nursery, we had to feed her at home and send in snacks with her - they fed her dinner and some fruit but we had to send some too. And she always had her evening meal at home too. So in fact, she only got 1 of 3 meals given to her in creche.

Well, I cannot, hand-on-heart, recall ever discussing lift shares when meeting for lunch with my friends. But we might discuss strategies for keeping doors open for our children for top notch HE in France, the UK and the US, and the choice of skills we will need to develop and maintain in our children in order to get there. On Monday evening, we have little multinational group of mothers planning to gatecrash a presentation at a highly desirable but über oversubscribed Paris school, with dinner afterwards.

Completely agree. Of course SAHMs do more in the home and with their children when WOHMs are at work!!!

librarian of course looking afger children can be a joint effort between parents, and include grandparents, but sometimes for children to be cared for primarily by their close family members does require a parent to give up employment. Not everyone has grandparents nearby wgo are willing or able to help, sometimes partners work erratic hours and need to travel, etc - in which case sometimes it is a choice between putting your child in a day care situation most of the week, or giving up your job. In that situation, the work of a SAHM can be of benefit to the child and of society.

handbagCrab I'd say from reading this thread, pick a "full service" nursery. It wasn't really clear to me that some ask you to make bottles / provide nappies / send food in etc etc. Mine provides everything my toddler needs apart from a coat and hat, and they'll provide hats in an emergency too.

handbag - book yourself in for a reflexology session

I had one the other night and it was the most chilled I have ever been, Am going to treat myself once a month as I think it will just keep me de-stressed enough to cope with work and a baby :)