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Original poster

to be confused? Transgender pregnancy.

208 replies

troisgarcons · 11/03/2012 22:20

In the papers today.

In short, a woman commences the transgender process into a man. She becomes/lives as a gay man. But keeps her womb and overies. Stops taking her medication, gets pregnant (deliberately) by her gay male lover.

I'm a bit lost here. Clearly she isn't a man? And I have to ask where the gay male boyfriend thought the was popping his sausage?

OP posts:
Birdsgottafly · 11/03/2012 22:43

These discussions should be happening because the suicide rate of transgendered people is at the level that it was for homosexuals when it was illegal. It is thought that upto 50% of trangendered people will have tried suicide at least once by the time that they are 21.

There are a lot of younger transgendered people who have been murdered just because they are different, it suddenly stops being funny when it is your teenager.

ZonkedOut · 11/03/2012 22:44

lesley33 apart from wondering how you think gay men have sex... I saw a documentary years ago on female to male transgender, where one man claimed his girlfriend had no idea, because the surgery was so successful. He had a penis made from a large patch of skin on his thigh with a rod in it which could make it erect when clicked, like you can get for erectile dysfunction. Apparently it's possible to do.a decent job, but many people undergoing the transition prefer not to have the graft done.

SarahStratton · 11/03/2012 22:46

They should. But stupid headlines stating that a man has given birth should stop. Because it simply isn't true, men cannot get pregnant, nor can they give birth.

Nyac · 11/03/2012 22:46

If a man is someone who gets pregnant gives birth then what is the definition of a man these days?

It used to be adult human male

Only females can get pregnant and give birth.

There appears to be some confusion.

sassymcnassy · 11/03/2012 22:46

Who cares what people want to define themselves as? If someone feels they are male, but was born with female organs, who are you to say what they are?

Seems to me that people who insist on defining others are just threatened, and scared of difference.

Nyac · 11/03/2012 22:47

If every woman who was giving birth tomorrow, stood and said "I'm a man", would the papers be reporting on that thousands of men gave birth thad day?

Original poster
troisgarcons · 11/03/2012 22:48

I think most of us are enlightened enough on here to realise that gender and sexual preferances are now so out in the open that no one bats an eyelid. Smaller communities might. But not in cosmopolitan areas.

Going back 30 years I worked with a cross dresser. The biggest worry we had at work was who was going to tell him a black bra under a white shirt was a big no-no. (Black bra, pinstriped suit - just a fashion fau pas)

OP posts:
SarahStratton · 11/03/2012 22:48

Personally, I don't feel at all threatened or scared. Merely cross and misled by spurious, factually incorrect headlines.

lesley33 · 11/03/2012 22:48

Zonked out - obviously gay men have penetrative sex with penis. But sorry my knowledge is out of date. The last stuff I had read on this was that successful surgery wasn't really possible as it was still in its infancy. So sorry I hadn't realised that things had improved. Don't really understand why though in that case people don't have the full surgery?

Devora · 11/03/2012 22:51

troisgarcons, did your dad really get asked that or is it urban myth? I have spent a lot of time working in hospitals - as well as attending them - and have never, ever heard of nurses asking people's sexual orientation on admission.

Finding the tone of this thread a bit unpleasant, tbh.

SarahStratton · 11/03/2012 22:51

Pretty huge step I suppose, and devastating if it goes wrong. If I try and put myself in their shoes (and I appreciate that I will never fully), I'm not sure I would be brave enough to try and have that done.

Birdsgottafly · 11/03/2012 22:51

The media come out with all sorts of crap, though, so why expect anything different for this case.

If you think that this is a "new fad" google "two spirits", it has always been recognised in Native American (mine) culture.

AKissIsNotAContract · 11/03/2012 22:51

There was a F2M transsexual on 'my transsexual summer' who had a fantastic penis.

MateyMooo · 11/03/2012 22:52

I have strong views on this....

I will call you what you want me to call you.. man , woman, heck i'll even support you if you want to be known as an elf.

I love you for who you are.

But, if you are human and born with the ability to carry a baby you will be female. When a person born without the ability to carry a baby carries a baby... then i'll be impressed, otherwise i'm not bothered. having a baby is a miracle that happens roughly once every minute. each and every one of those babies are special as are their parents.

i too feel sorry for the child, becuase the are not thinking of the child as a seperate individual rather as an extenstion of themselves. its the same kind of thinking that used to happen with the parents of child actors spending all the childrens money, before legislation brought a halt to it.

I cheer though to know tht a baby is brought into a loving relationship, no matter what the context of that relationship is.

Original poster
troisgarcons · 11/03/2012 22:52

troisgarcons, did your dad really get asked that or is it urban myth? I have spent a lot of time working in hospitals - as well as attending them - and have never, ever heard of nurses asking people's sexual orientation on admission.

He really did - Greenwich Hospital (now demolished) 1996.

OP posts:
sassymcnassy · 11/03/2012 22:53

Factually incorrect? Whose facts though? The american dude, Thomas Beatty I think?, he was legally a man when he had his 3 children. He had part of the surgery, testosterone treatment, and legally changed his gender to male. So if he says hes a man, his country says he's a man, and his passport says he's a man, who are YOU to say he is not and the headlines are "factually inaccurate"?

Who says gender is a fixed attribute?

Birdsgottafly · 11/03/2012 22:53

Les;ey- it's far from infancy. It takes at least three years, for most, to go through the process. The individual can choose weighing up, pros and cons, of what is available.

GothAnneGeddes · 11/03/2012 22:53

For people who would like to know more about trans issues, here is a good link:www.t-vox.org/index.php?title=Trans_101

It answers some of the questions raised here in detail.

GothAnneGeddes · 11/03/2012 22:53

www.t-vox.org/index.php?title=Trans_101

lesley33 · 11/03/2012 22:54

sarah - it is a huge step. But anything I have ever read on people's personal journeys to having surgery has always been about how they believe they are trapped in the wrong body and can't wait to be in the right body. I don't understand how that fits with not having surgery? Genuinely not a criticism, I just don't understand that choice if the surgery on offer is decent.

I have never read of male to female transgender people opting to keep their penis for example.

Obviously I know its different for inter sex people, but I ma assuming we are not discussing that here.

Nyac · 11/03/2012 22:55

Gender isn't a fixed attribute, sex is though. It's in our chromosomes and in our gonads.

It's like saying a tree can become a carrot. You can whittle it down and paint it orange but it will still have been a tree and will never have become a carrot.

What's the definition of man if it isn't a male human with XY chromosomes and testes?

WidowWadman · 11/03/2012 22:56

troisgarcons - why on earth was your father asked about sexual orientation in the hospital? Shock Surely non of their business.

As for him "selling the story to the press" - was that the same guy who's been hounded and had pretty much a price set out on his head by the tabloids? Anyone who's been following the Leveson enquiry and is still thinking that it's neccessarily the people reported on who wilfully sell their story for a quick buck is naive.

MrsFionaCharming · 11/03/2012 22:57

I think people need to consider what they're actually saying here. This man may have kept his sex organs because he wanted to be able to have a biological child. Or because surgery is invasive, difficult, painful and expensive, or just because he doesn't mind having them and doesn't feel the need to change them. He may be playing to have gender reassignment surgery, or he may not. All of these are perfectly valid reasons, and make him no less of a man.

I think it's sad that we live in a society when we feel we can define someone by what they keep in their pants.

sassymcnassy · 11/03/2012 22:58

You can remove your gonads, and make new ones, and change your hormones. So whats the definition of someone with xx chromosomes but with a penis and a beard? Or xy with breasts and a vagina? Whats fixed about that?

Birdsgottafly · 11/03/2012 23:01

If it is indentified that the person is transgendered then they can have treatment so that they never hit puberty.

Lesly-many do keep thier penis, speaking globally, that is.

It is as important that they are percieved as their chosen gender by others, so outwards appearance may be needed but not more personal surgery.