to NOT want a cleaner?

[OrkaLiely]

it seems to be very common on MN; paying another person to clean your house. Why can't the adults in the house do it between them? And once the kids are old enough to hold a duste,r teach them to help out as well.

I'd hate someone else in our house cleaning up our mess. It sends a bad message to children too. And no-one in this age of dishwashers, washing machines, vacuum cleaners is too busy to do it themselves.

Cleaners.

I just don't get the problem with it.

Whenever I've had one, I've literally had people falling over to do the work.

If it's so bad and wrong, this would not be the case.

A couple of hours a week, with good pay, I don't see why it's a problem.

Still not had an answer to my online grocery shop question either.

Is that ok? As if buying food for your children is less important a task than keeping a house clean.

I don't understand the vehement opposition is all.

No, they haven't given a good reason, is what I mean.

Just saying it's wrong is not a reason.

But they're unlikely to give a reason you think is a good reason though, are they?

Not sure I know why I'm arguing the point really. What with me being on the other side and all.

I just get fed up with the "envy" argument.

No, they haven't come up with any kind of reason at all.

It's wrong

Why?

No, thefallen.

There has not been one reason given, that I can see anyway. Not one.

Happy to have it pointed out to me if I've missed it.

God. It's just a cleaner.

A career for some; a job for others. An easy way to earn a bit of money.

My brother - male the last time I checked - is currently a partner in a huge city firm earning a ludicrous salary. He cleaned offices as a student to earn money. Easy job, no special skills or quals required, which worked round studies and suited him at the time.

I really don't get the ideological stance against having a cleaner. You have one life. If you'd prefer to spend your free time in more enjoyable pursuits rather then elbow-deep in marigolds, scrubbing the loo, why on earth shouldn't you?

No really - why shouldn't you? Especially since having a cleaner doesn't actually mean that you're forever more exempt from cleaning.

You can still be all worthy in front of your kids each time the kitchen surface needs a wipe down and the laundry needs doing on the days the cleaner doesn't come (usually 6 days out of 7 for most people with a cleaner). That's a lot of time to be setting this good example that seems to be so bloody important...

I wouldn't have a cleaner as such but would pay someone to follow my son around and tidy up after him. That would be worth paying for

Arf at PattyMajor saying I have an "agenda" and runningwilde for accusing me of sock puppetry

I believe you shouldn't employ a cleaner because it is demeaning for you (and DP/DH if you have one) to get someone else to clean your home and it's demeaning for her to do so. Another person - and let's face it, it's nearly always a woman - should not need to earn her living by sweeping and mopping your floors, cleaning your loo(s), scrubbing your bath and hoovering up your muck.

It's a different matter if it is outside the home because it isn't practical to have staff clean the office or customers to clean Waitrose the stores. But in your own home, your personal space where your family lives then the family should clean up after themselves.

Teach your children some personal responsibility; that they should pick up after themselves, clean the bathroom they use (at an age appropriate time, of course), wipe down the counters their food is prepared on.

And note, I have always maintained it's family work not wife's work and that my remarks are not aimed at those with health reasons for not cleaning.

Ah, we're getting somewhere near the nub of it. You think housework is demeaning.

You're wrong.

Hi ho, hi ho it's back to the dark ages we go.....

No Chub I think housework should be done by the people who inhabit the house, it is demeaning to get another person to do it for you.

Why?

Is it also demeaning to use Internet shopping? A car wash? A window cleaner?

I'm guessing not so why am I demeaned by having someone in to Hoover?

Shame ours isn't every day and at my beck and call, especially after a children's tea party yesterday. Demeaning would be leaving the mess until her scheduled day.

WEll I for one have been very glad that people needed/wanted cleaners. It got me out of a really tight period a few years ago, and you know what, I actually enjoyed it! I am far better at cleaning other peoples houses than my own I got a sense of satisfaction from making the house lovely for when they got home. I would always do a little extra, find a job that they hadn't asked me to do and I found it worked both ways. The people I worked for were lovely, so lovely, we made it work for both of us.
I certainly didn't feel demeaned. If anything, because of what was going on in my life at the time.
I would employ a cleaner if i could afford it, hell, i would employ a full time housekeeper if I could

Ooops some of post missing.
If anything because of what was going on in my life at the time i felt empowered for earning my own money and regularly being told what an asset i was and how lucky they were to have me!

Ranty not rangy - iPhone!

Totally off topic but love the way iPad and iPhone correct their own spellings but change other words!

Demeaning? No, I don't think so.

And as people keep pointing out to you, unless you have a full time live-in housekeeper then there is still plenty of clearing and tidying to be done that children can learn from.