To want to wear make up and high heels

[WheresTheCat]

Harumph. Have just skimmed through Julie Birchill's article in the weekend papers (I know - I'm running behind!) Apparently women only wear heels and make up as we are slaves to men.

I am so fed up with all the judgements about what women wear. Surely we should wear what we want as long as we're happy. For me it's high heels and make up, for my BF it's trainers and jeans. It doesn't matter.

And, Julie Birchill, it doesn't make me a bad person/anti-feminist/unintelligent if I choose to dress the way I do.

I have worn makeup every single day for as long as I can remember, I wouldn't like to say who I wear it for, I just wear it! Have never considered who I wear it for, it is confusing me now thinking about it. I would not dream of going out without makeup, just as I would not dream of going out without knickers on, or without cleaning my teeth. Hmm. I did go to work today without eyeshadow and 2 people said I looked tired!

I wear heels all the time, the only exceptions being work (not allowed) and when exercising (obviously). The reason is, because that is how I like to dress. I don't think this makes me a bad person! I think it is nice to look nice, that's all.

I think mostly that if a woman is slave to anyone for wearing heels and make-up its other women.

I don't dress up to impress the mass populus of males out there, I dress up when I'm going out with the girls so we can croon over each other, it CAN'T be about the men, because we have girl's night's IN. (The 'going out' bit is purely because I am leaving the premises).

I also do it for me.

I am loving my absolutely no make-up, hair scraped back because I'm ill look... honestly, its nice to see my pure mug again.

I'll apply natural looking make-up when I'm better and work up to the next bout of illness.

Those of you saying that they just do these things to look nice for themselves. How did you define what nice is? Because in a patriarchal society, that definition is created by and for the men more than the women. No-one sits down and decides they want to make women look a certain way, but media images, comments from people, what you see in life around you, they all create an idea of how you should look. From that , you go on to decide if you want to follow or not. But you don't get to decide the societal norm of what pretty/attractive is

I wear make up a
s I prefer the reflection I see in the mirror with it than I do without it.

I like heels as I am a shotar*e and I don't find them at all uncomfortable- but in summer I will rarely get out of flipflops.

all those who say heels are comfortable, can you be more specific please.

I mean for how long can you walk continuously in them before they start to hurt your feet?

Obviously you'd not want to have to break into a run in heels, or walk especially fast?

Well I can quite honestly say that no man has ever told me what to wear, how to dress, or how to look. Plenty have complimented it (and women have too), but even if they hadnt, it wouldnt make any difference to how I feel or what I wear. So long as I can look in the mirror and be happy with what I see, that is what matters to me.

I leave the house looking how I want to look, not because of how I think someone else will want me to look.

OK, I admit it, I wear heels and figure hugging clothes because I like flirting and being attractive to men and am socially conditoned to want to look a certain way.
I also have a first class degree, a good job, my own house, two children, and am completely independant and self supporting.

conditioned My spelling however is shit.

Conditioning or not, being aware of conditioning or not... sometimes y0ou just see a pair of heels and find a LOVELY lipstick and think OOH I actually look even better than before.

Heels for me are mostly 'carbar'... from the car to the bar (or girl friend's house) not to hike in.

It depends on the type of shoe/boot Lovesa, if they have a platform, it reduces the arc of the foot, and makes it very easy to walk in them. I have boots with a 4inch heel, but with 1" platform it makes them very comfy to walk around in all day. I have 3" sandals, which are only comfortable for an evening out which doesnt involve too much walking.

I can walk fast, and run in my boots no problem at all.

I must have weak ankles or somethin', I trip over fresh air, just couldnt risk heels

I am more likely to go over on my ankles in low heels as I tend not to pay as much care and attention. I even go over when I am wearing trainers.

I comepletely identify as a feminist and yet wear make-up every day (not much most of the time, but some) and heels when I go out.

I'm 5'9" so definitely do not need to wear heels. As for make-up, I completely see that the only reason I want to wear it, or feel better about myself for wearing it is that I have been conditioned to think that.

To deny that is sticking your head in the sand.

I'm in my late 30s so not quite at the need for improvement stage - but why do women in their 40s, say, feel the need for a bit of concealer, touche éclat, tinted moisturiser, high beam - whatever - when men don't? Why do women's complexions suddenly need a whole lot more concealment and improvement as they age, when men's don't?

So, I'm a flawed feminist, definitely. I do something which, when you look at the bigger picture isn't great for society/women, but I'm just not prepared to go the extra mile myself and forgo it, since looking good is important to me.

But - I see it for what it is - something I've been conditioned to do and feel that I do for myself, just as everyone on here seems in such a rush to protest ('I do it for meeeeee, not for anyone else, and certainly not for a man!!'), but I also 100% acknowledge that things I need to do to feel better about myself (lengthening and defining my eyelashes, say ) are not things my husband does to feel better about himself. Why not?

Wear make-up if you want to - I certainly do - it's a free world. But to refuse to join the dots and at least see what it leads onto, bigger picture-wise, is just ignoring what's right in front of you, IMO.

slinking - Very well put, I agree, BUT does your dh worry about his abs though? I've noticed that the 'done thing' on TV now seems to be that men, at some point, have to show their chest. If they appear from out of the bathroom, they have a towel around them as low as possible, in order to show their flat stomach & spectacular muscles.

even acting roles which don't require the character to be 'buff' seem to have this happen.

i would argue the same, though. patriarchal society demands that men are big & strong, and that we are sexually attracted to them, so they must have a six pack.

i do think we need to be more aware of WHY we find some things attractive - it's not because nature made us that way, but because society conditions us to expect a certain look. look back at pictures of various monarchs, if you want to see how much we change our perception of attraction, then try to argue that it isn't formed by society

I wear make-up to work as I consider it a kindness to my workmates who have to put up with looking at me all day

They are all women BTW

I'd say that's more of an American thing kickass angel. I see your point, though.

I think there's a lot of pressure on men to have a huge wang, which is probably a bit shit if you don't. In fact, I'd say a lot of problems in the world stem from cock-based insecurity. It's not like there's much you can do if it's not very big.

And going to see any Michael Fassbender movie is never going to be on the cards because he will inevitably get his huge member out.

Have you seen that thing? It'd take your eye out if you weren't careful.

LeQueen, I don't think anyone's denying that that exists on one level. I don't fully buy into all that evolutionary psychology though. If it were all true, surely EVERYONE would fancy big muscular dudes and many women don't. I for one like the skinny type.

Also now that men DON'T chase down mammoths, there's really no need for them to be big and strong. The people that make money are the ones we should be finding attractive these days.

Some stuff still exists on a visceral level I think - but I do think it's over-stated and used to explain why society isn't changing.

People are always going to fancy and be fascinated by beautiful people though. I don't think there's anything particularly wrong with that as long as normal looking people are treated decently, which, honestly, I think in this country they are. Look at something like Eastenders - most of the actors are really pretty normal looking but they're on the biggest show in the country.

I do feel pressured if most females around me are made up or really dressed up. Even at work conferences where I know what I am wearing is appropriate.

I started to wear makeup when I developed rosacia in my late 30's. I prefer to conceal it as people have made assumptions that I am a heavy drinker. I actually developed it during pregnancy and early mornings at the stables in sub zero temps did not help either. I feel sorry for men who have it and cannot hide their 'drinker's nose'.
Also I quite like men with a bit of slap on. Maybe a leftover from my New Romantic pre-teens?
Julie Birchill? I have yet to see a photo of her without heavy kohl round her eyes! Did she put it on in the 80's and forget it was there?

There is also the notion of success made apparent in our choice of a partner.

So a wealthy man might choose to be with a model as a mark of success. And vice versa of course.

I don't think you're necessarily right, LeQueen, but it is one theory. Doesn't explain why different people are attracted to different types of people though.

I love high heels, but don't wear them on a day-to-day basis, but always wear them when going for a night out or meal etc. Or even high heeled boots.

Make up and any beauty products i love, love, love.

I agree with those that say it just gives a better version of yourself. Even the most beautiful person looks better with some type of make up on. I would not feel very glamorous at a party without make up. It's just part of the whole package, just like wearing a nice dress or sparkly top than a pair of trackky bottoms.

Some people overanalyse everything. I have no desire to have cosmetic surgery. Wearing make up and having my hair coloured makes me feel and look more attractive. What's wrong with that?

IMO, the only people who say they don't ever wear make up are very precisely the ones that need it