to think this mum is a bit bonkers!!

[Dartfordmummy]

Don't know if there is already a thread on this but am a bit about this story!!

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2089474/Its-boy-Couple-brought-child-gender-neutral-reveal-sex-The-Infant--keeping-secret-FIVE-YEARS.html

Poor Sasha

Arf at DM dropping into paragraph 3 that they live in a 'television-free home'.

That confirms it then, incase readers needed any extra evidence, they're totally bonkers

Fwiw, each to their own imo. However, leaving him open to ridicule (dressing him in girls uniform) when he isn't old enough to stand up for himself against those who will believe he should conform to gender stereotypes (his peers) is bloody cruel. Regardless of whether or not we should have such stereotypes, they do exist and other 5 year olds will think he's strange and I think, because he has been brought up unaware of such things, he is going to be utterly baffled by their reaction and possible rejection.

Also agree that gender neutral does not = dressing him in pink flowery clothes. Surely it should be plain tops and jeans etc? Non-identifiable of gender clothes, no?

The child wasn't different-they were making him different.

These gender experiments always turn out to be boys. I think that it is because a lot of girls 'choose' to be very boy like, e.g. they won't wear dresses, they join cubs etc. Boys don't choose the girly things and so they are given a push.
My first thought with any parent who keeps gender secret is 'it is a boy' and it is!

I may be prejudiced and a bit thick according to Hully but I do know that it's 'hear, hear' not 'here here.'

So sorry to be an arse.

It is an excuse. Use my example, lots of people would argue that having gay parents would "put a child in a vulnerable position", is that a good reason? Lots of things make children vulnerable to bullies, and you want to put the onus on the victim to change and let the aggressor be validated by your excuses.

And exotic, there are lots of things I wouldn't do with my children that I couldn't care less if other people do with theirs, your reasoning is flawed.

The main problem you all have is far more fundemental than you realise. The human mind has a strong need for categorisation, not being able to label things adequately creates feelings of fear and helplessness. Your minds simply can't cope with not being able to attach a gender label to a child.

And I totally agree with the female clothes thing. The stories I've read where things turned out ok (ish) where when kids were allowed to run around in the woods dressed in gender non-specific clothing. World of difference between that and being photographed in the DM wearing a fairy outfit.

TheParanoidAndroid. It may be true that we of the feeble mind cannot cope with things not being labelled. However, have you ever thought there may be a very good biological or evolutionary reason for that. Just saying....

I don't like gender stereotypes. Nothing wrong with boys wearing fairy clothes FFS. But I think there's plenty you can do to dispel them without hiding a child's gender.

Anyway, in her bid to allay said stereotype (and I totally understand her wish to... Just think she took it too far) she has placed her DS into a new stereotype known as "that kid with the crazy attention-seeking parents" which is surely worse than the stereotype known as "boy"

Yes, of course I have. And since I said "the human mind" indicating all people, indeed the exact opposite of anyone in particular, I fail to see how you construed that as an attack on anyones "feeble mind". Labelling fail there....

I remember my parents saying it would be 'wrong' to have a mixed-race marriage because the 'children would be teased'. Things have now changed, thank goodness, and I think this issue is similar.

Why aren't the parents gender free?

I was referring to myself as 'feeble-minded' TheParanoidAndroid. You clearly failed to spot the humour....

Hully, I'm finding this really awkward, so I'm bowing out -- partly because it's a bit close to home, as this is someone I've known for over 20 years and somehow that just isn't the same as getting your teeth into some hypothetical person; and partly because I feel really thick for not realising there was some big secret about it all.

Guess that makes me one of the people who 'assume it's a boy by default', then (when I've seen them he's been wearing trousers anyhow, I think -- though my DS was the tutu type till mid-primary, so I might just not have noticed).

I also remember my lovely and very clever dad saying it was 'wrong' for 'homosexuals' to be in the army. He was wrong. Things change.

Humour? My eyesight isn't good enough to see things that small....

Fuzz pig. If that's a dig at me, please look at my earlier post where I expressly say there is nothing wrong with boys wearing fairy costumes. The point I was making was to draw comparisons between this woman and earlier experiments. I think the difference between the two approaches expose this woman as an attention seeker.

I also heartily object to all the people who support this women believing themselves to be some sort of higher thinkers. You are not. I think it is every persons choice to ally themselves to whatever gender (male, female, neutral) they please, but please give a kid to make up his or her own mind....

It wa subtle TPA....

thebestisyettocome I very much think that this woman/these parents are not higher thinkers :)

I think it is every persons choice to ally themselves to whatever gender (male, female, neutral) they please, but please give a kid to make up his or her own mind....

Um, I thought that's what they were trying to do ...?

I remember my parents saying it would be 'wrong' to have a mixed-race marriage because the 'children would be teased'. Things have now changed, thank goodness, and I think this issue is similar.

This is chalk and cheese!

If the child has decided he wanted to be a girl I would be very supportive.

This is nothing to do with the child, it is completely parent driven. The mother must have got him to deliberately dress up for the DM-you can't tell me that he just happened to be dressed like that when they called. It didn't suit the mother to have him looking the typical boy. If he was gender neutral there would be a 50% chance of the DM calling and not knowing what the fuss was about!

I have nothing at all against anything child driven. This was not.

Samandi. I understood it that they decided at birth that the child should be gent neutral.

This shouldn't be a fight.

i think samandi most people have looked at the info in the link, which may be skewed but is all we have without resarching further, and concluded that they encouraged him to dress etc opposite to his sex and forbid him chosing items they disliked / opposed (combats), which is not bringing him up gender neutral / giving him a choice

Haha. Gender neutral, not gent neutral, although in this case, that's what happened.

ParanoidAndroid - ok, it's an excuse and we should all happily send our kids to school without regard for social norms or how they will be treated by their peers. Just because we think they should be able to look and act how they (or we) like. I don't even have kids but even I think that's cruel.