to think this mum is a bit bonkers!!

[Dartfordmummy]

Don't know if there is already a thread on this but am a bit about this story!!

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2089474/Its-boy-Couple-brought-child-gender-neutral-reveal-sex-The-Infant--keeping-secret-FIVE-YEARS.html

Poor Sasha

If you give you kids love and the support to be who they are then they will be

True-and the only statement that matters. My first rule of motherhood is that you accept and support the child that you have and not the one that you want. This is why I recommended Kihlil Gilbran on children in one of my first posts about this-I would particularly recommend

*Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.
You may house their bodies but not their souls,
For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow,
which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.
You may strive to be like them,
but seek not to make them like you.
For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday.*

I think that it ought to be given to all parents at birth-and particularly ones who think they have the right to try social experiments on fellow humans, just because they gave birth to them. They are not a possession.

Love that poem! Excuse my spelling, it's my phone!

It is my favourite Cherries and should be tattooed to some parents foreheads!! Those who think their DC is a blank sheet and have their life planned at birth and those who think that they can even police thoughts. It is utterly weird to me that because I gave birth my DC should have my thoughts on religion, politics, food or anything under the sun! I bring them up to be open to all and know that they will make up their own mind eventually. There are very few, if any, 18yr olds who say 'I think x because my mother thinks it!!

People with younger DCs have no idea how judgemental teenagers are about their early upbringing! I am thankful that although mine might moan about small details they have nothing major to hold against me and nothing that spoils our adult relationship. Sasha's mother will not get away so lightly IMO. Time will tell.

I know a class of 4 yr olds where they have a big bag of Barbies. They are very popular with boys and girls because there are no prissy, controlling parents telling them what they can and can't like!
Probably Sasha would adore Barbies-if he got his hands on one.

I wonder if this would have still happened if Sasha had been a girl? It feels more about the parents not wanting a boy than anything to do with raising a child in a gender neutral way. Especially since they clearly DIDN'T raise a child in GN way at all.

Cherries that's awful about your DD and your friends. I hope you told them what pillocks they were being.

exotic that is a beautiful verse by Khalil Gibran - made my eyes well up!

The thing is most kids don't really get the boy/girl thing till about 4 or 5 anyways! Seems the parents were doing it more for themselves, as clearly it's doing him no favours

The dad is on radio 4 now.

Calling him "the infant" sounds bit cold. Why not "the baby" before he was born and then "Sasha" afterwards?

I wouldn't go out of my way to buy my DS (almost three) a pink frilly fairy costume, but if he asked for one then I wouldn't object to him having it. And he has such a great time at playgroup with the doll in the pushchair that now he has his own pushchair (pink and lilac) and was given the choice of dolls to put in it. He considered them all carefully and eventually chose a penguin dressed in a white science coat (and named him Mr Lopart). He has a Peppa Pig play kitchen in the most repulsive shades of pink. He doesn't know or care that most people would see these things as 'girls toys' and if he's happy, I'm happy.

We bought him a new cup the other day, one of those with a lid and a flip-up straw, to put in his nursery lunch bag. The shop had three colours, blue, pink and purple. DS picked the pink one, then decided he would rather have the purple one. A woman standing near us and watching said "you've picked another girls cup, get the blue one" to him. I just said "it's fine" and we went to pay.

I think it's possible to bring your children up and try to avoid stereotypes without going to the extremes of hiding their gender from the world and calling them "the infant" or putting a cup off limits simply because of the colour.

Sounds like the Ian Rankin book "The Wasps" to me.

So what was the dad like?

What's that about BoffinMum? Can't find it on amazon, you've piqued my interest!

Oh, is it wasp factory or am I thinking of something else?

I did indeed mean Wasp Factory by Iain Banks!

Spoiler

I am sure it has been mentioned, but something that struck me was the well meaning intentions of the parents to introduce their child to a gender neutral environment have fallen by the wayside, mainly because their idea of gender neutrality is wrapped up in their own pre-conceptions of gender and identity.

By fighting to avoid the cliche you become the cliche.

Speaking as a bit of a bloke in a skirt, I agree. It assumes gender specificity is somehow predictable and potentially harmful as well.

I think that is what I have against it antsypants.

Having read the thing again, I realise we have more of a gender neutral house than they do - having several kids of both sexes, we have random toys of all kinds, the kids wear male and female clothes because of the hand me down situation, and they see both parents do all domestic tasks so they copy that model. We certainly expect both genders to push prams and dress up as fairies, and accept that they are going to have battles with broom handles as pretend guns and swords. I am even trying to bring in a gender neutral uniform for our local primary school with a choice of trousers or a kilt for both genders.

I think she is making quite a lot of fuss about this when actually many parents do this quite routinely whilst being afraid to identify their child as biologically gendered.

I think that even if you have one sex of DC they have access to anything. I saw my cousin last weekend. Her DS was in a house of DDs and he was happily pushing a doll around in a pushchair. When they go to playgroups, crèches, friends etc etc no one is segregating the toys or paying the least attention to who plays with what or even giving it a thought.
In comparison she is pushing things onto Sasha and trying to influence. Maybe he would like to sit in a sandpit and chat-boys do too and it isn't boring. Despite the fact that her own parents were not stereotypical she seems determined to do it herself.
I stick to my original thought, she wanted a DD and she likes attention. I think that you can be absolutely sure that if a journalist comes to the house Sasha will not be quietly building a space rocket out of lego wearing denim jeans and a plain blue/brown/green/red Tshirt with trainers.

I imagined "gender neutral" to mean she'd be dressing her child in bold coloured dungarees, like Rod Jane & Freddy, rather than in frilly fru-fru.

Although my own house tends towards bold primary colours or neutrals for the dcs rather than a sea of pink or riot of camouflage and skulls, my feeling on reading this was that she was trying to make her mark through her child which always make me feel slightly uneasy.

It makes me more than slightly uneasy when people expose their DCs to any sort of publicity.

Presumably the child didn't go to any nursery or childcare place - I wonder if one parent worked and one stayed at home? The article implies that the Dad worked, but doesn't say anything about the Mum working.

Nowhere responsible for nappy change or taking to the toilet anyway.

Yes she works: it says so.
'Miss Laxton, a web designer from Sawston, Cambridgeshire...'

I can see the intention behind this. I have DDs and a DS. They are still toddlers but already programmed: girls pink, boys blue, girls princesses, boys knights, girls dolls, boys trucks. Not even 4 and so many possibilities have been shut down in their minds.

However I do think there are less drastic courses to keep their minds open. If I did it again, I would refuse the girl-pink, boy-blue gifts and handdowns that dominated our wardrobe. I would also try harder to avoid expecting/directing them towards certain toys. Peer pressure would probably drive them 90% of the way back. But at least as their parent I can encourage them to follow their heart.