to wonder about having kids after all?

[Anna1976]

I've always said no to the idea of kids. Too hard, too confronting (I had a miserable and crappy upbringing), I have no idea how to do emotional relationships (I have AS and Dp does to some extent too), i can serve the world better by doing well in my career (scientist and medic), kids would mean cutting back on the career to a point that i wonder if I could ever really have a job again (a job that I want, which indicates my level of selfish self-definition by career)...

I'm 35. DP and I agree that marriage comes before kids, and we are not married.

I'm happy with everything. I've just got a promotion at work.

But the bloody biological clock seems to have started, looking at all the schoolfriends' photos of happy kids in the summer holidays, uni friends' photos of Christmas, etc.

Am I mad?
What do I do now?

What do you want in your future?

Not sure really... I felt that way in my early 30's, and by my late 30's I had completely changed my mind, and wanted a baby. Sadly it didnt happen, and now at the age of 42 I am resigned to the fact that it isnt likely to happen either, and if it did, I think I would be terrified as even though I still act and feel as if I am in my early 30's.. I know my body isnt.

I am lucky to have stepchildren, and grandchildren though, so that is something that makes the situation more easy to live with.

How long have you been with your partner? Is marriage on the cards?

35 isnt old, but it isnt young either if you want to get married, then try to conceive.

All I can really say is, the feelings of wanting do come and go.. I console myself with the fact that we can go on holiday when we like, go out when we like.. and have no ties or responsibilities, while our friends with small children do have a lot more restrictions on their life.

I would say look at the reality, rather than the nice fluffy ideas. Of course schoolfriends' photos all look nice - they wouldn't take photos of the kids screaming and whining or any of the crap part do they?

Re broodiness - I understand, but I get 'broody' at puppies, but I don't particularly want to own a dog.

um. perhaps a happier, more fulfilled life than my parents had. according to my definitions of happiness this means better at job and better at getting on with people productively. It doesn't have to mean kids. Obviously I do need to kind of get on with it if i decide i want kids though...

DP would kind of like them but would probably dislike the disruption to his work hours (which are 7 days a week, 16 hours a day). I would resent giving up my career to do all the primary care, which might happen if DP doesn't grow up a bit. But he might grow up. Hard to tell since all discussion of kids has previously been overshadowed by him knowing i didn't htink i could do it...

the above post was @ SparkleSoiree btw
squeakytoy - I understand your point of view.

kitty - i agree about broodiness over puppies. (I quite like dogs too, always wanted one, but don't have one due to potential work disruption)

7 days a week - 16 hours a day? how the hell do you actually have a relationship with each other, never mind have the time to raise a family?

I should also add, I generally prefer animals (dogs specifically) to children. My own stepchildren often reinforced that preference too .

I would honestly say it doesnt sound like you really do want children, you just feel as though you "should" have children.

we share a study, a kitchen and a bedroom...
(he's an academic too)

Agree with squeaky - there is quite a strong societal message that having children is the only way to fulfilment, but I don't think that's true for everyone. Certainly a lot of parents absolutely adore being parents, but some people are better off without children

The main thing with having children is that it is a complete change to your life in that you become a family and for us the 'needs of the family' take priority over everything, friends, family, job, social life, everything really.

We run a engineering business together and have a 5 children between us but it has been hard work and I have had the luxury of being able to stay at home when needed.

OTOH my sister in her mid 30's will never have children I think. She enjoys her high flying career, the freedom and financial security that she receives with that and wouldn't want it any other way. She had a 'wobble' as she calls it a couple of years ago where she felt her clock started ticking but it seems to have gone quiet again.

For my future I want to see my children happy and I would love to be a grandparent and help my children raise their children where I can. I want to be kept busy in my retirement with my family and enjoy all of them.

But that's me. You don't have to have children if you don't want to - it's completely your choice.

It doesn't sound as though you want to have children. It's not the law, you know. Just don't.

yeah. I would sort of like the psychological "flow" of the daily activities actually nurturing someone who might turn out better than me. In which case, logically, I should probably give more time to looking after the homeless and the aged.
Illogically, I'd like to be taking my kids to scouts and little athletics and on family walks in the hills and seeing happy little people tucked up in sleeping bags by the fireplace in a mountain hut after a day's walk together...
I seem to be channelling some 1950s combination of broodiness, the Chalet school and secret crush on Edmund Hillary. Maybe I should take up mountaineering more seriously and forget kids.

I would honestly say get on with work. Do you have nephews/nieces? You can be an amazing aunt, get to do the really fun stuff, and still keep on track in your career.

Please dont think I am being nasty, because I am not. Your posts say to me that you like the idea of a perfect mum scenario, but that the reality would not be compatible with your life and your goals, and your relationship.

I think you are asking the question because you do want to have children.

Doesn't sound veeery realistic tbf

I have stepchildren but don't think I will have children. I know I would feel too much (pointless) pressure for them to do as well as and better than me, and in the same ways. I love making a fuss of children and doing fun things with them (my stepchildren are not really children any more and are pretty independent) but I don't think that's the same thing as wanting to be a parent

Squeaky - i get where you're coming from. Yes, I think I agree with you.

The nephews and niece are getting to the age where I'm cool and interesting for 5 minutes but all the love and affection goes back to their immediate family and grandma and granddad... which is totally how it should be, but it gives me glimpses of what I'm missing out on.

Then again, i also see the glimpses of mess, noise, disruption, zero career prospects, dependency, all the things that put me off kids in the first place.

i probably should class this as a temporary distraction and plan a summer holiday in the alps for me and DP.

I wouldn't get too hung up about abstract (wholly admirable) notions about 'serving the world' when it comes to your reproductive choices. It is an emotional as well as a logical decision.

Is it that you actively want them or feel that you feel you ought to have them? An idle wondering of what might be, rather than a keenly felt desire?

I remember talking to my mum about this, she said that she'd had never really thought about whether she wanted kids or not and that after a few years of marriage it was 'the norm' to start having kids. Although I know she loves me and my sister deeply, I also know that given the choice again or if born in another era, she'd probably have remained child-free and would have had an equally happy and fulfilled life without kids, if not more so.

Do you think you can live a happy and fulfilled life without children? If so, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that, there is no obligation to go into the reproduction business.

In some ways I want to be a parent - to have the task of helping someone to learn how to live life. I'd like to have a family where there was a lot of mutual interest and support.

But all the people saying I don't have a grasp of the reality are kind of right in that I'm ignoring it (I've done enough messy daily care of grumpy people in my life to know the reality and not want to think about it)

Having children really is not the be all and end all. It's not all it's cracked up to be IMO...more worry than I ever imagined.
Concentrate on your career and realtionship.

In some ways I want to be a parent - to have the task of helping someone to learn how to live life.I'd like to have a family where there was a lot of mutual interest and support.

Hugely admirable sentiments, but it seems like you are thinking of children as an extension of your work as a scientist. (I maybe reading way too much into this, so apologies) Please don't think this is a criticism, but it is not the sort of language people use when they are thinking of having children. I have noticed that you've used words like 'mutual interest and support' rather than 'love unconditionally.'

I know some (now very elderly) academics who adopted children as they thought they 'ought' to in the interest of the wider societal good (they were academics and painfully logical and abstract) but just had no emotional attachment to the children.

As a result their now adult children have extremely strained relationship with them and have spent years working through these issues.

OP, you sound rather like me. Had a poor, overcrowded not very happy upbringing - eldest of a large family, so had been changing nappies and making bottles since I could physically manage it etc etc. I got out, swore I would never encumber myself that way, went to university, made an academic career, met a wonderful partner who was equally uninterested in having children, and had a nice life. I've never felt broody, but we did start to discuss children as a possibility as we hit our late thirties, and decided to go for it, while recognising we might have left it too late. Got pregnant first time and our baby is due in the spring.

We are definitely not people who felt a burning need to be parents, and I think we would have gone on being happy together if this baby hadn't happened, but I've loved being pregnant, and while we know our lives will never be the same, we're very happy we decided to do this, and I don't think that not having wanted to make babies since adolescence necessarily makes us any worse parents.

The only thing that concerns me in your post is the extent to which only you would be sacrificing your career if you had a baby - think that one through with your partner, otherwise this will really not work. Good luck.

HardCheese - I'd like to be in your position

composHat - i get where you're coming from. I'm probably not as unemotional and relentlessly academic as I sound, as i'm not very practised at all this nurturing love stuff, even though I'd kind of like to try it. My family background is the sort where there are no public displays of attachment, let alone public displays of affection. But in secret Dp and I are much more lovey-dovey than we would ever admit publically.

BTW - hardCheese - I was doing care for the other end of life. Somewhat less incoherent, incomprehensible screaming; but also somewhat more bitterness and distinctly less cuteness.

Anna, no advice, but you sound lovely

Fair dos Anna!

Should have been more sensitive to that! So apologies.