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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

One of those damned disabled toilet threads.

167 replies

ReindeerBollocks · 30/12/2011 21:45

DS and I used a diabled toilet (well, I didn't but DS did).

DS has CF and although is affected by chest issues also has some considerable difficulties with his dietary and toilet needs. I.e. when he is suffering with a sore tummy and needs the toilet - he needs to go immediately or suffer an accident.

We were out today and despite keeping on top of all current meds and peg feeds, he had another episode. But there was a queue in the femal toilets (DS is 7 and while he normally uses the men's he wanted to use the womens with me as he was in considerable pain). I took him in the disabled toilet instead, thinking that he has a medical need and therefore entitled to us it. Except there was a man waiting with a disabled lady insisting we not use this toilet and wanting management involvement. I explained about DS's condition and that he needed to go but this gentleman was not convinced and thought that as the toilet was designed with wheelchairs in mind, that we should not have used the toilet.

So who was right? I didn't think I was being unreasonable, DS has had accidents before due to his condition, and whilst it's not technically a disability I feel his need does outweigh those of ordinary use and therefore entitled to use the toilet. This isn't my first AIBU thread about toilet use, for that I apologise profusely.

OP posts:
mrsjay · 30/12/2011 22:18

I have mobility problems and i use disabled toilets as they have the hand rails they are bigger so wheelchairs can get it but not specically forwheelchair users . I think some people get confused and ranty about people using them , and alot have the baby change in them now so its really just a toilet , folk shouldnt get sp uppity about it ,

TalkinPeace2 · 30/12/2011 22:18

The RADAR scheme was set up by a v VV close friend
if you (or the person you are caring for) is entitled to DLA they can get a key
they were set up to keep out the interlopers
BUT
any non RADAR toilet cannot be enforced as "disabled"
it is all discretionary
and I have used "disabled" toilets as family - on the basis of 4 of us using the seat and the basin one after the other is a darn sight quicker for all than 4 x cubicles

thepeoplesprincess · 30/12/2011 22:18

They really need to introduce parent-and-child toilets IMO.

Dawndonna · 30/12/2011 22:18

radar-shop.org.uk/Detail.aspx?id=0
Might be useful.
I should also act that they were originally constructed under the Chronically ill and Disabled persons act.
That covers a site more than wheelchair users.

cakeismysaviour · 30/12/2011 22:19

YANBU, I would have simply told him that your son ise disabled too and as a result you will be using the disabled toilet. I would have told him that not all disabilities are as outwardly obvious as others and as the companion of a disabled person I would have thought that he would be more understanding and would know that he shouldn't discriminate against anyone who is disabled.

If that hadn't worked I would have told him to go ahead and tell the manager that he didn't think a disabled child should use the disabled toilet!

As you can probably tell, idiots like him get right on my wick!

LittleMissFlustered · 30/12/2011 22:19

Look at it this way instead:

The loos are not just for wheelchair access. They are for people with a whole range of disabilities, including mobility issues. Therefore they have to be suitable for all to use. Hence the dimensions.

I've had a few rows with radar-key weilding jobsworths about this. I once truly irritated a woman coming out of a radar-loo. I made to take the door, and she deliberately closed it so I couldn't. So I got my key out and smiled beatifically as I opened it again. Se informed me I was too young to have a disability. I told her she was too old to be so stupid as to think disabilities are only bestowed on the elderly. Then I closed the door in her face.

Petty, yes. But very very satisfying...

canyou · 30/12/2011 22:20

YANBU They are for anyone with a 'need'.
We are so fed up of the arguments with customers at work that during the restaurant refurbishment next month we are reducing the number of toilets from 10 to 5 all will be disability accessible and all will have a baby changing facility and be unisex and because we are also fed up of mothers asking for a nursing room Confused we are also having a small room with 2 comfy chairs and a lock on the door. I bet people will still complain Grin

deepandcrispandsevenfold · 30/12/2011 22:21

yanbu to use the disabled toilets as your son has a health need/disability.
they aren't just for WC users but for all people who have a disability.

Dawndonna · 30/12/2011 22:22

Thanks Serenity your sense of entitlement would thrill my dd when she needed to go and wet herself because some able bodied person couldn't be arsed to use the easily accessible lavatories provided by the thousands, unlike accessible ones.
And as pointed out, they are not just there for wheelchair users, but for those that are chronically sick etc. For example, the emptying of ileostomy or colostomy bags. Many people who have them are mobile, but it is difficult to empty, change and clean in a standard lavatory.

Serenitysutton · 30/12/2011 22:23

There is no difference, there is no such thing as "wheel chair accessible" vs "disabled" loos. They are all disabled loos and in this context this means wheelchair accesible, because that is the concession that people with disabilities need. You need somewhere You can use from a wheelchair. You do not NEED a priority loo (which is basically what you're saying) anymore than someone with IBS, or food poisoning.

I'm sorry but unless you are in a wheelchair you don't need a different loo to everyone else.

MsHighwater · 30/12/2011 22:25

As far as I'm concerned, toilets are there to be used. Some are more accessible than others. While it would be inappropriate for someone with no disability to knowingly delay a person who is disabled from using the only toilet they can access, there is no, nor should there be any, embargo on anyone else using it, far less someone who might soil themselves because of urgency.

Serenitysutton · 30/12/2011 22:26

Dawn donna that's ridiculous. It's up to individual businesses if they want to lock their loos and make them radar- it's not up to you to decide who they're for.

thepeoplesprincess · 30/12/2011 22:26

@Dawndonna

I've never known of an able-bodied person using one toilet over another because they "couldn't be arsed"?!. :People use the disabled loos because they need more space than normal loos provide.

cakeismysaviour · 30/12/2011 22:27

My disabled younger brother doesn't always use a wheelchair, but he can't use the standard toilet cubicles.

Serenity - you should learn more about different disabilities before you make sweeping statements that are not correct.

Original poster
ReindeerBollocks · 30/12/2011 22:28

Serenity - I have IBS. DS's nee are significantly higher than mine, I wish I was exaggerating when I say he needs to go, but I'm not. When he says he has stomach ache and he needs the loo we drop and go instantly to the nearest available toilet - otherwise he will soil himself. He is normally able to control himself but when he gets these stomach upsets (medically related) he cannot control himself. His school are very tolerant because of this too.

He gets higher rate DLA (don't normally admit this as I dont need the stigma). His care needs are quite high and his doctors are aware and trying to work through his toiletary needs. However, his creon dosage is already bordering on extreme so they are reluctant to do anymore.

OP posts:
Pixel · 30/12/2011 22:30

Serenity, that's rubbish. Ds can't undo his trousers, can't do them up, can't wipe his own bottom. He can't manage by himself, he's getting too old to go in the ladies and I'm blowed if I'm going in the gents with him. What else do you suggest?
Never mind, we may have to get him a wheelchair soon, that will make all the difference to his toileting needs won't it. Hmm

Op, of course your ds had every right to use the disabled toilet, people who say he shouldn't are being very cruel to a child in pain.

MsHighwater · 30/12/2011 22:31

Serenity, by your reasoning, someone who might soil themselves if they don't get to a toilet right now, has less "right" to use the accessible toilet than an otherwise healthy wheelchair user. I don't accept that.

Think of it this way. If there are 5 standard WC's and one accessible WC and there is a queue, if the people in the queue use all the WC's including the accessible one, the queue will go down more quickly than if everyone sanctimoniously avoids using the accessible WC. If I were in the queue and a wheelchair user came along, I would happily allow the wheelchair user to go ahead to use the only one accessible to them. I would do the same for anyone else who seemed to be in urgent need.

deepandcrispandsevenfold · 30/12/2011 22:31

sadly as we have mums of sleeping babies(what would happen if sleeping baby is left in pram outside normal toilet ffs) using disabled toilets, no doubt people with an urgent need are going to have to waif for mummyofpfb to come out.

Original poster
ReindeerBollocks · 30/12/2011 22:33

Serenity - point was this sign said disabled toilet not a wheelchair sign.

Which is why I argued the point (although not too strongly as I actually didn't want to upset this gentlemans wife).

I am utterly confused and a bit upset as I never try to offend people with disabilities. I don't think I'm an over entitled sort, well until today.

It's not a normal child needing a toilet issue - for whomever mentioned there should be child toilets. It's completely separate to children of DS's age who are able to control their bowel functions (as they should at his age-but please let's not delve there too much as I don't want to discuss what DS can and cannot do, I'm upset enough already).

OP posts:
OnemorningXmasCockMonkey · 30/12/2011 22:35

Serenity, that's absolute bollocks. As made clear above, many people with disabilities don't use a wheelchair, but have other needs (e.g. continence or mobility) that means that they can't use the standard loos.

YuleingFanjo · 30/12/2011 22:35

this is why no one should ever question anyone who decides to use a disabled toilet.

Dawndonna · 30/12/2011 22:36

Having stood outside many a disabled loo with my dd, trust me, there are many, many able bodied people who use them because they can't be arsed to queue. I'm not talking about people with unseen disabilities, I'm really talking about people who can't be arsed.

Serenitysutton · 30/12/2011 22:37

All loos are not busy all the time. I have no idea where you all go where loos are constantly busy. You can talk all you like about how x y z are going to shit themselves but that doesn't entitle them to use a disabled loo. If you were sure of that you wouldn't ask.

Serenitysutton · 30/12/2011 22:40

Onemorning says who? The company I work for design disabled loos for wheelchair users. Who are you to say they're for anyone with a need? Where would that end? Broke my leg, I have a need? Just given birth, I have a need?

cakeismysaviour · 30/12/2011 22:43

Serenity I'm not asking, I'm telling you that some people do not neccessarily need to use a wheelchair but as they are completely unable to use the standard toilet facilities, they must use the disabled toilet facilities.

My younger brother is an example of this, as he doesn't use a wheelchair all the time but he simply cannot use stadard toilet cubicles. If you don't understand that, than you need to educate yourself about the range of disabilities that people have.