to be just a bit annoyed with the lentil weavers?

[buggerybollocks]

Now I'll admit to being a little bit of a LW but I spotted a poor woman on a forum being blasted for asking for advice about sleep training. It was suggested that she just put up with the chronic lack of sleep she was experiencing and that it was all natural and any kind of sleep training would cause brain damage and blah blah blah.....

Ooh I'm just a bit cross with them and their high and mighty, moral high ground co sleeping, organic breast feeding selves.

Going to pour myself another glass of wine and calm down....

Regarding the PFB/standards slipping with subsequent children thing, I think that is probably a very telling test as to WHY someone does the things they do.

If a first child is evangelically AP/EC/babyworn/BLW/clothbummed/natural birthed/insert other acronyms/names as required, and subsequent children are not, then it probably means that the parent was doing these things as a project rather than because they worked best for the family.

If any or all of these things continue with subsequent children then it probably means that they just work for that family.

There are some things that I did partially or half-heartedly with DS, or that I came to late, that I am probably going to do from the start with this next baby because I have figured out that they work and will be useful. I'm not even trying a pram this time, for example. I will be using cloth nappies/wipes right from the start. I am hoping exclusive BFing works out, rather than having to factor in bottles/sterilising etc. There were some classes/activities we tried when DS was small that I won't be bothering with because I reached the conclusion that they were poncy nonsense.

I think you have to be ready to let your parenting evolve and accept that not everything you did the first time is necessarily right for you, never mind criticising other people for the things they are doing.

I was a bit lentil-weaverish with DS but will probably be quite a bit more with another DC, should I have one.

That's just me though, horses for courses and all that.

i have been on the other end and been told by gf followers what i am dong is wrong and that my choice is lazy parenting and my son will be clingy and needy

but i was confident enough to feel i was making the right decisions, the problem is at times we take it all a little too personally. beign told i am a lazy parent is an insult but to me these routines go against my instincts and this is what we do not listen to anymore as we are bombared with information all of which is apparently the right way

i do not like cc at all (especially for babies under one) but others think it is great and if they are happy with that what does it really matter what i think

Someone needs to write The Lazy Parent Guide or some such so all the sensible, moderate people have their own gospel to believe in. Sadly it's only those with Extreme Agendas who seem to be motivated to push them.

Couldn't give a stuff what other people do provide it's not actively abusive to a child (as in beating / starving).

Just don't judge how I raise MY child.

Met some women when I had DS. Totally different views on slings, co-sleeping, extended BF etc. I listened politely for the first few meet ups. At the 4th I was told I was 'abusing' my child by going back to work at 6 months and leaving him in DH's capable hands. Abusing. When I asked why I was told because he'd have to have FORMULA in the day and how was I going to go to baby classes?

Much happier now I don't see them :-)

Adele, 'so what suits you best' only applies if what you do is what everyone else does it would seem :)

AFAIAC mcdonalds, fruit shoots and sausage rolls are not 'ok', neither is crappy tv with advertisements (completely with you there Adele!) and I'm quite happy to raise my children without those things. Of course those of you who think you are 'better parents' because you don't feel that way about those things will think differently but I personally don't think you are a better parent than me because you allow those things.

Who is the perfect standard of parent that we are all supposed to aspire to be anyway? It really is a load of nonsense.

HD, bit presumptuous of her anyway - I know plenty of people who went back to work FT and expressed. Their babies didn't have to have formula at all. Don't see the big deal about baby classes either tbh. More for mums than babies imo!

Let's see-
Hospital birth/home birth - hospital birth, thank you very much!
BF/FF - BF for nine months (also expressing so the OH can do some feeds with bottles)
Carrier - I am a ring sling person, but OH prefers the Moby wrap (he thinks it looks more manly).
Prams - Hell yes!
Nappies - Cloth nappies all the way, if for no other reason than they are significantly less expensive in the long run. Also they are super cute.
Co sleeping - In a bed-side cot for the "fourth trimester" (first 3 months), then in their own cot in the corner of our room for another 3, and then moved into their own room.
Weaning - Baby led (it's the only thing that makes sense to me)
Scratch cook - Yes, but I have always been one.
SAHM/WOoHM - Back to work after 9 months because I wanted to go.

I don't care if this makes me a lentil weaver or not. I make the choices I do and will because they work best for me, they make the most sense to me and they make me and my family the most happy. If other people choose differently, that's fine. If other people judge me because I made a different choice, well the only person bothered about that is them. Sod 'em.

Bumbleymummy....WHO on this thread has claimed they are a better parent because they feed their kids sausage rolls and fruit shoots?
No-one has said anything of the sort, so who are you defending yourself against?
Genuine ask.

You know what gets my goat? My SIL is completely alternative (DC now 13 and 8yr old twins), thinks she's an artist yet has never sold a picture, very alternative partner, doesn't believe in make-up or nice clothes because she's a feminist and women shouldn't be judged on their looks etc., breastfed twins until they were two, only believes in natural remedies, vegetarian, always broke because they don't work, always complains about lack of money, always criticises everyone and anyone else whose values might be different to her own, her dc are out of control because she believes in self discovery.

I have been called vain, a capitalist, hedonistic, extravagant and she told me not to marry dh because he was a capitalist bastard - the same one who sends her bank transfers for a couple of grand here and there and she might manage a thank you three months later.

Nobody, but nobody is allowed to criticise her or anybody else who lives a similar way of life. I, on the other hand, good life, nice things, work very hard as does dh, well mannered children can be the butt of snide comments all round. Not once has a single member of her family told her to belt up and get a job and get on with it like everyone else. But they are very happy to slip in a few "you don't know how privileged you are" to me.

some people are just martyrs to their babies they will say they are not but they are , Im not saying babies need to be locked down into a strict routine , but ive seen posts from tired almost hillucinating mummies becuase they had read letting Babies cry for a nano second causes brain damage , My babies are alot older so we didnt have Phrases for bringing up children , you just did it , I guess some people dont know how to put across a point in a fair way and their way is the right way because its called something fancy ,attachment parenting or whatever , FYI letting babies cry for a nan second does not cause brain damage ,

I think the problem is when ANYONE is sanctimonious about their parenting method being the RIGHT one. It's a total slating to anyone who's not doing whatever it is.

Surely 99.9% of us are doing the Best We Can for our DC's? And are Good Enough mothers and fathers?

Problem comes with the judgements. And I've seen and heard a lot more judgement from LW's than anyone else unfortunately. That doesn't mean all LW's are smug and sanctimonious...but it makes it a damned site harder for the majority of Mixed Parenting 'Method' parents when their choices are aggressively slated.

I agree with HorribleDay. Except I do think it works both ways - I've heard just as many sneery comments from the non-LWs, directed towards anyone who parents differently. In fact, the opposite of LW, whatever that is - The Fruit Shooters? - seem to be very defensive ime.

It's all very silly

I agree that it def works both ways - when they accused me of abusing my child by going back to work, I didn't come out with any of the old SAHM cliches but can absolutely see how some do in defense and vice versa.

I did say Good Day and Goodbye To You, but using the words Nasty, Fuck, Judgemental, Off and Bitches. I've not been invited back, and it was 2 days after MIL died, and after 35 minutes of non-arguments about how damaged my DS would be. I don't normally tell people to fuck off!

YANBU.

What annoys me most is the lentil weaver's pretence that science is on their side - for some reason the ones I know think it is acceptable to tell lies about controlled crying - insisting that it causes brain damage etc.

That is an utterly nasty thing to do. It is usually directed at mothers who are at the end of their tether, struggling to cope.

Of course absolutely everyone is defensive about their parenting style, it feels like the most important thing we've ever done (and quite possibly is), and it's impossible not to mess it up on a regular basis.

I'm 'a bit woo' in some ways, but what I slightly resent, is that no-one ever tells you that if you do go down the no-routine, baby-wearing, co-sleeping route, THERE IS NO WAY YOUR CHILD WILL SLEEP THROUGH THE NIGHT UNTIL THEY'RE AT LEAST TWO! Fine, if you think that all the suffering is worth it, but you should go into it with your eyes open. With my PFB I really believed that he would naturally grow out of waking to bf every two hours throughout the night. Until the horrible realisation gradually dawned that he would be waking every two hours for YEARS unless I did something.

And another thing, please listen carefully: sleep training does not necessarily mean controlled crying or 'cry it out'. There are other better methods (baby whisperer worked a dream for me).

once the child gets to 5 no-one gives a stuff it seems as these parenting stereotypes never seem interested in older children

Well said Southeastastra.

BTW mine had the odd fruit shoot, controlled crying, formula, tinned baby food, occasionally dd was put in her cot and the door shut so I could read ds a story. (The were both awful sleepers because of ears. cracked it with dd at 21 months after grommets - ds never slept more than 10-6).

Funny how at 13 and 17 they are tall, fit, strong, bright, well mannered, generally helpful, a bit lippy like most teenagers but not big problems, always behaved well at school - I have never ever had school on the phone - over bad behaviour or poor work.

what southeastastra said nobody gives a stuff once a child gets to school age and TBH nobody knows if a 5 year old has co slept or slept in a cot from birth , Nobody knows how they are parented at home unless of course there is neglect at home but in general nobody can tell ,

My brother was formula fed from birth (mum said he wasn't very good at latching on). Oddly enough, he's got a PhD in Physics so can't have done him much harm...

Flimflammery - that's not necessarily true.

My semi-co-sleeping, no-routine, slung baby slept through from just after 6 weeks.

Mine sleeps through too. Fingers crossed touch wood. Most sleep is down to personality, they're individuals. I was heavily routined as a child, sleep trained etc, still a truly crap sleeper at 30. DH had a far more laid back upbringing and falls asleep in seconds, no matter what noise is around...annoyingly!

What makes one a LW then? as maybe one.

Hospital birth/home birth - 2 hospital/1 home
BF/FF - BF *FF DD1/BF&FF DD2/ BF DD3 until she was lazymum
Carrier - couldnt get to grips with slings like pram as fashion accessory
Prams - as above
Nappies - dabled with them too hard work
Co sleeping - yes
Weaning - Never heard of BLW intil DD3 and she hardly ate anything til she gave up BF
SAHM/WOHM - Yes DD1/DD2, no DD3

Hah ok then, what's the opposite of LW? Not that DD ever gets fruit shoots or greggs, but there's got to be a middle ground! How about the JDOBs? Just doing our best?

For the record -
Hospital birth/home birth : Will be 2 - nil in February! EMCS first time, and quite probably again this time as baby is too low.
BF/FF - Couldn't manage to get DD latched on :( so expressed for a month then FF.
Carrier - Nope.
Prams - Yup.
Nappies - Sainsbos own.
Co sleeping - Never. In a moses basket until we worked out she preferred her own room at 3 months.
Weaning - I guess baby led!
Scratch cook - Yup, my personal preference anyway. Never worried about organic.
SAHM/WOoHM -SAHM but starting own business.
Sleep training - Some, when needed but not really CIO or CC. Just to help her learn to sleep on her own! Maybe we were lucky tho, DD went 7 - 7 at about 4 months.