a lot of churches are unfriendly and christianity can be hypocritical

[boglach]

My ds carol service today. i took my 2 year old dd. she didn't sit perfectly still no, but neither was she loud or badly behaved. i was getting dirty looks.

now excuse me but i was under the impression that jesus was supposed to have loved children and that churches should welcome families?

also when i was younger i tried to find god. i went to a couple of churches which were most exclusive and unfriendly so i rapidly lost faith.

sometimes christianity feels like another clique. if your face fits then fine.

What a pile of tosh

Personally, I wouldn't take a little one to a traditional carol service. But most churches with children in them have a crib service, as well as the nativity service. These are appropriate services for children.

A lot of people who go to church once a year are at a carol service. These are the kind of people who have a particularly formal view of church (eg by wearing Sunday best, and expecting best behaviour).

If this was a school carol service, the congregation was not church family, and so not representative of the church - the criticism should be at the school body rather than the church.

As I get increasingly cantankerous in my old age, I have less tolerance for badly behaved parents. I don't have a problem with their little ones being restless, but how their parents deal with this can get to me. Some parents make their little one the centre of attention, others do nothing, and yet others do too much. It can be hard to get right, especially all of the time.

Whatever a church tries to do to include little ones in worship is going to offend or displease someone. If you include them fully, they are going to be noisy and restless. If you offer a creche or Sunday school, then they are not fully welcome. Or even if you invite them to sit at the back.

And it becomes even more of a minefield when people interpret other people's looks.

If you find a church that is unfriendly and unwelcoming, then that church has a problem, I don't know anyone who >wants< their church to be perceived as unwelcoming. Perhaps the current generation of parishioners are just not aware of how unwelcoming it feels to someone coming in from the outside.

Perhaps the solution is to talk to the vicar of the church and help them think of ways they could be more welcoming. Can you get involved and help make these things happen? Can you be the catalyst that changes the church from unwelcoming to welcoming?

Actually, rereading the OP, you do sound as if you were a bit uncomfortable anyway, are you sure you didn't misread peoples looks?

(I know it is possible to have dirty looks from people when you have any small child so I don't disbelieve you, but I also know how easy it is to misinterpret other people's looks when you are feeling self conscious and have a toddler in tow).

however it sounds that you possibly are not ready

Sounds to me like the OP is actually past the phase of needing the church and can get on with her life perfectly well without it

But for those people who do have some need which the church ought to be able to help - take note from 3inaNest and others of her gracious ilk - don't make excuses, don't come out with that lame 'oh they aren't real christians' line.

Can I just put in a positive elderly Christian to the discussions

While I agree that most trad Book of Common Prayer services are dying slowly (only 4 turn up here once a month at 8am) some grow, in Dorset the mid week service doubled in size and healings were not unknown.

There are the elderly who will tap children with their walking sticks, but they too are dying or dead.

BUT my Granny, aged 94 told me the best service she ever went to had a teenage boy preach (do the talk) and the rest of the youth group lead the service and play in the band, drums and all.

Not suprisingly, with her attitude, 2 of her three children are Christians, 5 of her 6 grandchildren and 8 of her 9 great-grandchildren.

YANBU to feel upset that people were frowning about your dc being restless in a school carol service. If it felt unfriendly to you, then IMO it was unfriendly and I am sure you are capable of distinguishing unfriendly looks from neutral or friendly ones.

Will you go again next year?

I agree with you OP and I am a Christian.
There is at lot of complacency, false teaching and smoke and mirrors in much of organised religion.

Well my church isn't like that at all. Our vicar is MAD ( in a good way). All the kids get high fives and one sermon included him 'flying' ds round the church and the blessing was done sat at the alter with my neice on his knee ( they wouldn't leave him alone). There is a lady who brings toys and plays with them. At first we tried to shhhhh them but everyone said to leave them to it lol. Maybe it's coz you only go once a year?

I went to a lovely church for many years. It was very family friendly.
However at Christmas we would get lots of visitors, always welcomed warmly, who only came for the Carols.

Many would spend the whole service giving evils to any children who dared move and moaning about all the God bits inbetween the songs.

They wanted church to be like it was on the telly and in Dickens and kids laughing and being jolly didnt fit

Our school carol service was moved into the school because of the bad weather.

Apparently the HT stood up and shouted "Remove that child!" pointing dramatically to a woman with a noisy toddler. I wish I'd seen it. DH thought it was hilarious.

Talk about hypocritical. My sis is a Catholic and yet is trying very hard to make me come back that she is disparaging the Ch of S but implying that I am the one disparaging her Catholic church.
Hypocritical to try to imply that one is better than the other, surely that is just not christian??

Sorry for hijack would put on my own thread but fearful of her finding it, thought some on here would understand

olibean where is your church?! Can I come