To think that many sahms don't consider the long-term implications when deciding to give up work? ***this is not a sahm vs wohm debate***

[wannaBe]

This is not a thread criticizing anyone or their decisions...

When I decided to give up work to bring up DS, I did so in the knowledge that for me, staying at home with my dc was the best thing. We were fortunate as well in that financially we could afford for me to stay at home.

Back then, I had in mind that we would have two children, so realistically would have at least eight years at home until the youngest started school, and even then, going back to work wouldn't necessarily be something I would consider as would want to be there for after school/holidays etc, and finding a job that fits in with the above is almost impossible.

So, fast forward nine years and the two children we'd planned to have turned out to only be one, and I've been a sahm for that long, although I have done volunteering in that time (reading/helping in school/chair of governors/PTA etc...) so haven't been sat on my arse as such (although the amount of time I've spent on mn does contradict that statement somewhat, )

Now I'm in a position where I want to go back to work. Actually, I've been in that position for about the past 1.5/2 years but due to circumstances such as moving areas etc have only just been able to start exploring the possibility seriously.

And I've come to a realization which, although I guess I knew deep down, I never contemplated until now. Even if you take the fact that there are very few jobs for far too many applicants in the current climate, the one thing that employers seem to want above anything else is experience, and current experience at that.

And if you haven't worked for a number of years then the reality is that they will take the person who has worked more recently, every time. And as employers currently have the pick of applicants (regardless of who you are) the chances of getting a job in the current climate if you've been bringing up your children for the past however many years is minimal.

So what I've basically realized is that being a sahm has made me unemployable.

I don't regret my decision for a second. You can't ever get that time with your children again and I'm glad that I had that opportunity and took it.

But in retrospect I do wonder whether I should have sought even a part time work opportunity sooner - even if it was something minimal.

And equally I realize that you can't tell someone who is just choosing to give up work to be with their children that they may find that they're unemployable ten years down the line when the kids are at school and they want to go back to work again without seeming like you're criticizing their decision/lifestyle.

When we make decisions we often do so in the here and now, not necessarily with the future in mind - not for ourselves anyway.

I think employmentwise anyone who is currently out of work for any reason has it extremely hard anyway.

The thought of never working again for the next 30 years is frankly rather depressing...

You may not see part time jobs advertised very much, but they exist. Often through word-of-mouth and networking.

I completely understand what you mean, I am in the same boat myself now. I don't ever regret being a SAHM, particularly because I was diagnosed with cancer before I had my kids and so wasn't sure I would even be around to see them grow up so I wanted to make the most of my time with them.

I think that as long as any decisions made are the right ones for you at that particular time then that's the important thing to remember. No-one can ever predict the future.

But Cointreau that's the point - if you're out of the loop and haven't been working for 5 years you don't generally have that word-of-mouth and networking.

Devil's Advocat here, with my employer's head on. A short career break of about a year to raise kids is generally not going to harm your career. Any longer than that and it is seen as a luxury. Faffing about at home with the PTA/doing a watercolour course/caring for a multitude of ill relatives does not really give an employer an indicator of your reliability and workhorse attitude.
They want to know a) will you turn up every day (probably not cos you've got kids) and b) will you work your arse off (no evidence while you aren't at work, and a baby waking you up every 10 minutes till you are dying of exhaustion doesn't count).
I'm not saying which is best, each to their own. Only that your general unemployability will become a factor down the line.
Do what you want, but don't moan about the consequences.

Gay I wish you had been Devil's Advocaat, v Christmassy

YANBU but this kind of thread makes me (not directed at you OP). I was forced into being a SAHM by being made redundant while pregnant and haven't managed to get another job for the past two years. I actually went to interviews with a bump (wasn't offered the jobs... funny that) and have had loads of interviews over the past year and a bit since I started looking seriously again. Even though I get shortlisted for almost everything I apply for, having been out of the loop for two years and having two young children makes me less attractive to employers... I feel quite depressed about seemingly being unemployable. I also can't afford to retrain (cost of course plus cost of childcare )

Interesting post OP.

When I became a SAHM 6 years ago my DH and I were peers (we met at work) earning almost exactly the same amount. He's had a couple of promotions since then, and I know that if I tried to go back to work now I wouldn't be earning anything like as much (leaving aside the fact that I'd like to work PT). I did realise this in theory when I made my decision, but it just seemed so far in the future back then. Now it feels very real!

I really hope I'll be able to return to work when my youngest starts school in a couple of years. I won't care about earning a lot less than I used to. I have tried to keep my eye in by doing paid assignment marking in my field in the evenings since I stopped work, so hopefully that will help. I do feel nervous about it though. The good thing is that we are used to me earning nothing, so anything I can bring in will be a plus.

However, I love being a SAHM and I honestly wouldn't have given up the last few years at home with my children for anything.

It's great that women have more choice these days about whether or not to return to work, but it doesn't make it any easier to make the choice, does it?

My profession isn't forward thinking (law), neither is my firm (all male partners , in a small northern town)

I was the first to negotiate part time. Someone has to be.

My point is that my negotiating power was alot better as a full time employee - I had just been promoted, was making them x a year. I knew how the firm worked and how I could do my job on less hours. I had the legal right to request flexible working as I had been there for more than 26 weeks. They could only turn me down for legitimate business reasons.

Contrast me applying for a full time job after 4 years at home. My CV has a big gap, I am out of date. I ask for school hours. I have no legal right to ask. I wouldn't stand a chance of getting the job.

Have you considered posting this in the feminism/women's right section?

These issues are discussed fairly often over there. without getting into a wohmvssahm bunfight.

If you are looking for a career rather than a job then a degree is the best place to start. If you have a school aged child you shouldn't need extra childcare.

I think you are right and I consider myself to be in that category. I'm newly self employed and hoping that my career break won't disadvantage me too much, I would find it difficult to gain employment in the current economic climate.

I gave up work because the child care costs were more than my combined salary and commuting costs - I don't know what the answer is to that issue and because of pressure from relatives. Being a SAHM wasn't what I had planned, it just seemed to be practical at the time.

"Faffing about at home with the PTA/doing a watercolour course/caring for a multitude of ill relatives does not really give an employer an indicator of your reliability and workhorse attitude."

I think lumping caring for disabled and ill relatives (whether elderly or children) in with doing a watercolour course is a bit disrespectful to the thousands of carers who save this country millions in care costs each year. Have you any idea how much work is involved in caring for the seriously disabled? How relentless it is? How reliable and organised you have to be?

I am not a carer by the way but I find your attitude horrendous.

My husband and I always agreed that one of us would be a stay at home parent. We both strongly believe that in the very early years, our children should be parented by us and not a child minder. (DH had terrible child minders growing up, which I think creates an emotional response to it).

I have always out-earned my husband and was fantastically ambitious so we assumed it was me that would be the breadwinner. But my current employer has burned me out completely. My Gp wants to sign me off with stress, we want to start a family soon but my job has such a profoundly negative effect on me, it seems impossible.

Now my husband has re-trained in a new career and is self-employed, and I pay the rent, bills, food etc. I'm more than happy to support him. When he's built up his client base, he wants to start a family with me as a SAHM. Honestly, when he suggested it, I could have cried with relief. Not because of how destructive stress is (because I could always leave, right?) but also because - I felt like someone had finely given me permission to want that, if that makes sense? I feel like women now - I want to say of our generation but there's such a range of ages here! - tie themselves up in knots somehow marrying up what they think they should be, what they might want to be and what they expect themselves to be. I also felt like I had to so much to prove to myself, and now I just couldn't care less - though maybe that's the lack of perspective from the stress.

I haven't fully decided yet but one possibility is to - upon return - ask to solely work from home with condensed hours. My husband doesn't generally see clients until lunchtime onwards so I think I could condense my hours into 12-6 Mon-Fri. I hardly work with anyone in my building - it's all remote projects with international teams. I've never actually met anyone I work with - it's all web meetings and conference calls. In all honesty, I'd not be working my full hours. I know that sounds dreadful but if you could know what my company has put me through - the exploitation, the complete lack of care, piling on more and more work, all the examples of being demoralised and over-looked - I don't know...let's just say, I no longer have the same work ethic I had for them. I have - had? - a very strong work ethic where I bent over backwards to get things done to a high standard but they've taken and taken and taken, and left me a quivering wreck. Quite literally some days. I would only hang onto my job for my pension (as my husband doesn't have one) and I would only accept remote working conditions.

I know this sounds dreadful but I no longer care. They have exploited me for long enough and maybe it's time I looked after myself. I guess I mean marking parts of my day out for non-descript "meetings" or "projects".

I don't worry so much about being out of my industry for long - I'm kind of lucky in that my career spills over into my personal life in terms of interests, so I'm not concerned about being left behind. And I have a couple of freelance clients that can grow into a little consultancy. I'm more concerned for the general long-term future because I don't really get pension, which sounds rubbish I know - one of the pitfalls of having parents that work in financial services I guess.

working the reality is that employers will not differentiate what you've been doing with your time if it isn't work related.

That may not be fair, but it is fact.

Gay40 that is very much "I wouldn't start from here" and not much use to the women on this thread, who find themselves unable to secure work. There are all kinds of stories as to why we became SAHM on this thread, mostly it is not a simple choice and caring obligations are just that.

What do you think that we should do? Temping has been suggested above, but even that is not so easy to come by in the current climate.

I agree.
i had no choice but to stay at home - long story- and then was stuck.
Luckily was able to retrain and go back to work, in a competely different field. Am paid a fracture of what I would have had if I'd stayed in employement.

i gave up full time employment in 2006. we relocated as a family to a different area but i was ready to become a sahm for a while. i worked in the field of textile design, so after being at home for a year, began working freelance. it fits in around the kids as i tend to mostly work evenings, but is enough to fill the potential gap in my cv. i've been very lucky with it, i started writing an online craft blog which has brought opportunities my way and after being approached by a publisher, wrote a book.

because i work within the arts, really hope what i do wouldn't be just considered as 'faffing about'!!

fraction
and again

Yes well GAY40, in undertaking the easy role as SAHM, I have enabled DP to A) turn up everyday B) work his star off oh and C) generate alot of wealth for an architectural company that is owned by a very rich old man. I didn't plan for my SAHM role to assist with option C!

DixieChick1975 I think you make a really good point. It is far easier to negotiate part time when you are in a job and have proved yourself. In my case that has hampered my career progression but has allowed me to stay in the race so to speak so that I can re focus when the children get older.

I am at the poster who mentioned friends working as dinnerladies and in starbucks when they have a university education and experience.

I've always worked pt, even when caring for severely brain damaged ds1, as I knew that in my job (law), it would be professional suicide to get off the track for more than 6 months at a time.

It wasn't easy but was the right decision in the end.

I don't think is trying to take anything away from SAHM'ers who also have/have had caring responsibilities. People take themselves out of the (paid) workforce for many reasons, we all know that and sympathise with it

She is stating the perspective of the employers (in general), and it may not be sugar-coated but it is the truth, and if you try to gloss over it or think it won't apply to you, then you are kidding yourself

it's a hellhole out there !

'arse off' not 'star'.

Hear hear AF.

Great Christmas name btw. In fact, your name was made for Christmas - so many options..!

I was talking about gay40 in my last post

"working the reality is that employers will not differentiate what you've been doing with your time if it isn't work related.

That may not be fair, but it is fact."

Yes, but should it not be challenged? Gay has said that they are speaking as an employer. Is thinking inside an incredibly tiny box the best way for employers to find the best calibre employee to suit their own purpose? I think this attitude is widespread and accepted by a lot of unimaginative, ignorant employers with limited grasp of the reality of what is really meant by "reliability" and "workhorse attitude".