to feel cheated and lied to?

[mhmhhhhho]

"They" told me that if I grew up, worked hard, became a loyal employee, did the right things, stayed the right side of the law, treated people well... I'd reap the rewards of it all in life.

So I went to uni, did my years there, got into the minimum amount of debt I could manage whilst working part-time in crappy night-time NMW jobs, got myself a job in a sector which means I'm just paying only a tiny bit of the student debt off each month (because I don't earn enough).

DH and I have no hope of getting the deposit together for our own flat (don't even think of a house). We rent, and despite both of us working fulltime (him on NMW) there's barely enough to make ends meet at the end of every month after bills, tax, commuting costs.

Don't even think about having DCs - I joined thinking it might be a nice idea in the future, but childcare would wipe out my salary, leaving us to rely on DH's NMW and tax credits (which are being targetted for reduction by the government).

Am I the only person in their early thirties that feels utterly fucked off with their current situation, that they've done all the "right" things in life, but basically can't ever see the light at the end of the tunnel where things become comfortable? That's all I'm really asking for really - not rich, just comfortable, where we could think about being able to afford our own home, maybe 1 or 2 DCs, and perhaps have an occasional treat.

Am I the only one of my generation that feels cheated by society, that says if you are a good person and do the right things, you'll get rewarded for it? nonsense! life seems to get harder!

Theoretical question really - I'm not about to jack in my job or anything - but I was mulling over the idea my mother told me when I was younger, about how if you work hard, you'll be comfortable (in a way we never were - parent illness meaning couldn't work - not a benefit bashing thread).

I think the key is that our generation will never retire, we'll be worked into the ground and die while still working so it becomes irrelevant what happens after retiral.

Very good point Minus, but too.

Can you tell I am resigned to never having a life.

To all the people who are saying that OP should have planned a career with money in mind - a lot of low-paid jobs are essential things that we all want done (cleaning, caring, nursing - the list goes on and on and on). I don't think it's remotely unreasonable for people to want to be able to do a job that's essential to society and aspire to being comfortable, because we'd all be pretty stuffed if people stopped doing those things and went off to be marketing executives (no offence to any marketing execs on this thread, just a random example).

Cost of housing is absolutely key to that, because it's really hard to have a decent life if you can't afford to buy and your tenure is really insecure: it's unbelievable that we've got to a place where a couple both in full-time work can't afford a modest place to live. CustardCake made the point really well above.

But people never USED to have long retirements either. We live longer now, it is therefore reasonable that we work longer. It is not economically viable to work 40 years, be retired for 20 and still maintain the same standard of living all that time. As other posters have already stated - our parents and maybe gps are the only people in history to do this.

For MOST people I should add.

I agree with portofino and its those generations who are screaming out that there should be no governmental reforms to institutions that will aide their lengthy retirements despite it leaving their children and grandchildren broke and working themselves into their graves.

Yes I am bitter and resentful over this :o

I think another thing is about planning. I did plan and I did have a career for 10 years. Then life through me a curve ball. Add on top of that the economic climate there are many people who made plans at 17/18 based on the information they had available to them at the time that now find their plans in tatters despite lots of hard work.

Work til you die, or have be reliant on the mercy of your children was how it ALWAYS used to be - apart from the last 60 years. Aspirational tv and baby boomer parents/GPs have a LOT to do with our view on this. We now seem to expect 20 - 30 years of tending our allotment or going on cruises or moving to Spain for the winter.

Anthropologically speaking, GPs are useful to us humans as they tend to look after the kids whilst the young adults work. Not anymore - God forbid! (at least going on recent threads)

I think times change. They have always changed, and always will. None of us have been cheated out of anything, this is just how it is now. It will be increasingly important to get ourselves into a position where we are happy to keep working, so either in a job we love or with a portfolio of skills we can use to support ourselves.

I agree that times are hard for a lot of people who are squeezed by lack of affordable property, lack of job opportunities, high cost of living. It is worrying that people of the current generation do not have any prospects of the lifestyle their parents took for granted.

My parents lived quite comfortably on my father's middle management salary and owned a 4 bedroom house with a large garden....fast forward to us now, both working with good jobs in a 2 up 2 down cottage and no chance of upgrading.

I was made redundant last year and it took 8 months to find another job. Despite treating job-hunting as a full time job in itself, having good work experience and qualifications, it took that long to get into employment again. The experience was soul-destroying at the time. I found a job eventually but it certainly does not affect my qualification level. The fact is that times are very tough for many many people and some of the comments on here 'be grateful for what you've got' 'do something about your situation' to those who just want a modicum of comfort and security, could be construed as ( I don't say that they are intended to be) offensive.

You are right lifehope they are offensive. We are working very hard to improve things but have ended up homeless. We would literally be on the streets if my mum hadn't taken us in. It is incredibly cramped and stressful and I can't see anything improving. TBH if we get any replies to job searches in the next 6 months I will faint with shock. I had taken a break from job hunting to have another baby but then my DH was made redundant.

I am starting again on the job hunt on New years day when dd 2 will be about 3/4weeks roughly. So far DH has had one interview then nothing. I cannot see us having a home rented or otherwise ever, if something happened to my mum then we couldn't pay for the upkeep here so we will at some point be on the street. I don't think its unreasonable to feel down about that and I really don't think we are the only ones who are in such a bad situation.

I think jobs were MUCH easier to come by in the 50/60/70s and people didn.t have so much higher expectations of housing. When I was 4, I lived in my GPS 3 bed council house, with my parents, 2 GPS, 2 aunts, my dsis and my cousin. I doubt this would be allowed under current housing rules. My mum and dad's first house had an outside loo and no bathroom. Ditto.

I am not saying that we should go back to those times, but I lived that life and as an adult I don't consider myself deprived and actually had a HAPPY childhood - despite my mum dying. I see so many posts with people getting angst over xmas presents and at the same time not wanting their family near them at any point.

So many things have gone wrong. Sheer Materialism. Property as a way to make money as opposed to somewhere to live. Housing is far too expensive as a result. Bloody advertising. I recently gpt access to British TV after many years without. In Belgium adverts are mainly for healthy yoghurts and pasta sauces, shampoo and your local internet provider. I notice that even the itv programmes are sponsored by interest free SOFAS!

Job were definitely easier to come by in the past. My Dad used to tell a story of leaving a job on the Friday and having 4 job offers on the Monday so he had a choice of what he wanted to do.

We are slightly better than that portofino 3 adults and 2 children in 2 bedrooms.

Hallo Minus273

I am so sorry about your troubles, I really feel for you. Some of the commenters on here really need to lay off. It is hard to explain how soul-destroying it can be trying to find a job in the current climate and trying to keep your head above water...the lack of response to job applications/interviews is horrible too, I experienced all of that.

You certainly are not alone in this situation, sadly. I do hope things get better for you soon. One thing I will say is: never give up. It is a cliche but something will turn up (people kept saying this to me when I was unemployed, it turns out they were right). All the best for you & forthcoming baby, take care of yourself.

Minus, but your dh is not redundant yet surely? Have you been the CAB yet to identify what you are entitled to?

He finishes a week on Mondayporto. Haven't plucked up the courage to go yet. Did pick up blank forms, actually filled them in almost completely so far but after the homeless office's threat I haven't plucked up the courage to hand anything in in case they do the same.

You MUST! You have had shit advice up til now. Honestly a quick scan on Entitledto.com shows that you should be getting a certain amount of help. Your dh will be entitled to JSA. You need to sort out your housing situation.

What the housing guy said is bullocks!

I really do sympathise with the people who are having a tough time and I don't mean to belittle your situation at all. I've had tough times too. In fact, not so long ago I had just finished a postgrad, DH had just finished a PhD and we were both unemployed living in a horrible flat with no prospect of either of us getting a job. I was very ill with depression and the whole situation was absolutely awful. Thanks largely to a herculean effort from my amazing DH we scraped ourselves out of the situation by looking at all our options and doing the best we could. Fast forward only 3 years and DH has a fab job that he enjoys, we own a house and we have a wonderful son. We got through the shit and I can say that this is the best period of my life so far. Long may it last.

I know from bitter experience that feeling entitled, feeling envious, feeling hard done by and that things are unfair is a sure-fire way to feel terrible. Yes it is galling to feel that you could have had an easy life but you don't but somehow you have to let that go and try to enjoy the lot you're given any way you can. My mother grew up with 4 brothers and 4 sisters in a tiny three bed house (it was actually a two bed but they had to converted the dining room to a bedroom) and they never had two pennies to rub together. When I asked my gran about how she coped, she just said said she got on with it, that was just the way things were. If I struggle I always think of her and how she coped. Incidentally she got her first ever job when she was 50 when her husband died and has had a lovely retirement surrounded by nearly 70 descendents. Anyone looking at her 40 years ago would have shaken their heads and felt sorry for her. I'm sure many of her contemporaries feel envious of her now. You never know how things will work out.

I don't think anyone has been cheated or lied to. Working hard generally is a good way to get along but no one knows how things will work out when it comes to the crunch. I'm sure many young men were told in 1932 that if they worked hard they would do well. No one knew that so many of them would end up dead as a result of WW2. They weren't lied to or cheated, it was just bad luck that they happened to be young and male at the time.

Sorry to waffle on. I know if you're in a hole it can seem terribly dark and the struggle can seem endless. Life is unpredictable and chaotic at the best of times and everyone has to deal with that. There is joy to be had if you choose to have it.

I don't think anyone on this thread is wanting an easy life, just a life dana. All the hard work in the World is worth nothing if you don't have the luck to go with it.

But you have a life, Minus. It isn't the life you hoped for which is terribly disappointing, but it's the best you have for the time being. I don't blame you for feeling anxious and upset but feeling angry and hard done by is very draining and counter productive. The only time I've felt angry about my lot was when I was depressed. I had a life, and a pretty decent one at that, but it meant nothing to me and no one could convince me otherwise, so I feel I may have been where you are now once upon a time. I don't think anything I say is going to make you feel better, and I'm really sorry if I've made you feel worse.

I spent a long time thinking if I work hard things will get better. If I do x things will get better, x doesn't work so you think if I try y thing's will get better. It doesn't though and every other plan you try doesn't work either, its about being a realist and realising you aren't meant to succeed only continually try in vain. You poke your head above the parapet in an attempt to climb out but you just get battered back down. I am only angry at myself for being useless BTW.

I may be totally off the mark Minus, but could you be depressed? I only ask because your thought process does seem to point in that direction. I felt exactly like you when I was depressed - that I had worked hard and it had come to nothing, that I could never succeed no matter what I did and that I was useless. The big signs for me though are the anger and the feeling that "if x happens I'll feel better." X, Y, Z and W all happened for me and I still didn't feel better because I was ill. That may not be the case for you but I thought I'd suggest it just in case.

I live in a lovely two-bed flat with my partner. He doesn't have a job due to illness (illness which the ESA refused to acknowledge); I'm a full-time student in my third year, a carer for him, part-time supermarket lacky and I'm about to embark on a job as a Personal Assistant for a disabled woman because I need the experience for my planned career.

Yeah, sometimes we can't get out of bed because we're both (clinically) depressed, and sometimes there's no money and nothing to eat, but we always manage. We always get by, and we have each other. But no, it's not what I was dreaming of. Life, innit?