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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Supermarket car park staff member - WIBU?

305 replies

HalloweenOutThatPumpkin · 18/10/2011 22:21

AIBU, SN, Waitrose and the car park. I must be stark raving mad, but here goes ...

I shop in the same branch of Waitrose every other day and have done for years. All the regular staff know me and the guys who collect the trolleys are among them.

This evening half the car park was totally empty so instead of driving round the one way system shown by the arrows I nipped into the "down" lane, parked in the first space and got out of the car.

Cue fairly large trolley bloke who has SN of some sort (not sure what they are because he never talks to anyone as far as I know) shouting "Eh! Eh!" at me and pointing at the ground. I couldn't work out what he meant and just looked confusedly back at him. After a minute or so of this he walked over and shouted right in my face "One Way, One Way" and pointed at the arrow. I said that there were no other cars there so I couldn't see the problem. He followed me round the car, still shouting "One Way" at me while I hunted for my bags. It was after dark, there was no one else around and I felt quite intimidated so after I had scarpered to the shop I mentioned it at the customer service desk. I just said that it was quite an outburst and it had left me feeling a bit shaken.

Now I am not sure if I did the right thing. I don't think he will lose his job over it or anything that drastic, but should I have simply thought "the guy has SN, he obviously needs people to follow rules, I've broken them and I should suck it up", or was I right to complain about him shouting at me?

OP posts:
ScaredBear · 19/10/2011 16:34

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Blu · 19/10/2011 16:35

"Most of the men I knnow would hit someone if they where up in their faces shouting at them "

Would they?

How horrible.

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar · 19/10/2011 16:35

Blu that would be the ideal response, but to be fair on the OP it would demand a degree of composure that not everyone is blessed with.

Now you've suggested it (and only now, because I think I'd have become all befuddled and clammed up) I like to think that I'd respond that way too.

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar · 19/10/2011 16:36

Buggering x-posts. I meant the "I'm feeling a bit scared because you are shouting at me" response.

EllaDee · 19/10/2011 16:36

Sorry, but I think all this 'maybe she was scared because he shouted' is rubbish.

If a shop assistant raises their voice to me, I may think they're rude. But scary? Really? No, sorry, I do not spend my time imagining supermarkets emply (for years on end) people who're liable to become violent.

OTOH, if I didn't follow advisory signs and there was a pedestrian I'd not seen objecting, I think it'd be polite to say 'excuse me' at least, instead of staring at him - bemusement or no.

I think the OP probably does see this and it's good she came back and explained, so I don't mean this as more to her - she's admitted she was BU. But others should think a bit harder about whether she would ever have responded that way to someone she didn't already see as someone with SN.

Rhubarb0oooo · 19/10/2011 16:38

CompleteMug - yes you are. Don't you tell me to get off my soapbox. I've every right to be on this thread just as you have.

Some attitudes towards adults with SN are ignorant.

ScaredBear - once again, she KNEW he had SN. If he didn't then yes, obviously the man should be pulled up for acting that way, but what bit of special needs do you not get? Do you think they put it on as an act? Adults with special needs have social difficulties, they have difficulties communicating which is probably why she had not heard him speak before. They don't know they are shouting, they don't know that those who break the rules should not always be pulled up on it and no amount of telling them that will make a difference because they way their brain operates is different to the way yours does.

You know how to act in any given social situation. You know what is appropriate behaviour. They have difficulty in grasping that.

This man has worked there for 10 years. Presumably he does not make a habit of intimidating people and I'm damn sure that this is not what he meant to do.
If you break the rules and someone shouts at you for it then I'm sorry, but if you know that person to have SN you have a bit of understanding.

And talking of breaking rules, he broke the social etiquette rules so she can hardly complain about him not letting her off when she most certainly did not let him off.

ScaredBear · 19/10/2011 16:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Blu · 19/10/2011 16:39

JenniMarr: Oh, I know it's hard to think on the spur of the moment - and the OP has the nouse to be reflecting on what happened and thinking about it. And giving us the benefiit of the conversation - because as you say a chance to think about it in advance is the best way to have our composure at the ready. Smile

I think it is fair enough for any emplyee to be given constructive feedback, and hopefully companies which employ people who have a learning disability, for example, are committed to suporting ongoing professional development and will deal with feedback in a positive way.

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar · 19/10/2011 16:39

He followed her and shouted in her face, EllaDee. That would scare me.

ScaredBear · 19/10/2011 16:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

EllaDee · 19/10/2011 16:41

Really? I don't see why it's scary ... what did she imagine he'd do? It would be rude behaviour from a NT person, but she knew he had some kind of SN, so it's pretty simple to me.

I don't think I'm an especially un-scarable person, either. I get that she made an error and thought better of it after posting this thread, but it's worth discussing isn't it?

GalaxyWeaver · 19/10/2011 16:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Rhubarb0oooo · 19/10/2011 16:41

And yes, he is not some random man in the street.

She deliberately drove the wrong way, in front of a Waitrose employee.
That Waitrose employee (who she has seen for the past 10 years) shouts at her.
Scared?
Really?

Probably more miffed that someone dared to shout at her, a regular of Waitrose!

Rhubarb0oooo · 19/10/2011 16:42

Ditto ScaredBear. Ditto.

NorfolkBroad · 19/10/2011 16:43

I'm not saying that this man would or wouldn't have thumped anyone at all! I dont' know do I? I don't know him. He DID over react to OPs misdemeanour in a way that she found scarey, not hitting but shouting repeatedly and following her. I think it is right to report this so that it does not happen again. I have said that when anyone with SN responds like this we should try to HELP them but we don't do so by ignoring the behaviour.

And no, MOST children in my experience do not retaliate by hitting in school, a few do but not most. I made no assumption at all about this. I was simply sharing my own experience of working with children and young people with SN. I'm not going to post further though as I think you are just determined to be offended.

Peachy · 19/10/2011 16:43

Thing is as well that it mnay well be said car park attendant does not have the social skills required for job

So why is he there?

Well, because regardless fo whwether he can actually manage the job, with what I suspect is an ASD it's nigh on impossible to get help and be assessed as unable to work so no ESA and conpulsory work palcements that he cannot do resulting in.... perhaps becuase after 16 it's nigh on impossible to get a placement to help learn social skills (funding went thataway ---->).

If he gets sacked then what? Virually nil chance of any help long term, abandonment for the rest of his existence of JSA / IS if he is lucky enough to not get sacked from a placement (if he was, he'd get a ban from any money at all for a penalty period).

There's a thing at the mo where the big messahes are 'almost all disabled people can work whilst also blasting out 'disabled people are non taxpayers' (ie not in work)

and people end up caught in the middle

This may not be the case here but it is for many with similar levels of SN

Blu · 19/10/2011 16:44

For example - I am associated with a project working with children some of whom have autism. One of the assistants is a highly talented, experienced and highly trained young man in a particular skill, and he has a learning disability. However, his manner of being extremely friendly in a very 'bouncy' way was sending the autistic children scranny, they couldn't cope. This was explained clearly to the assistant, he was shown how to appraoch the children in a quiet and gentle way and everything has been hunkydory plus!

Ormirian · 19/10/2011 16:47

Anyone who responds to someone with SN shouting at them, by hitting, is the one with a problem. If this man so clearly had SN why would any decent human being respond with violence?

EllaDee · 19/10/2011 16:48

I don't see how it is an overreaction either. Imagine this OP please:

'I was in Waitrose carpark, doing my job, which is taking the trollies back and making sure people park in the right places. It was getting dark, and a car pulled directly into the wrong-way lane and parked. I'm not sure she even saw me - she acted as if the place was empty. I ran straight up, calling to her, because of course I've been told it's very dangerous and she'd gone the wrong way. Instead of replying she just started at me. I'm not sure she wanted me to say! So I explained she was wrong as best I could, and she just told me she 'couldn't see the problem'. Maybe she was very stupid, of course, but it worried me a lot and I kept shouting to see if I could make her understand - but she didn't move her car or say sorry.

AIBU to feel very confused and upset at her failure to respond to me properly?'

EllaDee · 19/10/2011 16:49

*'she just stared at me', even.

Btw, that is pretty important IMO - I don't stare at people trying to communicate, I say something. And I don't tell people what's 'not a problem' when it's their job to determine that, either. It does come across oddly.

Rhubarb0oooo · 19/10/2011 16:49

Read the very first post again.

She admits she knows she has driven the wrong way.
She looks confused when he points at the arrows and shouts "Eh" (I would have thought it was fairly obvious what he was on about but hey ho)
So because he gets no response from her he moves closer to bring home his point that she has broken the rules.

I would not call this an "outburst", there is no swearing, just a few words spoken in a loud voice.

Yes he followed her whilst shouting "one way" but there is no indication that he was going to do anything other than carry on saying this.

I fail to find anything intimidating in there. Nothing to justify saying to customer services that he had an outburst.

I am pleased she went back and I applaud her that. She has shown way more compassion than some of the other posters who have come on to say they would have asked for him to be sacked or that if they were men they would have hit him.

Oh and asking me to get off my "soapbox" because of what? Because I am arguing a rational and reasonable case for adults with SN? Because you want the thread to be filled with people who agree CompleteMug? Well whilst there are people in this world who have so little understanding and patience towards those with SN then I will bloody well stay put so suck that.

KreepyInMind · 19/10/2011 16:50

He should not have followed you shouting, YANBU

ScaredBear · 19/10/2011 16:54

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Rhubarb0oooo · 19/10/2011 17:00

SB - he didn't touch her. If you have panic attacks perhaps you have some indication of how he felt when he saw the rules being broken. He probably felt that he really needed to tell her that.

She didn't respond the first time so he tried again. Ok, he was clumsy in his social skills, but he felt it was important that she understood she had broken the rules.

I am sorry you thought me condescending. I have experienced more than enough prejudice not just because of my brother's special needs but also because he is black. I have spent quite a long time working with adults and children with SN and I feel very protective towards them because I am very aware of the attitudes that are out there.

I felt this situation could have been handled better that's all. She should not have told customer services that he had an outburst. If she knew he had SN I feel she should have made some concession for that (and once he started talking I get the impression most people would know he had SN as it's obv he has a problem with communication) and perhaps have just said sorry.

But she did go back and I am happy that she did. However some attitudes on this thread have been ignorant.

I hope I've explained myself better ScaredBear. I appreciate what you have said.

lechildrenofthecornsilk · 19/10/2011 17:05

The guy followed the OP because she refused to engage with him. The OP was being rude and dismissive to him. However the OP has been back on to explain that she realises that she made an error and has also been back to the store to see the manager to explain this. It's a bit disappointing to see that other posters are jumping in with the the usual stereotypes surrounding SN though.