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AIBU?

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Original poster

To have no sympathy for the burglar

758 replies

Mitmoo · 19/09/2011 09:10

Another burglar has been stabbed to death when he broke into a businessman's home. His wife and child were returning to the property. The details are very scant at the moment as it is early day.

But the burglars who were stabbed robbing a shop, and an edlerly shopkeeper killed one of them, he was not prosecuted. I think that's right.

It's on R5Live now being debated after another burglar was killed at the weekend.

Personally I think home burglars should take getting stabbed as a occupational hazard. I have no sympathy for them.

OP posts:
JillySnooper · 20/09/2011 13:45

Brilliant post Onegar.

When you enter someone's home your intent is malicious, end of.

It is not down to the householder to work out just how malicious. The householder has a legal and moral right to assume the worst and act accordingly.

BupcakesandCunting · 20/09/2011 13:46

"At the moment, though, that if is still an if."

Quite.

However, it looks like it's coming to light that the homeowner was dragged around the property before dimwit# 1 got stabbed. Also, they had knocked on the door pretending to be doing door-to-door. Apparently.

Animation · 20/09/2011 13:46

"I said that, given the choice, I would choose being hassled over being dead"

It's not an either or.

The family should not be hassled.

JillySnooper · 20/09/2011 13:48

Jesus bupcakes

Also seems he was a known violent shit and had terrorised a local pub full of people with a shotgun.

The more I read, the more in awe of Mr Cooke I am.

Animation · 20/09/2011 13:49

"We are pointing out that homeowners do have the legal and moral right to defend themselves"

Omagar - exactly.

MIFLAW · 20/09/2011 13:49

"about what?" Well, suppose it turns out that the homeowner brought his own knife to the party and stabbed the burglar while he was not holding a weapon? I think that, for many people, that would seriously damage a moral case of a man righteously defending his property and put him more in the camp of, well, a murderer. I like to think that SOME people, at least, might come back and say, "you know what? We were wrong. We jumped to a conclusion that X was defending himself; in fact, he went looking for it. And we didn't really consider that as a serious possibility. We were wrong."

But I bet the number of people who do so will be significantly smaller than the number of people not considering that possibility - because, as we all know, if you are prepared to commit any violent crime, then death, handed out by a member of the public, is what you deserve.

"you are saying cowardice is the best policy and that the rights of criminals outweigh everything else." i'm saying that cowardice is often the SAFEST policy. I haven't said anywhere that the rights of criminals outweight the rights of anyone else. Just that, as human beings, they HAVE rights and I'm glad they do.

BupcakesandCunting · 20/09/2011 13:51

"When you break into someone's house you lose that assumption and should expect to be treated as a criminal (which you are now) and a potential thief/rapist/murderer. The householder has no way to tell which you are yet, but you have ruled out innocence by breaking in."

Precisely.

Mr Cooke is clearly nails. Wink Let's face it, if you spend your life intimidating and picking fights with others, it's only a matter of time before your luck runs out.

porcamiseria · 20/09/2011 13:52

thats a totally spurious argument!!!! milflaw

I am glad that he could defend himself, kill or be killed in this case methinks

JillySnooper · 20/09/2011 13:52

Seems the shits dragged him round his home to look for a safe. Whilst in a bedroom his wife and son arrived, Mr Cooke shouted for them to get out which they did.

They then dragged him to the kitchen where scumscrote was stabbed in the arms and legs and bled to death.

He had spent half his adult life in prison, apparently.

JillySnooper · 20/09/2011 13:53

Neighbours have removed the flowers, thank god.

BupcakesandCunting · 20/09/2011 13:54

"you know what? We were wrong. We jumped to a conclusion that X was defending himself; in fact, he went looking for it. And we didn't really consider that as a serious possibility. We were wrong."

He went looking for it?

Oh fucking good one.

Really.

JillySnooper · 20/09/2011 13:55

Hold on.

" Went looking for it"????

In his own fucking home?

I'm now reaching the point where I seriously think your way of thinking is sick MIFLAW.

MIFLAW · 20/09/2011 13:56

Porca

It's not an argument, though. It's a statment. We could be wrong about the facts of this case. If we are, then I hope that the poeple who have made a hero oout of Mr Cooke on the basis of that misunderstanding are planning to come back and say, "I was wrong."

I bet not many do.

diyvspse · 20/09/2011 13:57

Not making this up - two nights ago I dreamed burglars came into my home while my family were there, I tried to stab them but the knife wouldn't work (in typical dream fashion). Then we had a sit down meeting with the burglars and they announced they would be moving into the house with us.

Yanbu. If someone breaks into your home, you shouldn't be prosecuted if you kill them in the course of defending your property and family. I would most likely jump out of a window before confronting an intruder, but clearly there are people out there with more courage than me.

JillySnooper · 20/09/2011 13:57

He'd been dragged around the house, his wife and son had come home and he went, " looking for it"?

So, MIFLAW, tell us know how you can run away when two shits are dragging you around your home?

Do , pray, tell us what the fuck you would have had the poor fucking bastard do??

MIFLAW · 20/09/2011 13:58

Yes, but that isn't actually what I SAID, is it?

I said, IF it turned out that Mr Cooke HAD gone looking for it - e.g. by stabbing an unarmed man with a knife he had brought himself - then I hope (but doubt) that people would acknowledge that, in casting him as some sort of "have a go hero," they had been wrong.

JillySnooper · 20/09/2011 13:59

Okay.

I'd love to know how you go, " looking for it" in your own home?

duchesse · 20/09/2011 13:59

In an ideal world, this man would not be dead. In an ideal world, he would not have felt he could enter someone else's house and take what he wanted. He did and he suffered the consequences. Most often it is the burgled rather the burglar that comes off worst.

BupcakesandCunting · 20/09/2011 14:00

He was supposed to allow them to physically manhandle him, Jilly. Then he should have popped the kettle on for a nice brew for them, I bet they were thirsty after the energy they expended.

Went looking for it?

Animation · 20/09/2011 14:01

"Seems the shits dragged him round his home to look for a safe. Whilst in a bedroom his wife and son arrived, Mr Cooke shouted for them to get out which they did.

They then dragged him to the kitchen where scumscrote was stabbed in the arms and legs and bled to death."

If my kids walked in on that - I'd fight like fucking hell to keep them safe.

You're supposed to stand up to bullies.

And the family's still being bullied - by the folk outside the house. They need to be moved on and take their bloody flowers' with them.

onagar · 20/09/2011 14:01

MIFLAW the law doesn't say you can't use your own knife. Just that you can't bring one along for that purpose. It's not the method, but the intent that matters.

As for "cowardice is often the SAFEST policy" I'd have to say that cowardice often means getting someone else to take the risk. In this case it could have been his family, the police or the next householder/victim.

MIFLAW · 20/09/2011 14:01

Jilly

I think that, if Mr Cooke killed the man in self-defence, he did exactly the right thing. I have never said he did the wrong thing. It would have been better for him if he had avoided killing a man, because then he would not have to carry that with him; and, of course, a man would not have died. But I have not once condemned Mr Cooke for killing his intruder, assuming it was indeed in self-defence.

The only person I HAVE consistently criticised is YOU for gloating over the fact that a man died and sweeping away the possible feelings of that man's family a particularly nasty brand of folk wisdom.

JillySnooper · 20/09/2011 14:02

So, if someone is dragging you around your home, even if they don't have a knife ( which we know these scummers did) , are you suggesting Mr Cooke should have just accepted his fate - whatever horrors that may have entailed, rather than trying to defend himself and get free?

Please, please tell me you aren't suggesting he should have just taken whatever those sick bastards were going to do to him? Shock

cantspel · 20/09/2011 14:02

No one has said which knife killed jacob but it is known that he was a voilent criminal who used force to break into the house of Mr Cook and that he had a knife.
There appears to then have been a struggle in the kitchen of the house during which Mrs Cook and their child arrived home and were shouted at by Mr Cook to get out and they ran to the house next door.
During the course of the struggle jacob receieved a knife wound to the thigh and it is believed he bled to death from that wound. They dont know yet if it was a knife from the kitchen or jacobs knife which made the wound and quite frankly i dont care.

I cant see that mr Cook has done anything wrong at all. he was defending his family from criminals and should be commended for his bravery.

MIFLAW · 20/09/2011 14:03

Onagar - yes, that's right. The police. Who are mandated to do so, paid to do so, trained to do so, and wearing protective body armour.

Yes, I'm happy with that one.