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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to demand my BIL allows me to move into his house?

135 replies

creamola · 23/08/2011 10:58

(Long but background required to set scenario.)

I have posted before about my sister who has depresssion following hysterectomy and has turned to alcohol to cope.

She is now in a complete and utter mess.

Last week I discovered that BIL and niece had gone off on holiday and was able to get access to the house and bring my sister down to my house.

She is unrecognisable, filthy skin, hair and clothes, face broken out in red spotty blotches (looks like a drunk street person)

Her bedroom is beyond disgusting.........it's filthy, full of empty bottles, old food, rubbish everywhere and stinks (not smells, stinks )

I had a long phone conversation yesterday with BIL to try and arrange a family meeting to see what idea's we could come up with to help and he's not interested.

More or less he's said myself, my son and my ex-husband (who helped me with her last week) can do what ever we want but he's not interested in being involved ......he's had enough and doesn't want to know??

I can't get her to move into mine so I'm considering insisting that I move into their house for maybe a month to see if I can get through to her and help her.

I know he won't go for it so wonder if it's unreasonable to just move in and refuse to leave due to him refusing to help her?

OP posts:
honeyandsalt · 24/08/2011 00:48

OP, I think it's wonderful that you want to help your sister.

She obviously can't manage daily hygiene tasks so I'm sure your help would be useful there. Maybe gradually you can get her out more, it sounds old-fashioned but light and excercise will really help, just a walk round the park. But you can do these things whilst living at home, and I struggle to see how you can make a further positive impact by living there? What's the plan here? This is a long-term condition, recovery takes years, well, a lifetime. I worry you are going to burn yourself out by charging in and expecting to sort things out within a few weeks. This is a marathon not a sprint.

What I think you can do which will make a big impact is to further educate yourself as much as possible, through the internet, the AA, see her GP if you can. You can get onto Amazon and search for books on helping alcoholics and depressives - information is power.

JockTamsonsBairns · 24/08/2011 00:52

I fully understand the temptation to move in and get tore into sorting out your sister's mess - I'd want to do just that if it was me, I'm sure. However, you must know that there's really nothing you can achieve by doing that and, in fact, you could make things a whole lot worse for everyone. Your Dsis needs specialist help by the sounds of things. You say that she's indicated she wants to stop drinking? Would you be able to find out when the next 'open' AA meeting is in your area, and go with her to support her? Are you near enough, and do you have time, to visit her on a daily basis? I do think this type of sustained and practical support would be of far more help to her and her family - but, ultimately, the hard work required to necessitate change needs to come from her.

As for your BIL, please don't be too hard on him. It's awful living with an addict and he'll be experiencing all sorts of extreme emotions, whilst trying to make sense of it all. It's entirely natural that he'll go through periods of appearing to 'give up' on her. Supporting an addict is, at best, thankless, exhausting and entirely futile, until the addict takes the first step to change. Try to stay onside with each other - it's tough for you both.

I really wish you well.

Original poster
creamola · 24/08/2011 01:03

thank you anyfucker .........that is helpful beyond belief ......thank you

OP posts:
Original poster
creamola · 24/08/2011 04:36

thank you jocktamsbairns

at the moment i want to rip my my BIL's head off and kick it down the street

I cant sleep ........because i'm waiting for her to call and say come and pick me up .

He punched her in the face last week .....before he went on holiday ............and left saying you'll never see (DD) again and you might nnever see me again

OP posts:
tiredgranny · 24/08/2011 04:52

i would take her to ae she has depression and history of mental health most ae have crisis mental health team and perhaps she can follow that route everyone seems to be concentrating on the alchol abuse not the cause

LaLaLaLayla · 24/08/2011 04:55

I would second going to AlAnon.

Also, what about HRT? Is she taking it? Estrogen patches can make the world of difference.

cricketballs · 24/08/2011 08:31

creamiola, in answer to your question I don't know Sad the person who I was referring to didn't want to change and is no longer with us despite 'rehab' etc as they didn't really want to change.

in terms of your BIL it sounds like he has reached the end and although it is no defence for violence I can understand his feelings if he has been dealing with this issue on his own 24 hours a day.

I would agree with those suggesting that you speak to AlAnon as they provide guidance and support for family and friends.

good luck xxx

honeyandsalt · 24/08/2011 08:35

He punched her and used her daughter against her?

Oh. Sad

Well, that changes things.

Why doesn't she want to move? If it's the booze tbh you're better not getting her teetotal without medical advice anyway, as someone else said alcohol withdrawal is serious stuff. Didn't you say the house was hers anyway? Maybe you can get her to say she wants him out? (then have the locks changed?!)

I'm so sorry your sister is in this situtation, she's so lucky to have you to help.

I know one ex-alcoholic, my friend's dad, lovely guy. It took my friend giving him a "it's me or the booze" ultimatum to give it up, if you can get the daughter to say she'll resume a relationship with her mum once she's dry, you know, light at the end of the tunnel?

All the best x

Tortoiseonthehalfshell · 24/08/2011 08:38

He punched her in the face and said she'd never see her daughter again?

And this is a woman who has been basically teetotal her entire life, and supported him entirely, and is drinking to the point of total incapacity as a result of a specific trigger?

Wow. I'm with you, OP, a year or two of watching your partner struggle really isn't an excuse for any of that, or anything close.

OP, I really hope social services and other help can get to you.

WhoseGotMyEyebrows · 24/08/2011 08:59

He punched her in the face last week . . .

Oh my God! That's awful. It's sounds a bit like that now your sister isn't able to look after him and do everything for him anymore (like you say she's always done) he's just chucking her away like some old rubbish!

I am surprised at the people saying that you shouldn't move in when your sister has said she wants help . . . and it's her house! Move in. It might not solve it of course but it can't hurt and it will put your mind at rest a bit about your sister if you are there. You could possibly help her get the proffessional help she needs as well while you are there as well.

I do think that maybe having your support could make a difference to her as she is obviously not getting it from her DH.

What about the DD in this? Is she helping? Can you talk to her?

Kayano · 24/08/2011 09:23

I'm sorry that he punched her but I sort of feel like you are drip feeding us information. You never said anything like that in the Op just that they were on hol.

Hope it gets sorted

WhoseGotMyEyebrows · 24/08/2011 09:43

Also if he won't help her himself then why is he refusing to let you help?!?! Maybe you are right, maybe he wants her to die!

toniguy · 24/08/2011 10:04

The op said he isn't refusing to let her help- in fact the opposite, he said 'you help if you want but don't involve me'. So unless the op is changing the facts as we go along, (and there has been some major drip feeding) then we must assume the BIL isn't blocking her from helping.

I think moving into their house will make a very bad situation worse though . The sister clearly has a massive problem , she needs specialists, not just well meaning relatives. Her alcoholism has a strong hold over her, and if her husband and daughter havnt managed to change things, theres no reason to think other relatives will.

It sounds awful and I hope she finds a way of turning the corner but tbh I think moving in' for 3 weeks will make no impact, and just exacerbate things with the BIL

Original poster
creamola · 24/08/2011 10:16

kayano thanks ........I'm not drip feeding anyone .....this is serious and important to me .

Thank you for all the sensisble replies (positive & negative) they are helping me focus and I've been given some really good advice xx

(just waiting on Alanon to call me back .....thank you to the guys whos suggested getting in tough with )

OP posts:
paddypoopants · 24/08/2011 10:16

I'm sorry I haven't had a chance to read all the posts so forgive me if I repeating someone else. My friend was in a similar situation to you with her brother. She eventually took him to his GP when he was really bad and got help from them- some medication and then a spell in rehab fairly quickly. If you could get her there when she is particularly down and explain everything to them including stuff about the hysterectomy they may be able to help quickly.
Good luck- you sound like a lovely sister.

Original poster
creamola · 24/08/2011 10:17

bad spelling .....sorry Sad

OP posts:
Original poster
creamola · 24/08/2011 10:31

toniguy major drip feeding .seriously .

That's you an Kayanou saying that .

Perhaps it might be relevant to both of you to remember that if someone is speaking about a personal issue .......it is not a game or who can look the coolest on the forum.

if i put the entire situation down on one post it would have taken up two pages

I'm chosing to ignore your advice toniguy .....because you are talking out of your arse

OP posts:
miniwedge · 24/08/2011 10:38

So is she on hrt or not?

Your first port of call is her gp. Have you made an appointment yet? She clearly needs medical care and a decent rehab programme that includes treatment for her depression. You said you have made some calls, so who were they to and what was the outcome?

Claw3 · 24/08/2011 10:47

If the house in the sole name of your sister, your bil has no say as to whether you stay there for 3 weeks, as long as your sister agrees. Has your bil actually said he doesnt want you there for 3 weeks?

This is only a very short term solution though, if any, once you leave after 3 weeks you might find you are back to square one.

You cannot force an alcoholic to receive treatment unless there has been a violent episode and the police have been called or a medical emergency.

My dad was an alcoholic, all AA or any other support groups can do, is to support you. They cannot take any action unless the person agrees.

My mum and me resorted to dragging my dad outside onto the pavement when he was in a right state and phoning for an ambulance. Drastic, but we couldnt just stand by and watch my dad kill himself. He was placed in a drying out clinic, but as soon as he sobered up, he discharged himself and the whole thing started again.

As others had said you cannot help someone who doesnt want to help themself, but thats not to say that you shouldnt try. Good luck.

toniguy · 24/08/2011 10:48

Not saying it's a game at all op. You are of course free to ignore any or all of the advice you've asked for. Its a tad rude to accuse people of talking out of their arse though, just because you don't like the advice they give.

I think its a shocking situation and your sister needs professional help urgently. I think its admirable that you want to help access that. But no way would I move into someone elses house like that as it could backfire badly, and the BIL could be provoked into action which makes it harder in the long term. I also don't believe much could be achieved in just 3 weeks anyway, with someone with long standing alcoholism. This is likely to be months or years of intervention and support

WhoseGotMyEyebrows · 24/08/2011 10:56

it is not a game or who can look the coolest on the forum

Very true.

I think that positive things may come out of having you there to stay. You might be able to convince your sister to get help and your presence may make her feel supported and stronger. I had MH issues with severe OCD and anxiety disorder (a bit different I know) for 4 years or so and my DH was there every step of the way with me. I don't know what I would have done without him.

I know that she needs professional help but that doesn't mean her family should just abandon her. They should be there as well if they can, and the OP can.

OP How long has she been ill?

WhoseGotMyEyebrows · 24/08/2011 10:58

toniguy Really YOU are accusing the OP of being rude. You said "So unless the op is changing the facts as we go along, (and there has been some major drip feeding)", pretty much calling her a liar. I think that's ruder.

toniguy · 24/08/2011 11:03

Someone posted 'if he is refusing to help her, why is he refusing to let you help too?'

I pointed out that the op said the opposite of this - that the bil is happy for her to support (but not move in)

I think the other poster was incorrect though, as it seems nowhere has the op said bil is blocking her from helping . There is a lot of support Which can be given without actually moving in anyway. And as it would only be 3 weeks, isn't there a risk that if it did suddenly have a massive impact, the op would then need to move out again which would set it back to square 1

porcamiseria · 24/08/2011 11:07

OP you have to do what you have to do, she is your sister and you love her. despite what people are saying, I would probably move in to. BUT in parallel do speak with ala anon and such type organisations as they can give you some good advice OK?

I dont know about your BIL, cant tell if he is a an evil fucker or a frustrated man so you deal as you see appropriate but whatever haooens dont go in guns blazing as it wont help your cause

people can get themselves out off these situatons and I hope your sister can to XXXX

Mitmoo · 24/08/2011 11:12

Creamola some use this as their own personal playgrounds, who sit there having Eureka moments spotting imaginary trolls, spotting imaginary lies and loving to be the first to find the huge imaginary flaws with your posts. Even better if there are a few like minded posters so they can drown out any really useful advice.

Take no notice they are fortunate to have time to play while you are busy trying to save your sister's life.

whosegotmyeyebrows I'm glad you had support with your OCD, it can be a long road back and how we as the family react can have a huge impact on the OCD sufferers recovery. I truly hope you've made it.