For being furious at DH telling DSD that my degree isn't a real degree?

[TooFarGone]

So DH is sat down with his DD taking about careers etc. He says to her "these days, you need a job that pays at least £20k a year but at the same time, you don't want to be stressing yourself out with difficult degrees and stuff. You want to enjoy your time at uni. That's why I think nursing would be ideal for you! you get to go to uni, you don't have to do a difficult degree and you get a well paid job at the end of it!".

So DSD says "But isn't a degree in nursing going to be just as difficult?" and he replied "no course not, they call it a degree but its not like a real degree".

I'm furious as I worked bloody hard to get my degree and he knows this. It isn't an "easy option" at all. I had it out with him and he apologised for upsetting me but still maintains that nursing is an easy alternative to doing a "real" degree.

".......and yet you wouldn't think to hire an architect who didn't have a degree in his field, so why hire a nurse who isn't fully-qualified?"

You are right MummyTigger.

The title, 'Architect' is protected by law, as is (I presume) "Nurse".

MummyTigger "and yet you wouldn't think to hire an architect who didn't have a degree in his field, so why hire a nurse who isn't fully-qualified?"
Exactly!

Doctors do their rounds once or twice a day, the nurse is there 24/7. If the nurse isn't well educated enough to be able to spot when patient is getting sicker so they could intervene, and relied on the doctors to do it, then a helluva lot of people would die unnecessarily. Simple. I'm not sure how any (intelligent, logical) person could argue with that.

Wamster How exactly do YOU know there was no crises on the ward?! If you were too tired to press the call button and request some water (yet not too tired to drink your entire jug of water before the catering staff came round at the previously mentioned regular intervals with a new jug) then how were you alert enough to know what was going on in the entire ward?! There may not have been anyone dying in your BAY (the little room your bed is in) but there are several bays on a ward. How do you know there wasn't a cardiac arrest/pulmmonary embolism/etc in the side room at the other end of the ward? And did you actually hear the conversation of the nurses that you weren't too tired to observe "chatting"? As already pointed out they were probably handing over/discussing the incredibly sick person who was selfishly dying whilst you impatiently tiredly waited for someone to read your mind and spoon feed you water

Right, I could not move because my leg was in plaster so I could not physically get the water, I assume that there was no crises because a few of the nurses were chatting away and swapping photos therefore, the excuse that they were 'too busy' is rubbish.

You know what, ALL I really want here is one thing: I KNOW full well that oversights are made in life and with the best of nurses, so I would forgive any nurse who said, 'Sorry, Wamster, about this oversight with your water. Won't happen again'.

What I find unforgivable and totally wrong is the notion that nurses are not supposed to make sure that the'r patients have water to drink!
Of course they bloody are! OK, I am not saying that they have to physically pour the water themselves but they should sure as hell make sure that a nursing assistant does it.

I am afraid that the person who keeps banging on here about how nurses should not be the ones who meet these very, very basic requirements is being very stupid.

I recall a close relative of mine (who was a nursing sister) telling me that in her early career as a staff nurse she had been absolutely bollocked for leaving a patient without water at the bedside. She-foolishly- tried to excuse it by saying, 'that the patient should have asked' and that it was the nursing assistants' fault, she was severely berated by the nursing officer who pointed out that she was the one responsible for such things.

So, to summarise, I can accept that oversights are made but I CANNOT accept that nurses should get away with nonsense that they are not responsible for patients liquid and dietary intake!

And I am not male, sorry but it is absolutely typical of people who are losing the argument to resort to 'you must be a man'.

Oh for god's sake, nurses are humans, not bloody saints! Anyone who's been in hospital will tell you there are some who do their job well and some lazy ones who don't. It's the same in any job - it's ridiculous to think that all nurses are perfect.

Their degree is largely practical so of course it's not comparable to a purely academic degree! The fact that one poster quoted a dozen subjects they studied that usually take 3 years of study doesn't mean they're more intelligent or more academic; it just means they don't study them in the depth that they do in other degrees (otherwise they'd have a dozen degrees, wouldn't they?)

ImperialBlether, yep, the nursing degree makes a nurse a jack-of-all-trades and master of none. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing, as they say.

Wamster I suggest you actually do a nursing degree so you actually know what you are wittering on about. I see your leg was in plaster? so you didn't have a trachy? intubated? laryngectomy? Aphasia? Head injury affecting your speech? Jaw wired? NO? then I'm sorry but the I was too tired to press my call bell and utter three words... Nurse water please excuse is pathetic to say the least.

Wuckingfonderful. So you do not think it is the nurses' role to ensure that people are provided with water, then? Obviously not. Please answer the following question:

Do you think it is important that nurses ensure that patients have access to water?

What if your patient is too scared to ask? What if they are bewildered? What if they are too shy? Too tired? Too confused?Wuckingfonderful, I do hope you are not a nurse because, I tell you this: you have zero empathy for other human beings and, frankly, your callous attitude is doing the profession no favours at all.
I can now fully understand, though, why doctors sometimes have to prescribe water.

Oh Wamster get over yourself. Yes I am a nurse and far from callous. If you needed your jug refilling and noone noticed then you should have said something seriously clutching at straws here. You had access to water, you drank it, if you had pointed out to the staff who for whatever reason didn't notice your empty jug, then it would have been refilled. I seriously doubt that you were too scared and far from shy judging the way you post on here tbh.
I have sympathy for my patients, I don't have sympathy for ignorant tosh regards the training of nurses spouted by someone who has no clue whatsoever. If you had posted that you had asked and noone complied I would have joined in saying disgusting someone should have refilled your jug, but you didn't you clutched at straws with the too tired argument. You have continually posted regards the training of nurses, continually spouted utter bollocks for want of a better word regards what nurses actually do, you have judged a proffesion on one incident because the nurses were not telepathic and couldn't read your mind regards your need for a refill. You have had numerous nurses try to explain that sometimes they are so overworked and busy that they may not have noticed, or indeed have the extraordinary unheard of skill to read your mind but you still harp on.
To answer your question yes access to water is vital but if I was dealing with an acute MI your going to have to wait for your water. You had access to water, you drank it, you needed more, the staff were too busy to notice before the catering staff refilled your jug, you were capable of voicing your need but used the excuse I was too tired then proceeded to slate all nurses and their training.

Also as for the obviously not tosh regards water not being vital ..wow glad you could gleam that from one post regarding your situation not others. You clearly have fantastic observational skills ever thought of retraining to become a nurse?

Yes, I may come over as being articulate here, but I am afraid in real life I stutter and don't like speaking much. Would it really been too difficult for a nurse to take this into consideration?

You see, I fully appreciate that oversights are made and nurses are sometimes busy- although they weren't that busy that day what with them looking at photographs- but I honestly did not expect the response that it is the ^patients' job to do the basic nursing jobs like provision of water for them (patients).

I at least expected something along the lines of 'Sorry, but us nurses do make mistakes'.
I'm afraid it seems that nurses do neglect these task.

I am afraid the general feeling I am receiving here is that nurses do not give a shit anymore. Too tired to ask for water? Too shy? Too bewildered? TOUGH. The nurses care so little for you that they won't even provide water unless you ask. It's tragic really.

Like I said, it is zero surprise to learn that doctors now have to put water on prescription charts. This, by the way, is well-reported in the respected broadsheet newspapers and I have not plucked this from thin air.

Yep, wamster. You've got it in one.

Of course I left home at 17 to start my nurse training, worked in one of london's poorest areas for 15 years dealing with some of the most horrific circumstances lie can through at people. 14 year old heroin addict left to bleed to death by her pimp outside the hospital? Yep, that sort of thing.

Yes, I spent all those years doing nights, weekends, hours and hours of un paid overtime.

Yes, I did once have three weeks off for a dislocated shoulder kindly given to me by a relative because his dad had not been discharged home that day.

Yes, even with a 18 month old son I still regularly come home late from work, because the wards are insanely busy. I don't even work on a ward anymore but hate to see my colleagues struggle.

Yes, I've gone the extra mile many times, brought in gifts for patients when they had no visitors, paid a taxi fair out of my own purse to help a patient get home. Even once brought in some jellied eals for a lady once who really fancied them, and given she had chronic lung disease she could not go and get them herself.

So yes, you're right. I am a total callous bitch who's only aim when I turn up for work every day is to make patients lives misery.

If hospital wards had legal RN to patient ratios (like they do in America and Australia), then maybe Wamster would have got her water.

An aircraft will not be allowed to travel if there are not enough aircrew/cabin staff due to safety issues, yet it is acceptable that one Registered nurse can be the only qualified staff for 32 patients.

Have you read the militantnursing blog yet, Wamster? Makes for horrific reading.

wideawakenurse, My point is that I believe nurses can be rushed off their feet- I don't deny it, but, I'm sorry the attitude of some here is that patients should always ask for these things and sod 'em if they don't.
How the heck can that be right when it comes to the basics like provision of water for patients to drink?
I'm annoyed because instead of getting, 'sorry, it was obviously an oversight' (which would be reasonable as nobody can get it right all the time) I'm getting a couldn't-care-less-your-job-as-a-patient to ask response.

So I am not denying that a lot of nurses work very hard at all, just wish they would take more responsibility when they get it wrong and at least accept that they are to blame for such oversights or get angry with their management/nursing council for not being to fulfill their obligations because of lack of time.

The low expectations of the working class! £20k a good salary. Wow. No wonder so many women earn so little if they think that's high pay.

Why would he want her to be nurse rather than a leading surgeon?

Actually wamster my post on the 12th at 20.28 states clearly about accountability of nurses in relation to meeting patients basic needs.

You never acknowledged it however, despite it clearly responding to your key concerns.

To add, wamster, you had have also used the word 'thick' to describe nurses.

Just like when patients complain in hospital, it's hard to be empathetic when insults start to be hurled about.

Wamster, you haven't answered a single point from my last post. Why?

You may have responded, wideawakenurse, but I am afraid that a lot of people here (including somebody who appears to be a nurse tutor ) clearly thinks that it is the patients who should be making sure that their basic needs such as water provision are met and that it is up to the patients themselves to ask for such things even, or so it seems, if they are exhausted, bewildered by the system, got a bit of a speech impediment, or just a bit confused.
The sheer unprofessionality of this attitude is breathtaking. It really is.

So, yes, I do appreciate that nurses can be very busy and I do accept mistakes and oversights are made, but I hope I never ever get nursed by somebody who thinks that supplying fresh water to a patient is something that should not be automatically done as a matter of course or is anything other than unapologetic for a (sometimes understandable) oversight.

Wamster, if you feel that you have genuine cause for complaint, why don't you actually complain to PALS? You could really make a difference for the other patients who will be on that ward in the future, so they don't have to suffer like you did. Instead, you seem to be hell bent on trying to persuade a group of random strangers on the internet to accept responsibility and apologise for what happened to you. I can't understand why really, unless you have a weird grudge against nurses or something....

But wamster, you have still not acknowledged the contents of that post. Did you read it?

PeopleCallMeTricky, you know you are right. I must do something about this in rl. If things are so bad now that nurses do not even recognise that they should supply water and fail to be apologetic about (sometimes understandable) oversights (OK, maybe not physically supply water themselves but get assistant to do it and, I've said over and over that I appreciate that nursing can be a very busy job and that mistakes can be made), then I think things have got out of control.

I have responded to your post! There were several nurses chatting, laughing and looking at snapshots. God, I don't need to be a medic myself to realise that they weren't doing nursing activities. Stop asking me, please, I have already responded.

Just saw this thread - for one moment I thought Op was going to say she had BA Hons in Hospitality (see Apprentice last night ) then you would BU

However OP YANBU .

I think things have digresses from the OP,
however I'd like to go against the grain earlier in the thread and say I did find the academic side to the degree easy & unchallanging, however I found the practical skills and the placement work very hard and while all the other Uni students were out partying I was up at 6am to be in work for 7 not getting home till 8 in the evening, ready to do it all again.
Getting all the mucky dirty jobs to do as 'the student'.
I'm sorry you had a terrible experience of poor nursing Wamster when you are ill and vulnerable, you need to feel assured your basic needs are taken care of, that way you feel as though the bigger things are being looked after too.
I do chat to my colleagues at work, and sometimes even about non-medical things, sometimes they even make me laugh, friendships help you make a team.
Some wards and nurses are just better at the basics but I would say on the whole we try pretty hard