to think that if you tell someone that your child is vegetarian...

[Tollund]

that they should respect this and not then try to feed them meat?!

At a birthday party with DS1 who is four and a parent there offered my DS a sausage. DS took one (as he didn't know is it was veggie or not) and I politely said to the man "thank you, but he's vegetarian."

He said "yes, I know, they told me that. But I thought I'd see if he wanted one, and he took one, so let him have it."

I ignored him and told DS not to eat it.

THe man then started on at me about how I should let him make his own choices and to let him eat it which I refused to be drawn into, politely telling him no and then walking away.

He then went up to the mother of the child whose party it was (about 10 feet away from me) and starts banging on about me not letting him eat meat!

I think this man was monumentally ignorant - why does he think he is in a position to make food choices for my four year old child? What if DS was Jewish? Or had allergies? I'm now loathe to let my DS anywhere near this man's child or to go to parties where this man might be - IABU? (I don't think I'm BU in terms of making dietary decisions for my son at this time in his life, but whether am BU in wanting to keep my DS very far away from that tool!)

DCs of 3yrs are quite happy to eat animals. I largely grew up on a farm, I knew why the animals were there. If we had chicken for lunch, a chicken was killed.
I told mine from the earliest time with farm board book, this is a cow, it says 'moo' we get milk and beef. We go to the farmshop and see the lambs in the fields and go inside and see the lamb chops. There would be no lambs in the fields if they were not eaten. It is such a shame that people are so remote from the food chain. It is important that the animals are well looked after and humanely killed, but they are there as food.

Your child up to you! As long as he is eating well and is healthy what's the problem, I do think when children are old enough to decide for themselves they should be aloud to but at 4 as long as you have explained to him in simple terms why you choose not to eat meat but some people do it shouldn't be a prob and def nothing to do with this rude obnoxious man

Jews don't eat meat? What a load of nonsense. They don't eat Pork products - big difference!
If your DC had been brought up in a Jewish home he would know the difference between a sausage and a piece of Kosha chicken.

I don't think anyone said Jews don't eat meat...

Can't face reading whole thread, just first and last pages. To me, it's obvious the issue isn't whether OP's son is vegetarian, but that as parents we NEVER criticise each other's parenting skills or values in front of children. There are lots of things other children's mums and dads do that wind me up - but I moan about it on Mumsnet, or occasionally take my life in my hands and speak direct to the parent when we're alone together. (This was the mummy who thought it was okay to chat on her mobile while driving my children to school). YANBU

What about people who bring their children up as vegans? Is that acceptable?

It is perfectly reasonable that people bring up their DCs on their own diet and beliefs but a 3 yr old will get all their beliefs from the parent. It is a nonsense to say 3 yr olds don't like eating animals, they won't like it if mummy says so, they will be quite happy if mummy thinks it is normal.
Later on they may come to the conclusion that we shouldn't eat animals and not wish to do so.
At 3/4 yrs they should be following you and other people should respect it. By 7/8/9yrs they will be making up their own mind and it isn't up to others to police it. An 8yr old is either clued up enough to say 'I don't eat sausages' or they are not bothered about keeping off them.

Of course it is acceptable to bring DCs up as vegans-as long as they understand nutrition and make sure they get what is missing from animal products.
It is exactly the same-by about 8yrs the DC may want to eat animal products when out. (you wouldn't expect the parent to produce them but they might well opt for the meat meal at school or a friend's house)
As a young DC they are merely the DC of a vegan-who knows what they will be when old enough to choose?

I wanted to add a bit about health....

I became veggie when I was 13, so that's 22 years ago (god, i'm old! )
I am a very healthy person, and always have been (no skiving for me :( )
I hadrly ever get ill, and I've never been anaemic.
the only time I've ever had a health issue with iron levels, was when I was refused to be allowed to donate blood because my iron level was low. when I say low, i mean it was 112 instead of 125 (that is the minimum level for women to donate). DH also got refused at the same time for low iron. (i've already mentioned that he's a meat-eater). It turned out that the only reason we could work out that we would have lower iron was because, over the winter, we'd started having a cup of tea with our lunch (to keep us warm). that was the only thing that had changed, and both of us had previously been long-term successful blood-donors.
So, my conclusion is, that my general diet is perfectly healthy, and it's silly little things like drinking tea before your body has absorbed its iron that make you less so - not being vegetarian.

and I would also like to add that I hardly ever eat meat substitutes - espcially Quorn, which is the devil's work (tastes and feels too much like meat for me to eat it without feeling hoodwinked)

exoticfruits speak for yourself/your own dc. I do know of children of meat-eating parents who have decided at a young age to become veggie. I used to get the Veg Society magazine and the youth section in there was full of letters about it from children as young as 7. My own dh declared himself veggie ('don't want to eat anything with a face') at the age of 5 to his 2 meat-eating parents, and that was in the '60s.

cant believe some of the madness on this thread!why on earth cant a child be veggie?!and hows it forcing the parents views on the child?a child from a meat eating family will eat meat,a child from a veggie one wont!
all mine were veggie.ds1 aged 10 has decided to eat meat.thats fine with me,he knows what it is and where it comes from.youngest child imo is too young at 5 to make that decision.(not that hes ever questioned it,he just eats same as the rest of us).

I did say from the age of 7yrs Lieins-if you read it.I am prepared to g

Sorry posted early. I am prepared to go as early as 5yrs, but I think a 3 yr old will parrot parents. If you follow that argument then you take it to its conclusion and let a DC of meat eating parents become a vegetarian at 5 yrs and vegetarians should let their DC eat meat at 5yrs if they wish.I prefer 8yrs as the deciding age for both.(I don't think there should be two rules, DCs can become vegetarians at 5yrs but they can't start eating meat).
8yrs seems fairer to me, unless they are very adamant one way or the other.

"What about people who bring their children up as vegans? Is that acceptable?"

Of course it is.

What an odd queston!

(i think it was rhetorical, DBF... )

Well first I don't think under-7s are likely to be reading the VegSoc magazine and writing letters in!
I don't think there should be two rules, DCs can become vegetarians at 5yrs but they can't start eating meat

...but that is entirely up to the individual parents! That is the point of this thread is it not?

If meat-eating parents decide they will allow their children to become veggie (and perhaps change the eating habits of the whole family in the process - this happens a lot) then that is up to them, whatever the age of the child. It may be morally much more difficult for veggie parents to allow meat-eating - it all depends on their reasons and their stance. Until the age when parents stop becoming the main providers of the food, they are going to be given the food the parents choose to give them in the home. There will be increasingly less control outside the home, as with any issue, as children get older.

LieIns - i think it was the parents about the 7yo....

Thanks, nicklebabe! :)

YANBU. I don't understand how this became a bunfight. FWIW my opinion is that this man didn't respect your parenting decisions and then proceeded to bad-mouth you within earshot. I think his reaction was ignorant and rude.

I'm not and never have been a vegetarian, although I have personal ethical food welfare standards which I try to abide by. I'm a bit freaked out by some of the anti-veggie comments on this thread though, seriously what's the big deal?

I don't understand why it is a big deal. Parents bring up their DCs with the diet they follow themselves. In time the DC will be out of the home on their own and they will decide for themselves.

I'm not quite sure why we are arguing about 5yr olds making up their minds.
I said that it was a nonsense that 3 yr olds wouldn't want to eat meat-they get it from the parent-if the same DC was with me from birth,knowing the lamb in the field is going to be on their plate, they wouldn't have a problem.
I was then told to speak for myself and that 5 yr old decided it for themselves, that they wouldn't eat anything with a face-which is fair enough-I can easily see them doing that at 5yrs, even if their parents eat meat. But I was then told it was up to parents-which was my point in thefirst place at 5yrs.

I would be prepared to let mine be vegetarian but they would have to wait until they were about 7yrs before I altered the cooking-they would have had to have had the view seriously for some time and they would have to realise that they were eating most vegetables and a lot of pulses. I would also go into milk production because if I was to be a vegetarian I would find a quick clean death far preferable to the suffering that takes place to get the daily pint. (I don't think that every vegetarian has the foggiest about milk production-they are too far removed from food production)

I wouldn't expect a vegetarian household to cook meat but I would expect them to let the DC eat meat when out and about in other homes.

They will choose for themselves in the end anyway. Leading by quiet example is better than policing-which is only OK when the young DC comes up against idiots forcing sausages.

catmint
"Yesterday was my first day on MN - is it always like this?"

Not always! AIBU is the most likely to end up in a bunfight as people tend to be more rude straight-talking here. Mumsnet is a big place though and there are plenty of less mental argumentative topics.

Please don't be put off, have a look around, just remember to don your hard hat before entering AIBU!

AIBU is generally quite straight talking! I wouldn't start a thread on it-you are setting yourself up for people to say YABU, very occasionally everyone agrees, but not often.

exotic, I am genuinely curious to know how someone can know what happens in the dairy industry, and still continue to get their daily pint?

more than a bit at the slanging match this topic has started CBA to read through all replies, some don't appear to be worth the waste of grey matter

but I just wanted to add as a foot note - BIOLOGICALLY we are OMNIVORES, that means we are equipped eat all food sources, in other words Biologically we have been given a CHOICE - for some some its a personal choice to eat meat & to bring up their kids as Carnivores as they see fit, for others its Vegetarian or Vegan & their personal Choice is Herbivore.

Why that should get up some peoples nose so much defies logic, when someone tells me they & their family eat meat, I don't automatically presume that they spend their lives scoffing Mucky Ds & fat & offal laden Sausages , nor do I feel it my right to tell them how unhealthy their diet is for their kids & what they should be feeding them instead - that is THIER personal choice.

Its ridiculous that some of the meat eaters on this thread think its okay to presume & do exactly that - its equally ridiculous for other vegetarian/pescetarian households to say that meat eaters smell

In most cases its a PERSONAL CHOICE or preference & either way should be respected as such

Hell if this was a thread about any other personal life choice, be that same sex relationships or whatever, you'd all be playing the very PC card & supporting that persons choice to live THEIR lives as THEY choose - yet on the choice of diet, it seems for a lot of you, its open season for insults, a slanging match & attack on peoples lifestyle choices - you SERIOUSLY need to have a word with yourselves