to be shocked by parents of some university students

[giraffesCantZumba]

My friend works in the graduation office, this time of year is really busy for her so been working weekends/long hours etc. She was venting to me about this and says she gets 3/4 parents a day phoning trying to sort out their childs graduation for them! ANd become totally outraged when told that it is confidential and they can only deal with the student. When do the apron strings get cut?!

Often its because student has totally missed the deadline for paying graduation fees and they are outraged as their poor dc had no idea.

I have just skimmed over the thread again mayslips and I honestly can't find much evidence of heartlessness wrt students who are genuinely unhappy/really struggling. I don't think it's fair to equate saying that students should negotiate their relationships with their universities themselves (other than in exceptional circs) with a callous 'sink or swim' attitude.

A big part of my job is to support students in the process of becoming autonomous adults - most arts and humanities lecturers would agree with that I think, because our subjects are so bound up with reflecting precisely on what it means to be a person in the world.

I think it depends what you mean by sink. When I went to uni - a long time ago - I remember one student who was obviously struggling with anorexia. Her parents came down to visit often and I wouldn't be surprised if they spoke to her tutors as well. She was sinking and needed help - although she was an adult.

However, not getting the forms back in time for the graduation ceremony, not doing essays because of laziness or not making it to lectures because you have a hangover, that isn't sinking. Young adults, like everyone else, need to learn from their own mistakes.

Hmm. I'm even in two minds about sinking. I had a bit of a bad time in my third year at university, in retrospect. But it never occurred to me to talk to my parents about it. I was a 21 year old adult, ffs. Which actually isn't a particularly young adult in any case.

And nor would any of my friends. At 21/22 you really aren't a child!

Well I 'm 46 and spoke to my Dad about a problem yesterday,I am a graduate with 2 professional qualifications 3 children a good marriage and a dog !I do not think there is something wrong with turning to my father in a time of crisis ,I do not think I am immature or have a personality defect.
.I hope that none of my children feel unable to turn to me at 21.I am not saying I would solve their problems but I would listen and support them in their own solution

I certainly haven't come across a sink or swim attitude in unis. The are numerous means of support available (formal and informal) and students are made aware of these. Tutors will IMO offer help to students they know are struggling, and point them at other routes of support. But the parental thing has got worse year on year according to dp who sometimes wonders who is interviewing who and who will actually turn up for the course on day one! And, yes, he has had parents phone him to say poor Johnny hasn't done his essay because of X and he politely points out it is up to poor johnny to make his excuses, not his mum!

Yes I had my own struggling/sinking experience when I went to university for the first time. Depression, anxiety, self-harm etc. The last people I would have wanted being involved were my parents. The main reason I went in the first place was to get some freedom from them! I would not have been happy about my tutors or doctor/counsellor speaking to them without my permission.

Of course you can still talk to your parents about problems when you grow up, as one adult to another. And they can talk to you about their problems. But I think it's important to make that initial break and learn to cope on your own, even when it's very difficult or means you fail at something. Otherwise you fail at becoming an adult, which is much worse than failing your first attempt at a degree.

I would class the anorexia as sinking, not the others.

I wouldn't say 21/22 is a child either but who has said that someone of that age is a child and that is why their parents should help? People need help sometimes regardless of age - and by that I don't mean parents calling to arrange graduation stuff. Just because I have disagreed with some things people have put on here does not mean I think it's OK for parents to sort out graduation problems! [Although, playing devil's advocate I'm not sure that is an example of parents arguing on their child's behalf, more one of parents trying desperately to get to go to a graduation ceremony for themselves. It's not as though their child won't get their degree if they miss the ceremony, but the parent will miss the hat and nice photo opportunity so I don't think it's their child they're looking after there, even if it's their child's fault it's happened!]

Anyway, who says you have to be a child to talk to your parents about something? That baffles me. I'm not under any illusions that my children are going to want to talk to me about many things, but (and this is the really important point for me) neither am I going to shrug my shoulders and say to myself that they must just be lazy, if they're struggling, or tell myself that they're adults ffs, and miss the fact that there could be something more serious going on.

some big charities have millions in the bank. Be wary

?

woodentop of course not
why is the liberating parent who encourages and instills independance in their childr somehow seen as less of a parent?

I bite my lip sometimes and control my hand from dialling my son at university

I love all my children immensly - as do we all on here I am sure - in a crisis I am here for them and would sacrifice myself for all of them. However - I would not be doing my parenting job correctly if i did not encourage them to fend for themselves and stand on their own two feet.

I think that any parent would support their DC, but there is a huge difference in that and wading in, taking over and sorting it for them.

Yes well I agree I would support them to solve problem not solve it for them.

My comments were in response to motherinferior saying that at 21 she would not have expected to bother her parents with a problem

I wasn't saying I wouldn't have bothered them. I'm saying it literally didn't occur to me to consult them. Wasn't any of their business.

I think that in families that function well, children ought to be able to consult their parents, and parents their children, about decisions to be taken, right through life. Which doesn't mean that you only have to consult your parents, of course. I am a huge believer in the power of discussion with many people in order to make informed (ie the best possible) decisions, taking all perspectives and participants into consideration.

I suppose there was one bloke who talked to his parents about wanting to leave our university (Oxford)...they came down to see him and told him to stay, and he then threw himself under a train.

Which is possibly irrelevant to the discussion and possibly not, in that some 21 year olds might have a better grasp of their best options than their parents. It's not as if parents actually see their adult offspring much at that age, surely?

I used to see a lot of my parents at that age - it was the golden era of our entente, if I am honest - all the time that coincided with me being an adult and them being adults in the real world. When they retired they retreated into their garden and being grandparents, in the nicest possible way, but the real concerns of adults don't affect them anymore and they have forgotten all about them!

It's like - and this is again relevant - the arguments for arranged marriage I've heard from friend/family (my mother is Indian): that 'parents know their children best'. I don't think we necessarily do - and in some areas that we by definition don't. So yes, I suppose if you have a genuinely good relationship with your relatives and they think so too, there will be discussions it is useful to have. But that is not an assumption one can make universally.

There are, indeed, some quite good arguments for arranged marriage. Though personally I think that no-one should be allowed to get married until they are at least 30 and have been self-supporting for a few years. And I think that there should be ante-marriage classes, a bit like ante-natal classes...

I don't think that parents necessarily know their DCs best. There are lots of cases where parents are very strong minded and DCs don't rebel, but quietly do their own thing and are actually quite a different person underneath. Anyway-by the time they are 18yrs you have to accept that although you can give your advice, and the benefit of your experience ,they don't have to take it and they know themselves best.

I haven't read the whole thread, but my mum did exactly this. I got a letter 3 days before my graduation (after the tickets, gowns etc were paid for) telling me I wouldn't be graduating. After many phone calls, in transpired there was some glitch on the university admin computer which meant that the two modules which made up my dissertation (joint honours) kept bumping the other off the records - they'd add the second one and the first would get bumped off, they'd re-add the first and the second one would come off. So their records constantly claimed that I wasn't eligable to graduate, even though I had passed both modules.

This necessitated lots of calls to the admin people, registry, head of one faculty, head of the other faculty to get them to sort it out. I, being 21 and about to graduate, was attending job interviews left, right and centre and didn't necessarily always have the time to chase the various people during their various office hours and co-ordindate any kind of effective rectification in 3 days. So yes, my mum did help out. Because the university cocked up and I didn't want to have to choose between going to job interviews or graduating. (And breathe).

Interesting thread. I agree with letting your 'children' find their wings when they go to Uni, and before then in varying degrees.

Mollycoddling and making a big thing about being a 'customer' (when you aren't) is not good parenting and isn't going to get your child thorough Uni. A poster further up said "Take my money, take my calls". That's ridiculous. If a parent pays money for their child to go to Uni, the money is basically paid on behalf of the 'child' who is the customer, not the parent. The parent chooses to pay, the money's not extorted by the university.

It is expensive to go to Uni now, everybody goes, that's why there must be funding in place - either from the student themselves or from the parent. A parent's money isn't essential, the student can fund their own place, but I guess the parent's money makes it easier for them.

I think sometimes the best students are the ones who have it more difficult, more obstacles in the way. They're the ones who work jolly hard to stay in the game and who will make it happen regardless. I think parents can choose to fund/part-fund their child's forray to Uni but if the child fails, or choose not to communicate with the parents when there's a problem, it's tough, no fault of the Uni and a lesson in growing up (hopefully).