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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

aibu to want this teacher to apologise to my son.

507 replies

wfrances · 04/07/2011 21:37

ds age 12 takes a packed lunch to school,during 2nd lesson he notices drink has leaked in his bag {all of it}his lunch is ruined,and now has no drink.
he tells his teacher who says "i dont care, its not my problem, sit down."
im fuming, he didnt eat all day,no drink and what a wicked way to respond to a child.
phoned head of year straight away ,who totally agreed with my reaction.
but i think she should apologise to him-what do you think?

OP posts:
saidthespiderwithahorridsmile · 04/07/2011 23:41

ps - teacher doesn't warrant its own capital letter, she's not the Queen

Jellykat · 04/07/2011 23:41

My DS has a specific member of staff as a mentor, to go to when he gets confused, or needs to discuss anything, would that help your DS?

Agree saidthespider My DS has severe Dyspraxia, but my county doesn't statement Dyspraxia...
Although his school recognises the Paed. cons. and the OT diagnosis, there is no funding for a TA for him - lack of statement, and school is in a different county from our home add.

TheFrogs · 04/07/2011 23:43

My ds would have been in absolute panic if that had happened to him at 12. His first thought would probably have been that he was going to get in trouble for ruined books so tell the teacher asap.

He wouldn't have any clue of where to get a meal from or who to ask. Wouldn't ever ask friends for a few quid or a sandwich either. I know for a fact he'd have sat in a corner of the dining room all lunch time doing nothing and then come home at the end of school distressed and pulling at his hair.

He can do very little on his own initiative, has to follow instructions and much of the time gets those wrong if they aren't worded in a way he understands, he takes everything literally. A situation like that would have confused him, no doubt about it.

perfectstorm · 04/07/2011 23:45

If your son wasn't SN I would think you were being grossly unreasonable. As he is, I think the teacher was tired and crabby and spoke to him in an unacceptable way, but she's human and I don't think chasing for an apology will do anyone any good. It's the end of the summer, she has people in other years sitting public exams, she's not had a true break for almost a year (the other holidays they have to do a lot of prep and marking) and someone being disruptive was probably more than she had patience for at that moment. We've all been there with our own kids, I think. She has 30 at once.

It may be me being a cynic, but 20 years ago my brother was in your son's shoes. He's on the autistic spectrum. He should have bloody well been statemented and I am convinced money was why he wasn't. Nowadays I wonder about OFSTED releasing the numbers of statemented kids on their reports as well - seems a disincentive for schools to do that on financial and reputation grounds.

I don't know if all the above is rubbish, so if I were you, I'd go and post on the SN section of the site and see if they can offer experienced advice. But my wholly inexpert opinion on this is that he needs/deserves the support a statement would obligate the school to provide. That would mean subject teachers weren't frustrated and taking it out on him.

cherrysodalover · 04/07/2011 23:47

Pretty normal response in secondary school I would say......it isn't actually her problem abd by this time of the year your son should know who to go to rather than raising it with a subject teacher who is trying to get on with their lesson........most of my colleagues used to get really annoyed with the year 7s who arrived with the baby mentality as it was called......thinking subject teachers are like primary teachers, there to resolves such issues. I would have taken a different approach but envied my harder colleagues who were not there 15 mins after the lunch bell dealing with such stuff.
She didn't say anything wrong to be honest- maybe not your approach but this is how sec school is. Far worse will be said as he moves through the school.

Original poster
wfrances · 04/07/2011 23:48

for those who think im going over the top ,i do have 3 other children who i let fight their own corner and i stand well back.
but this child is different and has been since birth,...they wanted him in a mainstreamschool but hes not mainstream ,i have to make allowances in my home for him and i had hoped comprehensive school would too but his psychologist did warn me that it may be too regimented for him even though hes very bright.
for all those corncerned about the teachers time and other pupils i have normal children too and would rather them have a empathic teacher and 2 mins less lesson .

OP posts:
worraliberty · 04/07/2011 23:49

Some Teachers are short with pupils when trying to keep control of a class.

Not all Teachers are super human and at times I'm sure they simply tell the kids to sit down and get on with it.

Just imagine if she'd had more than one child standing up faffing about with their belongings.

In an ideal world that wouldn't happen but we're not really living in an ideal world as the OP's son will have to eventually learn.

ScarlettIsWalking · 04/07/2011 23:52

What are his goals set out to gain more Independance. A child of 12 that needs to be escorted everywhere and cannot process language sounds like profound and quite complex sn to me. I was a ta to a child on the autistic spectrum not high func. who would have been able to cope well with the scenario you describe.

Forgive me if I haven't understood I am v tired typing this but did you say he was not statemented?

ilovesooty · 04/07/2011 23:55

for all those corncerned about the teachers time and other pupils i have normal children too and would rather them have a empathic teacher and 2 mins less lesson

You might feel that but other parents might not. I don't see what's unempathic about expecting him not to disrupt a lesson or wait until break. And if another class were hanging around in a classroom unsupervised there might have been an accident for which the teacher would undoubtedly be held responsible.

fit2drop · 04/07/2011 23:55

will watch this thread with interest.
I work with people with mental health problems, a lot are dual needs with a LD as well as poor or enduring MH issues. Some of the clients have dyspraxia , autism, aspergers and various other SN.

Slightly different I suppose as the primary need to fit the criteria for my workplace is MH. Obviously the people I work with have left school and all are in need of varying degrees of support.

What is becoming blatently obvious to me in this thread is the total lack of support for teachers who have to not only provide a 'service 'to the class but can also be struggling with a child or children within that class who needs extra support.

My apologies if my posts came across as harsh, however I still feel that we need to teach independance as far as possible to help people with SN deal with the real world. I appreciate its not always going to happen , but just because a child has SN does not mean we cannot try and move them onto a more fullfilling and independant life. Some will succeed , some won't.. but treating them different to their peers will only isolate them more surely.

The teacher was not in the wrong IF he disrupted her class. What appears to be the problem here is the lack of proper support for the boy and for the teacher.

cat64 · 04/07/2011 23:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Original poster
wfrances · 04/07/2011 23:57

no he has autistic traits,and lots of other things
he doesnt have to be escorted everywhere ,just told where to go.

OP posts:
Original poster
wfrances · 05/07/2011 00:00

who said he disrupted the lesson???
since when is some one saying ,"oh ,my drink has tipped inside my bag"
disruptive.

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Original poster
wfrances · 05/07/2011 00:05

i agree jellkat ,he needs buddy/mentor. were going to the school tomorrow to sort it out,

OP posts:
ravenAK · 05/07/2011 00:08

You could try sending drinks in individual cartons.

Seriously, the teacher was obviously rather abrupt, but it doesn't merit this level of chest-beating.

Jellykat · 05/07/2011 00:08

All the teacher had to do was instruct him who to see at breaktime..
I don't think that's too much to ask wfrances.

Excellent,re. mentor - make sure it's not a part timer, and your DS is SHOWN where and who they are, and they have a chat with him tomorrow.

Good luck.

fit2drop · 05/07/2011 00:08

I said "IF" he disrupted, not that he did. Trying to understand why the teacher reacted the way you say she did.
Having said that, you got your info from a boy who struggles with communication .So who really knows what happened.
I appreciate your concern and need to protect your son but to ask for an apology when in fairness you have no proper idea what happened is a bit silly and also comes across as being over protective and frankly as if you think that because your boy has SN he cannot possibly be naughty or get it wrong. Your unwillingness to at least try and see it from the teachers side shows someone who is in fact not ever going to accept her boy can do wrong.

worraliberty · 05/07/2011 00:09

He had to be told to sit down, therefore that would be considered disruptive I would imagine.

It's natural for you to see this from your son's POV only I suppose, but you have to remember he's not the only child in the class/school.

For example, expecting the Teacher to take him to the HOY is totally unreasonable as she does have other pupils to teach.

TheFrogs · 05/07/2011 00:10

My ds would have just needed to be told he could quietly empty his books out...but he would need to be told that or he'd spend the whole lesson quietly distressed. Then perhaps after the bell had gone just a "oh you need to see so and so in room blah blah about dinner" from the teacher. I dont think that's asking too much when they know his problems, I honestly dont.

perfectstorm · 05/07/2011 00:11

You said she told him to sit down. Standing up in the middle of a class and announcing something that upset him is totally understandable and natural in your son, but wouldn't be in a non-SN 12 year old. It's disruptive, because it's not pertaining to the lesson, and she had to break off from teaching to address it. Did you ask him what the class were engaged in at the time? I mean if he went over to her quietly while they were doing group work I agree she's being a cow, but if she was explaining something to the whole class then that's another kettle of fish.

The real issue here isn't the teacher, I don't think, it's using mainstream inclusion without a statement as a way to wriggle out of providing the support he needs. Again I am not an expert and I will stand down if a SN parent corrects me, but I think this is grossly unfair of the school. He needs more than they are offering and he needs gentler handling than a pressed for time teacher is likely to have to spare.

fit2drop · 05/07/2011 00:15

thefrogs

no its not too much to ask, but she may well have done that. OP has said that her son has a language problem and difficulty understanding. I think with that in mind it is fair to say the boys account of events will be "not quite as happened".

I am not saying he is lying before I get slated just that he could have misread the whole situation purely because he would have been distressed about the leakage of his drink anyway , so already his thinking would be going a bit haywire for want of a better word

fit2drop · 05/07/2011 00:17

nods at perfectstorms post

absolutely

perfectstorm · 05/07/2011 00:18

BTW I do understand that some teachers are vile. My brother once took all his clothes off for PE but didn't change into his kit because they were simply told to undress and come into the hall, and the teacher did nothing when everyone laughed at him. She passively encouraged it, in fact. He was only 5. But an assumption that a teacher is malevolent in intent won't help him. Trying to get her on side will. You don't know her reasoning or what was happening with her - she could just have felt really unwell (teachers have to be dying before they go off sick, mostly). A siege mentality will exhaust you and distress him, you know? And flies and vinegar spring to mind. She's a lot less likely to want to go out of her way if you make a huge fuss than she is if you gently try to educate her.

Original poster
wfrances · 05/07/2011 00:19

worraliberty - he comes into class puts his bag on the table ,unzips it (standing up) notices mess.hes right by teachers table and says to her ,his drink has leaked all over his stuff, i know this because i asked him to show me what happened.he is not disruptive.
well appart from some good advice about a mentor/buddy youve not swayed me ,i think she was unreasonable .but thanks for your thoughts.

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Original poster
wfrances · 05/07/2011 00:22

fittodrop -its not that sort of language problem,he knows what your saying.

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